[WOW] The effect of BG/Arena Queuing on Retention

[Ravensign]

In all of the WoW vs X, threads one thing I never see mentioned is how powerful the effect of BG and Arena queuing is on retention and keeping casual, max level characters busy and engaged.

It's not about the PvP itself, its about being matched up nearly instantly and placed into a game situation that allows for gameplay and character progression. The large population and lack of server lines in a WoW Battlegroup only further the ease of assembly.

No other MMO allows you to so quickly begin playing at max level (if you are in shat or sw, literaly w/in 30 seconds) in a way that allows for some kind of progression.

WoW BG's are alot of things, and you can rag on them for pug vs. premade wipeouts, or for "welfare" progression, but for the most part, being pvp, they are challenging, rewarding and (until grinded into oblivion) a source of fun. Most importantly they can be instantly entered with no time or social barriers.

Other pretenders to the throne are never going to approach WoW's numbers until they integrate ways for instant play like this. It surprises me that other games have yet to see this and haven't introduced matching mechanisms for play, PvP or even PvE. If you designed content to be played by people this way, it could be a powerful thing.

I am not talking about the play itself being "easy mode", I am talking about removing the barriers of forming a group, or coordinating a raid. There's nothing intrinsically wrong with the old way, but you can't do that in 30 minutes before work after your shower. WoW BG's already provide this and I think its an under appreciated part of its success.

I have thought of going to EQ2 or another game, but I am hooked on the ability, no matter what else is going on, to be able to queue up and get instant play even though I am max level, and it's something that a game would need to take me from WoW full time. Brad, for example, thought that people would tire of TBC once they hit 70, but that's just when you can start arena's and BG's, and you can play in them 24x7 with little or no wait.

[Mist]

Or you could make everything directly accessable from the main cities and have your game completely fail like DDO.

WoW isn't successful because of this one thing, or because of any other thing. Most of what people consider some of the best elements of WoW have been tried in other games that completely failed.

[Ravensign]

DDO you still had to assemble the people. It's not just about how easy to access the content, its the matching system. It's being thrust into a fun, short session in which you can progress even if maxed out. The honor and arena points systems are hand-in-hand a part of why it works. For PVE matching, it could be guaranteed badges, or something.

Also, I wasn't saying its the secret-one-reason for the WoW success, just that it's an under appreciated and under discussed element.

[kudos]

That "fun" you speak of quickly dies because of the premade vs. pug shit and also because of things like AV not being balanced. The majority of battlegroups have one faction that steamrolls the other every game which is why you get 3 hour queues for the winning faction. Sure you have instant queues, but then you also have 8 times out of 10 playing a premade and you getting slaughtered. That doesn't help retention at all.

[Ravensign]

Even with the fun sucked out of it, you still progress, and can do so in small chunks of time w/o setup.

People have shown again and again, they still like some form of the treadmill, even if its lighter than the old days, but you can't even treadmill if you spend all your time in setup. Removing the setup gets people into play asap.

Also, some factions, and some Battlegroups, and certain maps, you win as pug frequently. It depends on a lot of factors.

[Flood950]

I recently started playing again after about a year hiatus and am slowly working my way up the levels, I wanted to start a fresh character on a server where I had not played.

I have to say that the BG's are what is keeping it fun. I level up to a x8 or x9 level, then do AB and WSG until I have enough marks to get the WSG cape and weapon, then the AB boots and belt.

Once I do that and level to the x0, I try to level up as fast as possible so I can BG again (and not be a tool that is going in at lvl x2 and causing more harm than good for our side). After getting 3 characters to lvl 60 pre-TBC, the questing is not that much fun this time around, but the BG's I am greatly enjoying.

[WillzZz]

Accessible 30minute chunks are definitely the way to go for anyone who wants to grab the new MMO crowds. That doesn't necessarily mean using DDO's method, either.

[Twobit Whore]

DDO failed because it did what it did at the expense of everything else. WoW does it AND everything else.

[Zehn - Vhex]

Planetside had instant action available from the menu. DDO had a centralized city. It's a concept that's been put into play several times before. It's a nice features for some things but it can't be a central part of your game.

This didn't need a new thread. Move along.

[Grumpy Old Fart]

The effect of three hour BG queues resulted in Blizzard not retaining me as a WoW subscriber any more, if that anecdotal evidence is of any interest. That shit is seriously ridiculous.

[Mist]

Originally Posted by Grumpy Old Fart

The effect of three hour BG queues resulted in Blizzard not retaining me as a WoW subscriber any more, if that anecdotal evidence is of any interest. That shit is seriously ridiculous.

When was that? Like 3 years ago?

[Arbitrary]

Originally Posted by Twobit Whore

DDO failed because it did what it did at the expense of everything else. WoW does it AND everything else.

Let's not try and pin that down on any one thing.

[benbadman]

2v2 Q times are pretty bad, when it's 6-10+ minutes per game.

[elrich]

Originally Posted by benbadman

2v2 Q times are pretty bad, when it's 6-10+ minutes per game.

It's particularly bad because it's a function of blizzard not putting enough server hardware in place to host the games. Which, to me, is pretty indefensible when you consider that they have all the money in the world.

[kudos]

I wish they'd just allow all servers to play against each other and get rid of this battlegroup bullshit.