Green Monster Games (Curt Schilling)

[Venjenz]

Originally Posted by Gaereth

I personally prefer to have a few things to do, finish them, pick up a few more, finish them, and work my way through an area like that.

Best example of that I can think of right now would be Darklight Wood or GFay in EQ2.

Originally Posted by Gaereth

The more quests that people get at a time the more disconnected you actually get from the quests. For some people thats great...they don't like the damn things in the first place and they are merely a means to an end. For others it gets a bit overwhelming to have so many and doesn't feel like you can relax and just work your way through the area.

Best example of that I can think of is the rest of EQ2, minus Darklight Wood and GFay.

[Draegan]

There's no reason from the players point of view for quest limitations. However from a developer point of view it allows you to tell a story more precisely I would imagine.

Also as a player, some people can load up on quests and begin to become overwelmed with things to do and end up wandering around with no direction. Not a good thing your first time around in a game. If you can control the population flow of a new person then you have more control over their journey and first impression. Steer them in the right direction so to speak.

Good example would be EVE. It's pretty intimidating to a new person when they enter the world and they have 100's of skill choices and 100's of different items to chose from or even look at.

Perhaps a good solution would be to give a person X amount of quest spots at the beginning and slowly expand it as they level up if it becomes an issue later on.

[Dennadyne]

Here's an example why I think there should be a harsh quest limit.

Last night I was playing WoW, this was only my 2nd night playing it ever. I logged on my freshly made paladin and grabbed some quests. Within an hour I had about 12 quests and had completed roughly 10 others. Now obviously these are as far from epic or detailed as you can get, being level 1-5 quests, but here's the thing: All I cared about was accomplishing the listed task. Why? Well, when your UI just tells you to kill 6 zombies, slay 5 bats, run over yonder and talk to this ranger guy, etc. it makes it hard to care about the test you read 15 minutes ago from one of 4 quest givers. When you have 10 lists on your UI telling you do this stuff! it just takes away from the actual quest.

I like the idea of focusing on a very limited amount of quests at a time. I guess I just don't like the "hi, follow these perfectly laid out steps and we'll reward you" type quests either. This is not a rant on wow, because it's exactly the same in EQ2 and pretty similar in Vanguard as well.

[Draegan]

I'm not sure what you dislike? You just want one quest at a time and no side quests? Similar to a single player RPG?

[Ngruk]

Hey if you are a student at a massachusetts college and in the gaming curriculum stay tuned to our website for an announcement.
We are launching the 1st annual massachusetts game challenge this week.

[Azzikai]

Originally Posted by Draegan

I'm not sure what you dislike? You just want one quest at a time and no side quests? Similar to a single player RPG?

I won't speak for him but I agree with him. When I play WoW on a lowbie I feel like I'm doing a list of chores or something. Kill 5 bears? Check. Pick up 7 tree branches? Check. Then I run back to the quest dispenser machine and wait for my reward pellet. It feels completely and utterly mechanical.

There is a place for the kill/collect/carry tasks in games but having them as some shopping list sitting in my "quest" journal? No thanks. That journal should be for proper quests, where having notes on what you've already learned makes sense. Quests should be interactive and lengthy.

Tasks should be plentiful and have no limit. If I collect 10 swatches of cloth I'm sure the local tailor would give me stuff for them or tell me who to see. Make me interact with something other than a pretty graphical list.

I realize that I'm mostly arguing semantics here but it is something that irritates me about WoW and the games that try and copy it. They build these pretty worlds filled with NPCs then they don't use them.

Anyway, if the game is going to do quests a la WoW then don't have a limit. If I have to have a laundry list of tasks to do I want to be able to put as many on it as I want /shrug

[Twobit Whore]

Originally Posted by Rezz

I agree with Venjenz above for the most part. I dislike the concept of do 300 totally forgetable quests instead of grinding. I'd rather have a few super long "chain" type quests that constantly keep branching out but are still part of the same major storyline with that quest.

But if you are gonna go the happymeal of quests style that WoW went, go with more far reaching goals at the head of each group of chud quests. You collect 10 orc ears, they send you to collect orc weapons. Some other guy in town hears about your orc slaying prowress and wants you to collect some orc battle plans. When you finish both lines it opens up a quest to stop the orc invasions, maybe culminating in an instance or whatever type of content you're focusing on. That kind of stuff is awesome. Much better than the 6 million filler quests in WoW imo.

They actually have a lot of quests and hubs exactly like this in WoW.

[Draegan]

Originally Posted by Azzikai

I won't speak for him but I agree with him. When I play WoW on a lowbie I feel like I'm doing a list of chores or something. Kill 5 bears? Check. Pick up 7 tree branches? Check. Then I run back to the quest dispenser machine and wait for my reward pellet. It feels completely and utterly mechanical.

There is a place for the kill/collect/carry tasks in games but having them as some shopping list sitting in my "quest" journal? No thanks. That journal should be for proper quests, where having notes on what you've already learned makes sense. Quests should be interactive and lengthy.

Tasks should be plentiful and have no limit. If I collect 10 swatches of cloth I'm sure the local tailor would give me stuff for them or tell me who to see. Make me interact with something other than a pretty graphical list.

I realize that I'm mostly arguing semantics here but it is something that irritates me about WoW and the games that try and copy it. They build these pretty worlds filled with NPCs then they don't use them.

Anyway, if the game is going to do quests a la WoW then don't have a limit. If I have to have a laundry list of tasks to do I want to be able to put as many on it as I want /shrug

So you would rather have two sections in a journal or quest log that has "Quests" and "Task" just divide them into two different windows? I think you're just arguing semantics like you said.

LOTRO did a good job where they had "quests" for each zone. Then "Chapter Quests" that drove the story.

[Draegan]

Originally Posted by Twobit Whore

They actually have a lot of quests and hubs exactly like this in WoW.

And to reiterate, that is all you do in TBC. That describes WOW 2.0 to a tee perfectly. (As well as the two new Blood Elf and Draenei starting areas.)

They learned a lot with during the first part of the game.

[Dennadyne]

Originally Posted by Draegan

I'm not sure what you dislike? You just want one quest at a time and no side quests? Similar to a single player RPG?

I can't really say. I like the feeling of a longer more drawn out quest that doesn't tell you exactly what to do and have a neat little checklist to hold your hand. Make the reward bigger for a quest that uses your brain. Simple kill 5 bugs quests don't really do it for me.

I realize that's not exactly feasible in all aspects of the game, just my preference.

[Draegan]

So you want to figure out what to do next? I can see that desire. I'm not sure if that's good or bad in the game world. Did it work well in EQ1?

[Dennadyne]

Originally Posted by Azzikai

I won't speak for him but I agree with him. When I play WoW on a lowbie I feel like I'm doing a list of chores or something. Kill 5 bears? Check. Pick up 7 tree branches? Check. Then I run back to the quest dispenser machine and wait for my reward pellet. It feels completely and utterly mechanical.

There is a place for the kill/collect/carry tasks in games but having them as some shopping list sitting in my "quest" journal? No thanks. That journal should be for proper quests, where having notes on what you've already learned makes sense. Quests should be interactive and lengthy.

Tasks should be plentiful and have no limit. If I collect 10 swatches of cloth I'm sure the local tailor would give me stuff for them or tell me who to see. Make me interact with something other than a pretty graphical list.

I realize that I'm mostly arguing semantics here but it is something that irritates me about WoW and the games that try and copy it. They build these pretty worlds filled with NPCs then they don't use them.

Anyway, if the game is going to do quests a la WoW then don't have a limit. If I have to have a laundry list of tasks to do I want to be able to put as many on it as I want /shrug

That pretty much is exactly how I feel. I guess my problem is not that you can have a shit-ton of quests, it's that you NEED them when you have the shopping list shit you described.

I'd rather not have the shopping list shit quests and not have to worry about a quest limit.

[OneofOne]

I don't like any limit on the amount of quests I can do concurrently. But I also worry about you asking this. The last thing I want is to end up with WoW/EQ2/VG again with 50 quests (read: tasks) per zone. I have limited experience with WoW but I'm *really* hating the way EQ2 and VG put you on rails for the quest hubs.

I dunno Ngruk, I guess it depends. Are you looking to dethrone WoW or are you looking for the next *good* game you'd like to play? If you want to dethrone WoW, make the game as easy and painless in every way possible and include good graphics, and you've got a winner. If you want to make a great game you'd like to play, find out what is *fun* and *interesting* and everytime you consider, "How can I make this more accessable to your average player" hit yourself over the head with a baseball bat. WoW and EQ2 already exist, thanks.

[Twobit Whore]

Originally Posted by Draegan

So you want to figure out what to do next? I can see that desire. I'm not sure if that's good or bad in the game world. Did it work well in EQ1?

It works well until someone does it and its posted on MMOhead.com

[Dennadyne]

Originally Posted by Twobit Whore

It works well until someone does it and its posted on MMOhead.com

I'd still prefer EQ's quest methodology. It's pathetic that spoilers aren't even necessary in new MMO's (other than raid strats).

To Draegan: I happen to think it worked very well in EQ1.