Your thoughts on Kobe

[Laven]

Well I dont know too much about him and the Jerry West thing but I hear he wants out of LA, he got what he wanted when Shaq went to the Heats but now he is crying because he isnt getting any championships. I hope no team takes him but thats very doubtful, he is a amazing player no doubt but he likes to be his own 1 man team and unless he goes to a playoff worthy team he isnt going to get the attention he seems to want but also wants another ring. But what playoff worthy team would he fit in good with? If Portland does land Oden do you think Oden + Bryant = playoffs?

[Jadaki]

Kobe + 4 scrubs = playoffs.

If the Lakers trade him, they sure as hell are not trading him to a team in the West, so I would stop envisioning some Oden/Kobe hook up. Not to mention with all the league rules about trading with salary caps etc it would be extremely hard for the Lakers to move Kobe and get anything close to equal value in return.

Since Kobe would want to go to a contender the only team in the East they might have a legit trading possibility with is the Bulls, and I don't see them giving up Deng/Gordon for Kobe.

[Akileese]

Ok, this is moot. They're NOT trading him. He puts asses in the seats. They could go 40 games under .500, and people would still show up just to see him. It's just how it is. Also, Kobe's contract, while huge, isn't terrible. It's a very tradeable contract. Also, every team takes terrible guys in what are called "expiring contracts". They pick up these guys merely to trade them to even out the salary cap. This is merely an example, but if the Pau Gasol trade happened with the Bulls, they would of sent Deng and a slew of other guys, but they'd use PJ Brown's god awful contract to make it work.

So, it's not hard to make salaries work, but the trade won't happen simply because of what he's worth from a marketing perspective.

[joz123]

Change the name of the team to the LA Kobes and all is well.

[Iadien]

He had no help at all and they made the playoffs. The Lakers had chances to get several guys to help Kobe but they never did. Baron Davis and Carlos Boozer are the two I can think of at the moment.

[PatrickStar]

The NBA is the hardest of the major sports leagues to build a winner. It's not like you can make a major haul in a draft (NFL) or develop talent in the minor leagues (MLB/NHL). There are two ways to do it. Big time free agent signing or the draft.

Its the one sport where you really gotta suck to get better. There are no quick fixes. The cap and guaranteed contracts literally force teams to blow it up and get a high lottery pick or get damn lucky with a guy in the late first round.

The Lakers are in the worst place possible. They aren't good enough to compete and they aren't bad enough to land a top pick. Kobe is stuck.

[Zeste]

Yeah Kobe isn't going anywhere for a long time. He's just being a baby.

I was watching ESPN last night and they were talking about Jerry West coming back to LA, and as the guy was talking about it, the producer handed him a slip of paper quoting Jerry West saying he will NEVER come back to LA or any other team.

So Kobe is pretty much stuck. Good. I'd hate to see him go to a decent team and that team start winning championships. As long as he is in LA, Kobe will forever be a "didn't he used to win" guy. And that's how I hope he ends his career.

[Akileese]

Bill Simmons responded to the rumor of Kobe to the Bulls for Gordon/Deng/filler..it may sound familiar.

Doug (Darien, IL): Heard an interesting rumor on Mike and Mike. Kobe to the Bulls for Gordon and Deng. Would this be a good trade for the Bulls?

SportsNation Bill Simmons: (1:25 PM ET ) Look, the Lakers are NEVER trading Kobe. They command too much money for tickets - he's the reason why. They're not selling $350 tickets for Deng and Gordon. He's not going anywhere. Although I'm glad he finally spoke up against Mitch Kupchak, who's been particularly incompetent.

Timestamped to prove I didn't steal it from him, but yeah, its pretty much set in stone. They won't trade him.

[Jadaki]

Originally Posted by Zeste

I was watching ESPN last night and they were talking about Jerry West coming back to LA, and as the guy was talking about it, the producer handed him a slip of paper quoting Jerry West saying he will NEVER come back to LA or any other team.

West released a statement saying that he was loyal to the Grizzles owner through the end of his contract but considered himself a lifelong Laker and would consider anything the Lakers offered.

[Jovec]

Kobe has his issues but the real problem is Kupchak. Shaq and Kobe are both to blame for everything that lead to the Shaq trade, but the main issue is the Shaq trade itself. Essentially, the Lakers traded Shaq for fucking Lamar Odom. The other two yahoos (Caron Butler and 38 yro Brian Grant?) who came from Miami don't play for LA anymore, they didn't get any top draft picks, etc.

I realize you won't ever get real value for Shaq (in his prime) but the Lakers got nothing - maybe 25 cents on the dollar for him. Buss, Jackson, and Kupchak should have bitch slapped both Kobe and Shaq to the bench for an entire season if they had to in order to get them to play nice together. FFS, they had two of the best 5, in not best 3 players in the game at the time, on the same team.

Lakers need to suck it up and include Bynum and trade for a big name front court player (KG needs to get out of Minnesota before he slits his wrists). He might be amazing in the future, but Bynum has 1-2 years left to improve, followed by maybe 2-3 years of title contention, before Kobe starts declines too much.

Luke Walton is actually improving, so we are good there. And speaking of white guys, the Lakers should have never traded Mark Madsen.

Kwame Brown is never going to improve (his consistency, he shows flashes of talent), either due to lack of will or MJ crushing his confidence. Smoosh Parker has been an absolute bust - hell, he went for 9 points in 59 mins during the PHX series loss. These two guys wouldn't start on half the teams in the league.

And to end my rant, have the Lakers had a top three draft pick in the last 25 years?

[Sunder]

Kobe is getting exactly what he deserves for forcing the Laker front office to choose between him and Shaq. Sure Shaq is partially to blame for how the whole thing eventually went down, but Kobe's ego got the better of him. Shaq would have been content to sit in LA and win title after title after title and all he wanted was some damn acknowledgement from Kobe for what Shaq brought to the team. I hope Kobe never even sniffs the Western Conference Finals again, let alone makes it to the Finals.

[Akileese]

Alright, Grant was merely there to even out the salaries. Shaq makes a RIDICULOUS amount of money so it actually took Oden AND GRANT to balance it out. Plus, Grant was on a horrendous contract as it was. So Grant was an expiring contract that they could turn around and trade...and they did (I just don't remember for what). The real problem wasn't Oden. It was Butler. He just didn't pan out like they hoped he would. The NBA is currently in a state where people are huge on upside potential and less on what they have done. As a UCONN fan (being from CT and all), Butler had a great college career and was a solid player. He had a ridiculous amount of potential. He didn't pan out right and while it is Mitch's fault, yeah, I put more of the blame on Kobe for running Shaq out of town.

[Jovec]

At the time of the trade, I put 99% of the blame on Kobe, but after seeing how Shaq acted the last few seasons in Miami towards the whole thing, I really think it's more of a 50/50. Yes, Kobe should have acknowledged Shaq more for the titles/wins/etc. but Shaq needed to suck up his ego too and realize age and weight were catching up with him and he needed Kobe just as much. People know when you are being the better man, and Shaq could have won another 2-3 here in LA and earned immense respect by properly dealing with primadonna Kobe. Shaq got lucky that D-Wade played out of his mind in the finals last year, and I really think that was the only one the Shaq/Wade combo will win.

The ironic thing is that either Horry or Fisher are going to be playing in the finals this year while Shaq and Kobe watch.

Edits: Caron Butler was traded for Kwame Brown. It was a 2 for 2 swap, but Chucky Atkins (from LAL) and Laron Profit (from WSH) don't play for those teams anymore. So, I suppose we can say Shaq was traded for Lamar Odom and Kwame Brown, but the issues are 1) is that even worth it? and 2) couldn't you get those players some other way if you really wanted them?

[Mario Speedwagon]

Man, I love Kobe if only for the reason that everyone hates him and he is just an incredible player. Like fucking amazing. He's as good at basketball as I am at jerking off. I wish him success in the future whether it be with the Lakers or not.

Originally Posted by Jovec

KG needs to get out of Minnesota before he slits his wrists

This made me laugh my ass off.

[PatrickStar]

BTW - Caron Bulter 2007 All-Star.