The MMA thread

[Ameraves Loyalheart]

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Yeah Wanderlei got it.

[Kindnugs]

[gavinrad]

Well, from the descriptions, i guess it wasn't a fantastic fight between Machida and Ortiz, I was hoping for Machida to really crush him and make people stop saying he's a boring fighter.

Still, he won, and Ortiz lost, so I'm happy.

[foddon]

It was a terrible fight. If that fight is any indication, he's an extremely boring fighter. He forced no action the entire fight, except when Tito put his hands down in frustration.

[Tallyn]

Originally Posted by foddon

It was a terrible fight. If that fight is any indication, he's an extremely boring fighter. He forced no action the entire fight, except when Tito put his hands down in frustration.

I disagree, though I can see why some might think him boring. He picks openings that are worth taking and tries to exploit them. He doesn't push the aggression when it would be a waste of energy. He doesn't stand in the pocket and let his opponent wail on him. In my mind these are just good strategies. Why get beaten up when you don't have to? Why gas yourself pointlessly?

I find his fights interesting to watch because you can see the tactical wheels turning in his head as he figures out how to exploit his opponents' movement styles. He's got a very different background (Shotokan and Sumo) than most people in the MMA world and that throws a lot of people out of their game. He's got amazing timing and manipulation of distance and utilizes sweeps, throws, and pushes that you don't see from anyone else right now. He puts on a very cerebral kind of bout that's pretty low on the bloodsport/brawling spectrum, but I enjoy it a lot.

[huh]

[jayrebb]

Originally Posted by foddon

It was a terrible fight. If that fight is any indication, he's an extremely boring fighter. He forced no action the entire fight, except when Tito put his hands down in frustration.

Agree completely.

I got a Kalib Starnes/ Nate Quarry feeling through most of the match.

Lyoto was at his worst ever. He backpeddled the entire fight. This was the worst Lyoto I have ever seen. You can't fight someone who doesn't want to fight.

Hes a good fighter, but his fight against Tito was his worst. Hands down.

Unfortunately the people I was watching it with were like "Tito sucks". And I had to explain several times that Lyoto was 100% focused on evading Tito, and was running away 90% of the time.

People didn't understand why Tito couldn't shoot on him. Its because Lyoto was 100% gameplanned against avoiding Tito.

Try it yourself in the gym. Have someone try to take you down while your plan is to avoid the takedown and do nothing else. Its fucking impossible.

[Ameraves Loyalheart]

So he should stand there and let Tito take him down? What Tallyn said is spot on. He wasn't running from Tito, he was attacking when he saw openings. Why would you not plan to defend the one and only thing Tito is effective at, ground and pound.

I can already see your next string of posts. How he failed to deliver because he didn't fight the way you expected him to. That was nothing even close to the same as Kalib running away, not even remotely close.

[larseny316]

Well, while I don't agree he was running away the entire fight. He was striking often enough to keep it from being completely boring, he just is very tactical and kept slipping out of Tito's strikes and shoots. One thing that I don't quite agree with is why people see it as such a valid strat from a point scoring basis? Comparing the standup between both Tito and Machida, I would have put them at dead even (except for 1 knee that rocked Tito). Tito barely landed any strikes, but neither did Machida. He landed alot of blows on Titos arms and legs. His striking doesn't knock people out. I would say that Machida Dodge Strat = Tito's "you can't hit me hard so feel free to tap me all you want" strat. Overall I do feel Machida won the fight (larger based on one huge knee), but it would have been close. I feel if it kept going for another 2 rounds, Tito would have eventually caught him.

Did anyone else notice that whenever Machida dodges a strike, he slips to one side, and for some reason holds both his hands up and outside? Why isn't he counter punching there? Also how long until someone throws a combo, which Machida dodges, and then the rest of the combo rocks them with his hands out to the side.

Overall though, I don't see Machida going far in the UFC. I won't pay to watch him fight, and I do appreciate his style. It is completely valid etc etc etc, but its boring and I don't pay to watch boring. I don't see Dana pushing him up the rankings to bigger and better fights, if the response after each fight is how boring they are.

[jayrebb]

Originally Posted by Ameraves Loyalheart

So he should stand there and let Tito take him down? What Tallyn said is spot on. He wasn't running from Tito, he was attacking when he saw openings. Why would you not plan to defend the one and only thing Tito is effective at, ground and pound.

I can already see your next string of posts. How he failed to deliver because he didn't fight the way you expected him to. That was nothing even close to the same as Kalib running away, not even remotely close.

It was pretty bad. It was the most passive Lyoto Ive seen. Ask yourself, what happened to just using your sprawl? Ive never seen someone run from takedowns so much. True champion material is confident in their sprawl so they will stand and bang in the pocket. Why couldn't Lyoto do that?

Thats not title material.

You say don't blame him for avoiding Tito's talents. But the problem is Lyoto wants a title shot. We all know thats not how you get a title fight.

Tito has a lot of haters (not saying you) so of course by default Lyoto gained nuthangers overnight.

MMAfightline bashed Lyoto's performance, so Im not alone at least.

Edit: to the poster above, I agree I wasn't expecting a 30-27 for all 3 judges. Something is obviously wrong with the scoring system, this isn't boxing. In Pride rules, Tito won because of attempt to finish.

[huh]

Boring or not if he keeps winning he better get his fucking title shot.

[trotsky]

I appreciate that there's one person in the UFC whose answer to striking defense isn't "run kamikaze towards my opponent with my hands down".

Watching Machida is a joy. Hopefully this attention will elevate the fighters and the fans til the ones complaining wipe the "JUST BLEED" paint off their foreheards and accept that this is a proper sport. Or they can just fuck off when the next "backyard wrestling" fad comes around.

[Asmadai]

In Pride rules, the UFC would be throwing yellow cards almost every other fucking match.

Too bad.

[homsar]

I love how people call him borring and running away. Fact is, Machida threw more and landed more strikes along with putting tito on his back every round. Some people are just fucking retards I guess. Also he was extremly ill and couldnt even stand at the end of the fight and still made Tito look terrible.

[Grimmlokk]

Curious how Tito's face ended up looking like a poorly made sausage if he was the only one attacking. Face to fist technique?

I'm not a Machida fan, I've said it before. But it was a smart strategy and it worked perfectly. If you think the striking game was even, you are a fucking moron. Tito has gotten soooo slow over the last couple years it's actually painful to watch him trying to strike=/ The triangle attempt was nice, but again a bit slow, for Machida at least. In the replay you could see him pop his right shoulder out right before Tito tightened it up, so he was not in any real danger at all from it.

I was super pumped for Silva. He is the anti-Machida. God bless the man for always coming out and giving the fans what they want. Silva/Machida would be an interesting match up=) Maybe that's the next thing they'll attempt to stop the Lyoto train before it gets to a title shot.

Sherk...ugh. Jab jab jab jab jab jab...hmmm I wonder what BJ will try next? JAB! FFS man, try a little head movement! I really hope the new BJ sticks around for awhile, he's really impressive to watch now that he's actually training hard. And it will be fun to watch him dismantle Florian or Huerta depending which of them wins(Florian).

The punch Soko landed to put down Nakamura was awesome. Kick got checked, and he saw the opening whole their legs were still up and just popped the fuck out of him instantly with a straight right. What confused me was that Kaz went down on his right leg, but when he was sitting down after the fight it looked like his left was the injured one. Either way, glad Soko won, the man is a trip and a lot of fun to watch.

I was also glad to see jayrebb's boyfriend Koppenhaver get absolutely run the fuck over. The guy is a piece of shit and deserved to be left sitting there looking like a corpse.

Ivan Salaverry has weird and creepy ribs. And Palhares is a fucking monster. His upper body is ridiculously out of proportion with the rest of him. He's built like the Hulk.

Finally, Thiago Silva was impressive coming back after getting kicked in the ear to start the fight, I thought it was over right there for a second.