Why all the nerd rage against Vanguard?

[tad10]

Originally Posted by Deris

Hope you have fun playing all!.

Having a ton of fun dispite bugs...

Memo to Sigil -- I'm going to keep using /stuck to get out of the Tomb of Lord Tsang until you guys fix that amazingly buggy place. Ban me for exploiting if you will -- but after the first 3 or 4 relogs and reforms on a run I'm just not willing to do more. It's tough to fight when your healers cant see your tanks and your tanks can't see the mobs.

That being said for a really fun time in VG try co-ordinating your various classes burst melee pumpers. Jin Surge (monk burst) + Marshalling Cry or wtf its called (Paladin burst) + Y + Z = Epic and Legendary hits ftw. Its highly amusing to see the mob go from like 1/3 health to zero.

Edit: Just to be clear if VG is buggy then the Tomb is like concentrated essence of bugginess that is contained in a vial made of crystalline solid bugholding material.

[Thornaster]

Originally Posted by machineman

What I want to know is... what about the people that DID NOT play EQ1 on day 1? How do they feel about this game? They don't have some attachment to reliving those years... so their opinion on a modern MMO is as valid if not more so than "old school" players.

I did not play EQ at all.

I really like Vanguard.

Next theory?

[vynde]

Originally Posted by Thornaster

I did not play EQ at all.

I really like Vanguard.

Next theory?

i dont think he was making a theory. i think he wanted to see how the eq vets felt about vg to see if it is the second coming

[Erronius]

Originally Posted by Thornaster

Next theory?

The Iraq war was a shameless ploy by Blizzard to add millions of new potential players to the MMO market. They figured millions of angry, violent Iraqis would all go Horde in order to vent their rage and frustration by killing American-esque Alliance, and thus balance the population imbalance that Blizzard denies exists.

And it was Furor who dropped the trapdoor out from under Saddam. True story.

[Daelos]

Originally Posted by machineman

If you take the first 10 levels of WoW and the first 10 levels of Vanguard, and ask the, lets say 7 million players for whom WoW was the first MMO they've played, which do you think most would prefer?

It's not even a contest - the fit, finish, polish and fun of WoW is captivating the minute you begin playing. Vanguard, after you stutter around to get your bearings, you can go start slaughtering stiff looking mobs w/ flat grey textures.

And don't say the games are two different beasts - the first 10 levels the games are identical in terms of goal and gameplay.

I prefer Vanguard's first 10 levels to WoW's first 10 levels - by far.

Sure, I had fun in WoW, but I felt like I was moving my character around as if I was moving the nicely graphical cursor around in a spreadsheet. It was a game, (and not a bad game).
In Vanguard, I am attached to my characters from the first step. The world is massive and immersive (yes, that's that word again), and I am a part of it. The textures are vivid and the colours are sparkling, but in realistic shades that are actually found in nature.

So machineman, sorry, but there are people with different opinions than you.

[Inconsiderable]

Originally Posted by Lyrical

The n00b sense of wonder is never going to come back, so why look for it?

Wrong. I played so many MMOs and in every good one, it came back. I just decided to give EVE a try like a week ago and guess what, the n00b sense of wonder was back again ~



Oh yea and Vanguard > WoW, beside 1 thing: WoW is made with love, they had awesome worldbuilders. Vanguard looks fugly and they had no worldbuilder at all. And the VG engine sucks.

[Faith]

Well, I bought the game yesterday and have been fiddling around a bit now.

For the comparison for the first 10 levels, Im sorry, but I prefer escaping
as a slave and deliver some payback or attack a village just to realize "my"
empire sucks and atone for it. Makes me more attached to my character
from start.

For preformance, yeah, it simply blows. With 4gb mem, Dual Core E6400 and
a 7950 GX2 1 gig video RAM, I should run this shit smooth. As it is it takes
time to load up when you log in, then you have to wait around a bit while
random objects "pop up" around you, THEN wait a bit for the character to
start moving smoothly. Thats unacceptable. However I expect it to be dealt
with since they have made huge progress with tuning since beta.

Am I having fun? Well, Im not bored, but I cant honestly say "Fuck WOW!"
right now. Its an intresting game, and Ill play around with it a bit to make up
my mind.

[Citten]

I'd like to take the time to emphasis something Nino has mentioned on the boards (not directly replying to anyone here).

Playing on Highest Performance, in my opinion, doesn't devalue you're graphic experiance. You can further tweak things from there also if you want to test with graphical adjustments. The game play is 10X more smooth, I don't really ever lag, I always hold 30-50fps, pretty much anywhere unless i'm grouped. ATI X850. Less texturing, yeah, looks a little more bland, yeah - but it's still quite scenic.

[Leviathan]

For what it is worth I would like to say that I played my beta account for about 4 days back in June 2006 and was shocked how much the game sucked back then. It ran like shit and I had no fun at all.

Fast forward to yesterday when I got a 10-day trial key from a good friend of mine who kept on telling me how much fun the game is now. Just to humor him I accepted the key, patched up my old account and 7 hours of exploring the gnome starting city/area later, doing quests linked to adventuring, diplomacy and tradekills, I am having a blast.

I have to tone the visuals way down on my ancient PC, but somehow I end up with 18fps and a game that, so far, made me care about its lore and dialogues, which is the most important thing for me in a (MMO)RPG.

I will purchase the full game in 9 days, just to find out how much deeper the rabbit-hole goes.

[Gnome Eater]

Originally Posted by boy-

To be clear, I think the issue wasn't the hype, but it was the hype coming straight from brad. It was quite annoying to see him pop in, create a new thread which says nothing more than (see these new screenshots at website X!), then proceed to dodge/ignore absolutely any and all questions about the actual gameplay.

This was incredibly annoying, I always wondered why whoever was directing marketing would allow Brad to do this. You'd get screenshots carefully given to fan-sites, then Brad would spam 10 screenshots clearly not fit for showing to players on this board. I am sure the man is good at what he does, but please keep him out of marketing. When Smed or Hartsman post they do it to either add a humorous quip, give a unique perspective, or to notify that they are adressing a bug, they have enough perspective to not try to continuosly sell their product.

I want more developer interactions on this board, posts by developers that give background about design decisions or quests are amazing and very interesting, and I understand they cannot talk about certain things; but people trying to sell their game non-stop or spin marketing terms just piss people off.

Another thing by Starbright, and Eomer kinda hit on it as well that I agree with:

Maybe you people shouldn't spend 3+ years following games that aren't even fucking out yet and we wouldn't have this problem of people going psychotic when their favorite "design doc feature" (wtf) gets axed 31 months from release.

I never understood this phenomenom. Play a game, if you enjoy it, great, if you don't, cool, just don't bother with it. Why drag it out, yell, scream, accuse Nino of murdering your girlfriend by bludgeoning her to death with your kitty? I find Vanguard in its present form quite a good game, however, I am holding out for an item loot PvP server, since I am not interested in playing carebear mode.

Another detail about Vanguard hate. The Vanguard boards/beta boards were the biggest collection of retards/mouthbreathers that you could imagine. You'd see people with 5 colour signatures listing every character they had across 7 MMORPG, none at the level cap. The type of people you see cybering in goldshire on RP servers made up 85% of the testers, to the point where dialogue with devs on beta boards was impossible.

The developers of Vanguard were AMAZING, expecially if you managed to talk to them directly and discuss issues with them, but communication with them was only possible through batphone or the like, since any thread about gameplay would get hijacked by retards who wanted to talk about absolute generalities. You'd get idiots who'd go on about 'magic' or atmosphere or any of those absolutely general and unhelpful feedback, refusing to give any specifics as to what their issues were.

[Faith]

Originally Posted by Raglaum

I'd like to take the time to emphasis something Nino has mentioned on the boards (not directly replying to anyone here).

Playing on Highest Performance, in my opinion, doesn't devalue you're graphic experiance. You can further tweak things from there also if you want to test with graphical adjustments. The game play is 10X more smooth, I don't really ever lag, I always hold 30-50fps, pretty much anywhere unless i'm grouped. ATI X850. Less texturing, yeah, looks a little more bland, yeah - but it's still quite scenic.

The problems I have are not related to the setting it seems. The diffrence in
fps is minimal between highest preformance and highest visual settings. Its a
question of how the grafix engine do things. Not even shadows affect my
preformance, its allways the same: Loading up black area with PCs frozen
around me (no ground, just sky or black), then 3 sec laters the basic world
suddenly appears (ground, trees), then 2-5 sec for stuff to randomly pop up
(tents/houses/rocks/etc) and finaly 5 sec for animations to begin. Ive also
noticed that textures on distant objects "flash" white now and then.

I remember reading something about tweaking the ini file, could someone link
that if anyone has it handy? Thanks in advance.

[Rezz]

I completely agree about the beta boards. Holy moly that was a retard fest of epic proportions. Instead of giving feedback on the current game, it was mostly people bitching about issues from beta 2 (in october 2006) who haven't played since the beginning of the year; people who couldn't find a way to make a character attractive to them (for cybering) and the mouth breather standard of "FIRST!!!!1!" for the first half of any dev post.

Talk about ridiculous. I was surprised they didn't put min level caps on people to make posts, that would have killed 90% of the retardery. "You must be level 5 to post" and the boards would have been a ghost town hah.

[Tagad Sigil]

Originally Posted by tad10

Having a ton of fun dispite bugs...

Edit: Just to be clear if VG is buggy then the Tomb is like concentrated essence of bugginess that is contained in a vial made of crystalline solid bugholding material.

The Tsang issue has been likely identified. Unsure of when it can be fixed, but its certainly annoying folks here at the office as well. Basically, avoid the elevators like the plague for the moment.

I'll mention the lack of the monk / disciple weapons to the team that did the area. Perhaps they can put something in for the sword that transfers it into a martial weapon - no promises.

~Tagad

[tad10]

Originally Posted by Faith

I remember reading something about tweaking the ini file, could someone link
that if anyone has it handy? Thanks in advance.

defrag. setup static swapfile appropriate to your mem. And see the ini tweaks on Vanguard Servers Community Message Board - Powered by vBulletin and here Mort's Tweak Guide - The Cult of the Angry Goblin. This post isn't super helpful but the link should have enough info for you.

[Gnome Eater]

Originally Posted by Tagad Sigil

The Tsang issue has been likely identified. Unsure of when it can be fixed, but its certainly annoying folks here at the office as well. Basically, avoid the elevators like the plague for the moment.

I'll mention the lack of the monk / disciple weapons to the team that did the area. Perhaps they can put something in for the sword that transfers it into a martial weapon - no promises.

~Tagad

Tagad, since you are lurking here, and I had the impression that this was something that bothered you personally as well, could you adress the topic of feedback on beta boards?

Personally, I found the discussion there very very useless and just stopped going there. I was curious if you felt there were better way of obtaining feedback from fans, without having all the signal drowned out in the noise.

The idea of a level limit to post on the gameplay forum sounds like a great idea, expecially to cut out the people who felt that if the game didn't suck their dick starting level1 then it was the developers fault.