Why all the nerd rage against Vanguard?

[Duppin]

Originally Posted by Twobit Whore

He has a right to complain about broccoli if he wants to. This is the place for "Rants, Flames, Whines, and(if you really want to)Valid Discussions."

But having NOTES about broccoli isn't natural.

[Twobit Whore]

Only noobs use forks, pros use the spork. All the versatilty of a spoon with the precision of a fork. And you should probably stick to grinding out levels on mashed potatoes if you can't even keep your broccoli on the plate.

[Rayne]

Originally Posted by Schatze

No Rayne. I'm saying you've redefined failure from being economically viable (which brad states as 150 000 - 200 000, which is the objective way of looking at failure when speaking of a corporation), to his "wish" number (500 000). You claim because you do not think he will reach his wish number, that VG is a failure (which means you're either switching definitions or refuting your predicates, either of which are the equivalent of seppuku in an argument). Hence my babbling about how your arguments do not line up with your predicates etc.

It's the other guys who are full of blatant horse shit. I just think your argument doesn't stand, that it refutes itself.

Vanguard fell well below its projected sub numbers. It failed. It now need to recover from that, and THEN hit 500k by the end of the year according to Brad himself to be considered successful. I don't think the rest is too hard to figure out. 350k subs in 10 months, with serious contenders in its immediate and extended path will compound that struggle EXPONENTIALLY.

But hey, you keep holding on man. If Vanguard does manage to realise those numbers, great. As I said, I wish them luck, they're going to need it.

[Wolfen]

Originally Posted by Duppin

But having NOTES about broccoli isn't natural.

So you are saying that having a cookbook is a sploit?

[woqqqa]

Bah, you all suck. I remember when you used to have to eat a whole leg of roast horse with your bare hands. None of these fucking utensils faggoting up the eating experience. And we drank mead, lots of it!

[Rayne]

Originally Posted by Wolfen

So you are saying that having a cookbook is a sploit?

Only if the encounter isn't "working as intented(TM)"

[Maxxius]

Originally Posted by Schatze

No Rayne. I'm saying you've redefined failure from being economically viable (which brad states as 150 000 - 200 000, which is the objective way of looking at failure when speaking of a corporation), to his "wish" number (500 000). You claim because you do not think he will reach his wish number, that VG is a failure (which means you're either switching definitions or refuting your predicates, either of which are the equivalent of seppuku in an argument). Hence my babbling about how your arguments do not line up with your predicates etc.

It's the other guys who are full of blatant horse shit. I just think your argument doesn't stand, that it refutes itself.

Finally a non drug induced commentary. As a generalization you might be right. A game generating 150-200k could be profitable, DEPENDING upon its cost. But who is putting the spin now? You know darn well he didnt sell this project to MS with those numbers, because otherwise they never would have spent 30-40 million dollars (his numbers from this thread, albeit he was purposefully non-specific). They were absolutely looking for higher numbers, and when WOW hit the market you know darn well MS took notice.

Sorry charley, if the game cost 5 million I'd say it was a whopping success, but not at 30-40 million.

[Twobit Whore]

Originally Posted by Wolfen

So you are saying that having a cookbook is a sploit?

It depends. Is your microwave from China?

[woqqqa]

Originally Posted by Twobit Whore

It depends. Is your microwave from China?

All microwaves are from China (since the mid-90s, at least).

[Filthgrinder]

Originally Posted by Schatze

Under 150k subs did not come from Brad seeing as there is a quote on this same damned page that gives a very different number. The only person saying under 150k was utnayan who claimed that the real subscriber base was 50k and 100k individuals charged even after canceling.

But yes continue to make up bullshit that can be falsified by lookin on this same damned page (hint, first post on this page, which quotes some dude named aradune mithara).

edit: yes because certainly no one, not even a large chunk, bought via digital download which has a higher profit margin for the company offering it than traditional box sales (but the drawback of which is that you don't get as many "gee whiz, what be vanguard?" customers).

Or, you know, you could go by mid 150k subscribers which is pretty blatant in it's meaning unless you'd like to cite someone other than utnayan, perhaps a real source, to indicate where you got your horseshit from.

I love this guy. Now this is clinically proven insanity. Ut pales to this

[Draegan]

Originally Posted by Wolfen

Fuck yeah! I mean, my broccoli is NOT balanced. It fell off my plate, for fuck's sake. How am I supposed to level up my fork if the broccoli isn't even there?

Use a spoon. It's overpowered this month. It will get nerfed next patch.

[Wolfen]

Originally Posted by Draegan

Use a spoon. It's overpowered this month. It will get nerfed next patch.

There is no spoon.

[Schatze]

Rayne:

I believe I said it needed 200k-300k to be successful, and that I hoped to see 500k after the game was out 1 year, which would make it very profitable. So far we are in the mid 150s which is less than I would have hoped, but still good and still growing.

Projected sales would be "We expect this number of boxes to be sold, y number of subscriptions by z date."

The question based on this is what time frames are we talking about, as the number of subscriptions would be expressed as T(tau) (e.g. a given number of subscriptions active at any one time over a given time period, and not total subscriptions sold or not cherry picking a specific narrow time period to look at said number of subscriptions).

To be successful, brad states 200k-300k. The question then becomes, over what time frame? He does not give one, so assuming a specific time frame is prone to error. Is it by day 0 he expects to have 200-300k subs active? By day 1? week 1? Month 1? Month 3, 4, 6? Or is it by year 1 (e.g. 200-300k to be a "success" by year 1, 500k his "wish" that would mean vanguard was "very successful" by year one. But, although we don't have any metric to actually look at whether this is a success/failure given the previous explanation

The only specific time period he gives is for 1 year to be 500k. He explicitly states that this is a "wish" that would "make vanguard very successful". But this is not a projection, as the use of "wish" indicates.

But while there is no timeframe given for "success", the implicit statement is that the 200-300k number would have to be reached by U date, be maintained for V days, etc. etc. etc. When is this date? 1 day after he said it? 10? a month? 3? I don't know. But then, neither do you, and the onus is on you.

Maxxius: sunk costs are defined as costs already spent, to date, on a product. These are fixed, unchangeable. Because this money is almost certain to have been venture capital, e.g. investment in a company for the development of a future product that the investors think may end up turning a profit over a (individually determined time frame).

Sunk costs not only apply to the creation of a given product, but the amount spent creating the capacity to develop said product or future product(s) that will end up yielding the chance for a pay off at some date in the future.

Using the strictest definition of success, would be that a product over it's life time yields returns greater than those spent in the production and upkeep of all processes related to said subject. Of course, people do not provide VC to make their money back. They expect returns. But over what time frame, and what amount, depends on the individual investor and the type of investment they enter into.

Given the type of product VG is producing, it's literally impossible and completely disingenuous to make claims at this point based on the amount of venture capital inputted.

edit: addressed to one liner faggot above, sorry that I'm arguing with 4 individuals at any given time. I know many individuals on this board are the huked on phonix types who cannot distinguish meaning or target of addresss based on context. It's sadly unfortunate, I don't blame you for your difficulties. But if you can't understand something, perhaps you should refrain from commenting on it sweetcheeks.

What I find funny is the same individuals who can't determine meaning and target of address based on context, are the same ones who have been slurping off Utnayan for several dozen pages. Then, when I call them on slurping off and lending credence to Utnayan, of giving his anonymous claims credibility, those same individuals then turn around and reply, "you're as crazy as utnayan!"

For the sake of consistency, doesn't that mean you should parrot anything I say regardless of how specious it is? Oh wait, sorry, because I do not agree with the agenda of most of the posters in this thread, and because I'm not making specious, uncheckable claims, I'm not fashionable :/ Woe.

[Draegan]

Jesus fucking christ shut the fuck up already Schatze about the fucking sub numbers. Who the fuck cares anymore.

The game sucks. It's fallen under the projected numbers. Or at best "just good enough". The game isn't a hit, it isn't a smashing success. The only people enjoying the game are enjoying it through their EQ-Goggles and a hazy memory of what was.

Just shut the fuck up.

[Erronius]

Originally Posted by Wolfen

There is no spoon.

I must regretfully disagree.