Marion Jones admits to using drugs

[Pinchandroll]

I was under the impression that anabolic steroids don't necessarily "degrade" or "weaken" connective tissue (mainly tendons, I suppose, since ligaments are bone-bone connections and should be less affected by muscle growth). Instead, the tendons are stressed by the increased muscle mass causing more and more tension.

So, steroids shouldn't weaken your tendons unless you neglect stretching or use steroids to gain unnatural amounts of muscle mass to the point that your tendons can't keep up. Obviously case 2 is probably where lots of pro athlete users end up so that's why we see joint injuries, but I just wanted to clear up that steroids directly affect connective tissue. However, if I'm wrong feel free to correct me; I'm at the very beginning of my anatomy / physiology course so these things interest me!

[Lyrical]

Originally Posted by Burkex

I have a question: Can NFL players work out like crazy in the offseason and do roids,HGH, etc and then stop right before the NFL preseason starts and pass all the drug tests? This way they get all the huge muscle gains in the offseason and can just lift to maintain it in the regular season and by the time the preseason starts the substance will not be in their urine anymore. Basically how long do these substances stay in the body and are catchable by testing?

Correct. I know a bit about 'roids because I had frat brothers that took them. We all worked out together. Anyway, a smart person will take a cycle of 'roids for eight weeks, and then get off of them. A frat brother of mine took a ton of roids (by a ton, I mean like four or five at once, and like 20 times the normal dosage). He gained about 30 pounds in eight weeks. If he was smart, he would take some time off to let his body recuperate, and then do another cycle. So maybe he gains 30 pounds, goes off the roids, and loses 10 pounds, so he has a net gain of 20. So a football player could conceivably hit two cycles during the offseason, gain some muscle and power (while keeping 65% of it) and then still test clean. When you go off 'roids, you are going to lose some of your gains, but how much you lose depends on how long you were on your cycle, and how good your training and nutrition is.

In my brother's case, he went from 150 before his first cycle, to 180 or 185 in his second. He never stopped cycling them, and took roids for eight months straight. Each additional cycle only netted him five incremental pounds. He got up to almost 200 pounds (from his scrawny 150), gaining almost 50 pounds of muscle. The problem was that since he didn't cycle off them, he ruined his body's ability to naturally make testosterone. When he went off, his body wouldn't kick start (even though he took drugs to get his balls working again), and he ended up losing more muscle than he gained. He ended up at like 145, since he body was producing less testosterone than an 80 year old grammas.

Looking back on it, we had our own little human laboratory where we conducted our own unethical and illegal experiments. I don't know if its because we were all in college and learning, but since then, I have never seen people be so open about what they were taking. Nowdays, I am so busy with rl, I just go in and workout and don't even talk to anyone any more. I can't tell you one person's name at the gym. Get in, work out and get out is the motto. But I have to assume that everyone is still loading up on the roids. If you are talkative enough in the gym, people will starting telling you what cc's they take.

[Lyrical]

As far as connective tissue goes, I can attest to how that goes also. It seemed like everyone in my college gym was on them, and wasn't shy about the side-effects. Roids don't weaken your joints, but they don't help them either. What happens is that some pencil neck geek says he wants to get big, and goes out and buys 30 times the recommended dosage. So his muscle grows much faster than it should. Let's say he adds 150 on his bench press in five weeks. The muscle can handle the strain, but the joints are still the old ones that could bench the old weight. They haven't gotten that much stronger (and there is no reason to, roids don't strenghten the joints). Many of the guys in the old gym would complain about their knees, shoulders or elbows. I would tell them to slow down on the roids, until their joints got strong enough to handle the weights. But the problem is that these guys didn't listen - getting big was all that mattered.

It was kind of fun watching these idiots take these drugs. A few of the gym rats were pre-med, so I would talk to them about what they were observing. The common theme was that they said that they guys who were roiding were taking too many unecessary risks. They didn't do research. They bought drugs that had a ton of bad side effects, when they could have bought drugs with the same efficacy. There were a few cases where the guys had grown female breasts (called gynecomnastia). They took 20 or 30 times the dosage recommended. They took roids that you would give horses that were used in horse races (and not tested on humans). And when my friends that were pre-med tried to tell them that they could do things to be safer, they were too busy trying to run off to do another set instead of listening.

Making roids illegal in this country made it a ton more unsafe. If you worked out in the 80's (I am an old fart), the guys monitored what they put in their bodies alot closer. The thing that bothers me most about roids is that taken in the recommended dosages, they have the side effects as taking two aspirin (pretty trivial). But no one wants to take the minimum. I literally saw people in many sports (bodybuilding, powerlifting or football) that could get two or three years of hard work condensed down to an eight week cycle. They could get there slower and safer, but for their short-sightedness.

And one thing that I think should never be legal is for anyone under the age of 22, or females to take it. Roids mess up your sexual organs when they are still developing. Males under the age of 22 may find that they are sterile or that they have permanently lowered their ability to make testosterone (so they may have to take roids the rest of their life just to be normal).

And females gain a ton of problems that are permanent from taking all that extra male testosterone. I could post pictures, but it so sad to see some of the females that will never again be truly female just from a taking a few cycles of roids. They get permanently deep voices (bass), grow beirds, can go sterile, and can mess up their privates. In many cases, their clitorisis grow to the size of a flaccid male penis, and guess what? Its permanent.

[Lyrical]

Originally Posted by Pinchandroll

I was under the impression that anabolic steroids don't necessarily "degrade" or "weaken" connective tissue (mainly tendons, I suppose, since ligaments are bone-bone connections and should be less affected by muscle growth). Instead, the tendons are stressed by the increased muscle mass causing more and more tension.

So, steroids shouldn't weaken your tendons unless you neglect stretching or use steroids to gain unnatural amounts of muscle mass to the point that your tendons can't keep up. Obviously case 2 is probably where lots of pro athlete users end up so that's why we see joint injuries, but I just wanted to clear up that steroids directly affect connective tissue. However, if I'm wrong feel free to correct me; I'm at the very beginning of my anatomy / physiology course so these things interest me!

From observation in the gym, when a guy adds 30 to 50% to their poundages in a few weeks, your comment is correct. It also happens when you get a normal guy who isn't working out go out and buy every roid under the sun, and start working out all of the sudden. This happens more than you would think. Not only is this guy increasing his poundages at an exponential rate, but since he hasn't been working out, he uses incorrect technique (so it even damages his joints some more).

P.S.: I apologize for typos/grammar, but I just had my pupils dilated and am having probs reading the screen.

[arkk91]

Lyrical is basically right with everything. But if I can be a dick for a second, your brother, or anyone, had no business using steroids at 150lbs. A general rule of thumb is that no one should do steroids until they have exhausted or are damn near close to their natural genetic potential. Jerkoffs like that and the people you described are why steroids have a bad rap because they do things irresponsibly and fuck themselves up.

"My uncle had a series steroid shots (not the same kind we're talking about here, but similar) to help with inflammation in his ankle from an old injury. The doctor over-dosed him and it ended up degrading his achilles tendon. He was walking up a flight of stairs when it ruptured entirely, allowing his calf muscle to contract up to the base of his knee. No fun at all."

That is corticosteroids, like cortisone. Totally diff. Cortisone is catabolic, anabolic/androgenic steroids are _______.

Also, some steroids do help joints. Deca and Winstrol are two of them. Deca is a ridiculously potent anti-inflammatory while Winstrol has been shown to help bolster connective tissue.

Alot of steroids used were never meant for human use, they are vet drugs.

[Lyrical]

Originally Posted by arkk91

Also, some steroids do help joints. Deca and Winstrol are two of them. Deca is a ridiculously potent anti-inflammatory while Winstrol has been shown to help bolster connective tissue.

I didn't know that - but then again its been over ten years since college. I am not sure how new that research is.

[arkk91]

Originally Posted by Lyrical

I didn't know that - but then again its been over ten years since college. I am not sure how new that research is.

I wouldn't really say that anything regarding AAS is "research", since nothing but things used for Hormone Replacement Therapy dosages would ever be prescribed to someone, lol. But yeah, the Winstrol thing is not as noticeable but Deca is like WD40 for your joints.