Arkk's Weight Lifting Thread

[Dr. Funkenstein]

Originally Posted by arkk123

Advice to OP: Ignore this moron
Advice to you: Stop reading Muscle & Fitness and the P90x instruction manual.

Your advice sucks dick.

edit: Don't do any routine for more than 3 or 4 weeks? What are you going to accomplish in a month? What happens at the end of 4 weeks if you are still progressing strength wise? Why the hell would you stop progress if it isn't stalling?

The whole craze in the fitness community of muscle confusion that was brought to the mainstream by P90x and is actually 40 years old is stupifying. You aren't going to do squats and your body is going to react in essence by saying "Oh no here comes squats again, I refuse to grow, ahhhhhhh!! You must do something else, I know what is coming!!". Your body doesn't know what a squat is.

You are generalizing a deep issue such as strength progression and by doing so you are making it known that you have no idea what you are talking about. Powerlifters could spend 6 months putting 15lbs on their bench. Your advice for them is "HAY GUYZ JUST DO YOGA, 3 WEEKZ AND U NEED TO TAYK A BRAKE!!!"

Way to foster a discussion gym guy. Guess there's another forum on this stupid site I won't bother participating in. Yeah...I know you don't want me here anyway.

The guy who has plateaued at 135lbs in his bench press really needs to do something different because brute force benching isn't doing it for him. The guy who has plateaued at 335lbs. knows his body well enough to not really need advice on a video game message board.

No advice fits for everyone. If you've stalled, do something different. Most people who don't lift weights for a living (or as a primary hobby) will stall every 3 to 4 weeks when first starting out, so mixing it up is usually good advice.

But you know best, so I'll just ignore this board so no one has to ignore me.

Quick note: I completely understand where you're coming from after reading about P90X. In fact, what I was describing is pretty damn close to what that workout system does. I'm a habitual person and staying regimented in anything I do is important for me to stick with it. My 1 week off from lifting every 3 weeks is more about ensuring I get fully recuperated at some point in my routine. Since I'm a rigid person, I need a rigid workout, but rigidity isn't good when you're talking about building muscle. Muscles need overload and recuperation. If they don't get both, they don't build. No overload and the muscles have no reason to build. Not enough recuperation and the muscles don't have the ability. Overload is easy. It's what everyone does. Recuperation is hard because it's not always the same even for the same person. A day, or even a week, off is often more beneficial than pushing harder. Pushing harder will just push that recupe time further back, making the next workout just as worthless as the last. So time off is often good.

Sorry to bring bad advice into your house. I'll delete my post so as not to confuse more people with the things that work for me.

[arkk123]

Originally Posted by Dr. Funkenstein

Way to foster a discussion gym guy. Guess there's another forum on this stupid site I won't bother participating in. Yeah...I know you don't want me here anyway.

The guy who has plateaued at 135lbs in his bench press really needs to do something different because brute force benching isn't doing it for him. The guy who has plateaued at 335lbs. knows his body well enough to not really need advice on a video game message board.

No advice fits for everyone. If you've stalled, do something different. Most people who don't lift weights for a living (or as a primary hobby) will stall every 3 to 4 weeks when first starting out, so mixing it up is usually good advice.

But you know best, so I'll just ignore this board so no one has to ignore me.

Quick note: I completely understand where you're coming from after reading about P90X. In fact, what I was describing is pretty damn close to what that workout system does. I'm a habitual person and staying regimented in anything I do is important for me to stick with it. My 1 week off from lifting every 3 weeks is more about ensuring I get fully recuperated at some point in my routine. Since I'm a rigid person, I need a rigid workout, but rigidity isn't good when you're talking about building muscle. Muscles need overload and recuperation. If they don't get both, they don't build. No overload and the muscles have no reason to build. Not enough recuperation and the muscles don't have the ability. Overload is easy. It's what everyone does. Recuperation is hard because it's not always the same even for the same person. A day, or even a week, off is often more beneficial than pushing harder. Pushing harder will just push that recupe time further back, making the next workout just as worthless as the last. So time off is often good.

Sorry to bring bad advice into your house. I'll delete my post so as not to confuse more people with the things that work for me.

The guy who plateaued at 135 says that he is 160lbs and 15-20% bodyfat, he is obviously a beginner and because he really knows very little about what he is doing. Not to knock him, but he obviously is no gym rat and his dedication is probably a lot lower than the average gym goer. It is no science to get a man past a 135 bench.

The guy who is at a 335 bench example means jack shit. There were fat kids in my high school that could bench 300lbs at 17. I know people who bench 315 for reps or 400+ for a single and know NOTHING about what they are doing. I know bouncers who don't even lift that have benched in the mid 300s while dicking around. They may have their own method, but there is zero rhyme or reason to it.

I don't have to worry about sounding like an asshole since everyone thinks I am one as it is. No, I don't really need to foster a discussion. There is a lot of widely accepted, cut-and-dry information regarding weight training. I don't speak on things I don't know anything about. I'm not over in the politics threads spouting shit. There are PLENTY of people on the board who post on topics like this that know their shit. You aren't one of them.

Most people will stall every 3-4 weeks when they are beginners? Are you out of your mind? I know who have gone close to a year without hitting a wall on any big lift when they were beginners. The surge of progress you get as a beginner is unlike anything you ever experience in your life again. That is a completely asinine statement. If anything they stall the more advanced they become. As time goes on, gains are harder and harder to come by. You taking 1 week off every 3 weeks is completely retarded shit. Effective periodization will have anyone going balls to the wall for anywhere from 8 weeks to 6 months, sometimes even way longer depending on how well they know their body, and then taking a short break of 5-14 days. You can't possibly stress your CNS to a degree where a 1 week break is needed every 3 weeks. Absolute horse shit.

There is PLENTY of generic advice that fits for everyone. He wasn't asking for crazy detailed advice or a prognosis on how we thought he'd progress in 3 months time frame or something. He was asking for advice that anyone who knows even a tiny bit about weight training should know.

[Cathan]

I've always tried to do a bit of variety in my workout but I always do the core exercises like bench for chest and then I'll vary all the other chest exercises each week. I usually change my chest workout someway every week even on the flat bench. If I go in there every week trying to bench say 285 I stall pretty quck it seems, but if I go 275, 285, 295, a light week then a 300+ week I still get sore and the next time I go back to 275 to 295 I'm pushing it easier. That works for me anyway.

I got pretty close to maxing, 335x2 last Monday, tried on Friday but 335 came up super, super slow and I felt my chest was still sore as hell so I waited til Monday this week to try again. Same thing, I'm still sore and 315 went up slow so I just did my buddy's workout and I'm takin the rest of the week off. I've got 2 more months to build and see where I get. I've been working pretty hard for 3 months or so and at 80% + of my max for the last 5 weeks I guess, time for a break...

[arkk123]

Originally Posted by Cathan

I've always tried to do a bit of variety in my workout but I always do the core exercises like bench for chest and then I'll vary all the other chest exercises each week. I usually change my chest workout someway every week even on the flat bench. If I go in there every week trying to bench say 285 I stall pretty quck it seems, but if I go 275, 285, 295, a light week then a 300+ week I still get sore and the next time I go back to 275 to 295 I'm pushing it easier. That works for me anyway.

I got pretty close to maxing, 335x2 last Monday, tried on Friday but 335 came up super, super slow and I felt my chest was still sore as hell so I waited til Monday this week to try again. Same thing, I'm still sore and 315 went up slow so I just did my buddy's workout and I'm takin the rest of the week off. I've got 2 more months to build and see where I get. I've been working pretty hard for 3 months or so and at 80% + of my max for the last 5 weeks I guess, time for a break...

When you are focusing on strength there is really no reason whatsoever to back off on the weight and do a "light week"...during the process that is, I don't mean once you stall.

Also, people who are trying to increase their max don't do singles/doubles every week, and it looks like you are benching two times a week?

If someone hit the wall at 335 in 5x5 for example, they'd do something like take a week off or do just a light workout, and then start over at 295 and increase the weight by 10lbs every week til they can't get 5x5, and then do 5x3 until they stall, and then break and repeat, or possibly even go lower. The weight increases can also be 5lbs at the end of things depending on how well you know yourself. This always freaks people out but it is all about steady progression. If at the end of things you ended up at 365 for 5x5, that is a fucking huge increase.

It honestly seems like there is no rhyme or reason to what you are doing. You aren't going to be able to just go in the gym every week and load the bar with weight with no plan to what you are doing and increase your bench. It's pointless.

[Cathan]

I'll try it your way for a while and see how it goes. 5x5s starting at 285. If I get those easy I'll do a bunch of supplementary work and see how 5x5s at 295 feels next week.

[PapaShlapa]

The way I've been doing it is trying to get a 5lb or 1rep PR every week through any rep range. So one week I might get 1x280. Next week maybe 3x265, or 5x255, or 3x3x260, or 3x5x245. Depending on how I'm feeling the next week I'll try to break any 1 PR, cycling through different rep ranges on the same movement every week. So it'd look something like this.

Week 1 - 1x275
Week 2 - 3x255
Week 3 - 3x260
Week 4 - 5x255
Week 5 - 1x280
Week 6 - 5x5x245
Week 7 - 3x3x265
Week 8 - 3x275
Week 9 - 5x260
Week 10 - 1x290

etc etc

I find if I bang away at the same rep range every week I can't move forward every week, so this allows me to kinda move forward in smaller increments, because any given rep range is only moving forward every few weeks or so, but I'm making progress somewhere every week. Every once in a while if I'm feeling particularly beat up, I'll take it easy one week, dropping poundages down about 30-50% but doing the same volume.

I use this method on Squat/Bench/Dead almost exclusively. With lighter movements, I find I can make more linear progress.

[PapaShlapa]

Video'd my benching today. Got up to 1x290(10lb PR). My phone kept freezing or something so I didn't get anything from 245, 265 or 290. However, after the 290 I did another single at 265 just so I could have something heavy to analyze. Here it is. Sorry about the shitty quality, it's a cell phone. 2 notes. First, it did touch my chest but poor quality and bad angle make it hard to tell. Second, it kinda looks like my butt is off the bench but it's planted the whole time. That's never been a problem I've had.

Notes for my own technique improvement. I think I need to tuck the elbows a little more. Bringing my grip in slightly should make that easier. My bar path doesn't look ideal, but it's a shitty vid so kinda hard to analyze.

edit: forgot vid lol

[arkk123]

Tenks is that you?

[PapaShlapa]

Originally Posted by arkk123

Tenks is that you?

I'm happy to accept criticism, but do you have anything specific you could say?

[arkk123]

Originally Posted by PapaShlapa

I'm happy to accept criticism, but do you have anything specific you could say?

I was joking, coulda swore you mentioned somewhere you were planning on posting a video and you said something about Tenks.

edit: yep

Originally Posted by PapaShlapa

I deadlifted 515 today from about 2" below the knees. Still making progress. Hoping for a 300lb bench before the new year. At 280 now. Might take a video and post it just for tenks' sake. Assuming I can figure out how to get it from my phone to here.

[arkk123]

Is arching your back that much comfortable for you? You are probably taking a little out of the press strength wise because you are putting more stress on your chest like that. Having an arch in your back is good but that is like springboard or something. The press itself is fine.

[PapaShlapa]

Ah. I thought you were trying to compare my bench to tenks', lol. While you're here, any thoughts on ways I can improve my technique?

[arkk123]

Originally Posted by PapaShlapa

Ah. I thought you were trying to compare my bench to tenks', lol. While you're here, any thoughts on ways I can improve my technique?

above ur post

[PapaShlapa]

Originally Posted by arkk123

Is arching your back that much comfortable for you? You are probably taking a little out of the press strength wise because you are putting more stress on your chest like that. Having an arch in your back is good but that is like springboard or something. The press itself is fine.

I wouldn't say it's comfortable, but the springboard is kinda what I'm looking for. Just something I've read a lot about from PLers etc. Heavy arch, tuck hard, row the bar low, squeeze scapula together, when you go to press out of the hole you get more spring from the lats firing. Also shortens the ROM. I've always read and heard you need to be ultra tight all over to really press big weights, like whole body rock solid. That's something I struggle with, as you can see I fidget as I unrack and settle with the bar. I'm certain I'm not doing everything right, but I posted the video up on another forum for a raw powerlifter that helps newbs like me to critique. I'm sure he'll find plenty for me to fix.

[arkk123]

Originally Posted by PapaShlapa

I wouldn't say it's comfortable, but the springboard is kinda what I'm looking for. Just something I've read a lot about from PLers etc. Heavy arch, tuck hard, row the bar low, squeeze scapula together, when you go to press out of the hole you get more spring from the lats firing. Also shortens the ROM. I've always read and heard you need to be ultra tight all over to really press big weights, like whole body rock solid. That's something I struggle with, as you can see I fidget as I unrack and settle with the bar. I'm certain I'm not doing everything right, but I posted the video up on another forum for a raw powerlifter that helps newbs like me to critique. I'm sure he'll find plenty for me to fix.

Most powerlifters who do shit like that are usually all geared up. Belt, suit, wraps, etc. Everything stays tight no matter what they do.

The form is fine, little tweaks to form aren't going to increase your bench to any significant degree. You aren't doing anything massively wrong where a correction would add weight. I probably wouldn't arch like that since you aren't even wearing a belt.

I never added variables or extra steps to form that aren't necessary. Like how people put their feet on the bench, or arch greatly like that. I just lay flat on the bench, spread my feet wide, arch a little to help pull my shoulders back and do it. Arching severely liek that makes me feel uneasy.