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Old 11-09-2007, 12:40 PM   #14641 (permalink)
Quineloe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Antoine View Post
Say what you will about logical analysis, but I (and many others) still see it spinning clockwise (along with the shadow)
The shadow clearly indicates her spinning counterclockwise and the actual animation is clockwise.
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Old 11-09-2007, 12:56 PM   #14642 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quineloe View Post
The shadow clearly indicates her spinning counterclockwise and the actual animation is clockwise.
Frame 13!

There are tons of pieces that if all you did was stare at them you'd see it moving counter. As well as clockwise.

The shadow is impossible. It shows "legs" moving counter but if you are to maintain the leg pointed outward the feet don't make sense.

If you want to change the way you see it, simply say

"back right front left" for clockwise and
"front right back left" for counter

when she's at those cardinal points. Eventually your expectations of what you're supposed to be seeing will kick it in.

If you, however, realize when you see frame 13 that one leg must be in front of the other due to the way the graphics are, focus on the toes and shape of the foot, or look at the impossible shadow - those will force you to realize it in a certain manner.
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Old 11-09-2007, 01:05 PM   #14643 (permalink)
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It would seem to me that the whole "the foot is circling in the wrong place in the shadow" argument is negated by the fact that the only way you can "see" the figure change directions is to change both the angle that she appears to be tilted, as well as the apparent direction of the light source.

We're not dealing with two shadows created by the same light.
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Old 11-09-2007, 01:18 PM   #14644 (permalink)
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I only see her spinning counter-clockwise. Altogether now, I've probably spent two hours watching her spin, and she will not reverse for me. I got her to reverse once, when this was posted before, but couldn't change it back. Also, head and feet look to be perfectly in sync to me. The window illusion works for me, and once the narrator pointed out the nose in the Chapman one, I started to see that illusion (I saw it as it really was at first). Once I started to see the Chapman illusion, I couldn't make myself see it as it really is again.

My brain is apparently all fuckered up. The narrator says I should never have seen the reality of the Chapman mask, but until he said what to look for, that's exactly what I did see. I saw the nose as concave until I looked for it to be convex. Even when I looked for it, my brain took a moment to switch gears, and for a single pass, I saw part of the face convex and the other parts concave. I amost couldn't see it at all, and now I can only see the illusion even when I look for the concave nose. So, even though AS has my senses all fuckered up, this seems to suggest that they can be corrected. (even if temporarily) very, very interesting concept to me, for obvious reasons.

edit: No, no. I can see it concave again, as it truly is. The difference is in looking at it like a face or looking at it like an object. Focus on the false aspects of the mask that make it obvious that it's fake when it's facing outward, and then the inside will look concave to you.

edit2: The woman's leg in the center (not the pointed one) is her right leg, regardless of whether I look at the center or top of the image. If I look at the legs, I see her right leg become her left for about a quarter of the rotation (third quadrant of the circle), but I still never see her change directions and the change rationalizes in my mind as there being no distinguishing line -- that short change seems false.

Last edited by GaliemVaelant; 11-09-2007 at 01:32 PM..
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Old 11-09-2007, 01:25 PM   #14645 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glaive View Post
It would seem to me that the whole "the foot is circling in the wrong place in the shadow" argument is negated by the fact that the only way you can "see" the figure change directions is to change both the angle that she appears to be tilted, as well as the apparent direction of the light source.

We're not dealing with two shadows created by the same light.
Shadow is the wrong term (I didn't mean light casting darkness).

What's at her feet is a reflection. And it is impossible for that reflection to be true without her legs twisting impossibly.

I think nobody will claim that she isn't pointing one leg out from her body.

Go ahead and do this with your fingers on the table. Place them on a mirror.
(You can use light to cast a shadow which works fine).

See how that looks? Not the same as the image, eh? the reflection "pointed leg" in fact goes behind the planted leg, if we are ever to believe she or your fingers, is rotating fully. Now take your two fingers and sniff them. That is not a woman's vagina.

Oops.
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Old 11-09-2007, 01:40 PM   #14646 (permalink)
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I was waiting for that article to turn into the Fresh Prince lyrics... so disappointing.
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Old 11-09-2007, 01:49 PM   #14647 (permalink)
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Here's a version stripped of the wobbling, shadow and lighting. None of that stuff matters.
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Old 11-09-2007, 01:51 PM   #14648 (permalink)
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I can switch back and forth at will. Does that mean i'm both brained?

Just watch the leg. As soon as it crosses, either say in front or behind and picture how that would look. I can view her rotating back and forth never even making a complete turn.

Or try this. In the pic above, look at the foot she's standing on. Look at the toes. They go in an oval shape. Now just pretend shes making that oval shape, but only pointing forward, like shes just circling her foot ignoring the rest of the animation. Works really well for me.
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Old 11-09-2007, 01:54 PM   #14649 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zuuljin View Post
I can switch back and forth at will. Does that mean i'm both brained?

Just watch the leg. As soon as it crosses, either say in front or behind and picture how that would look. I can view her rotating back and forth never even making a complete turn.
you are some sort of god
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Old 11-09-2007, 02:03 PM   #14650 (permalink)
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Yep.

Only a few clues that should force your perception. As you go through all the frames you can spot 'em. Some people would say that once you open up the file and see the direction, that's the direction, etc.

I don't think anyone should be seeing this as the center leg behind the pointed leg:
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Old 11-09-2007, 02:06 PM   #14651 (permalink)
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I could not see that white line until I saw the version without the background and shadow (I looked for it and my mind simply would not see it). I still can not see her spinning clockwise.
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Old 11-09-2007, 02:08 PM   #14652 (permalink)
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I almost saw it going counterclockwise, but I ended up just seeing her wiggle back and forth for a bit before returning clockwise.

edit: got it, still think Horse is fucking crazy talking about what's "impossible"
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Old 11-09-2007, 02:17 PM   #14653 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Antoine View Post
I almost saw it going counterclockwise, but I ended up just seeing her wiggle back and forth for a bit before returning clockwise.

edit: got it, still think Horse is fucking crazy talking about what's "impossible"
I can see it go both ways, but it took some work. It helped me when i blocked everything but her one foot, then looked at it, blinking slowly. Eventually i saw the foot switch directions, and when i moved my hand up to show the whole body the whole body was following the foot in the opposite direction, and i couldnt switch the illusion back to the way it was without going back to just the foot. After some practice i can switch the illusion without covering up any of the body.

It works for me.
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Old 11-09-2007, 03:02 PM   #14654 (permalink)
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Pics damnit!
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Old 11-09-2007, 03:04 PM   #14655 (permalink)
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mkay
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