Overall Tanking Ability: How does it stack up? - Page 3

feressa · 01-22-2003, 05:16 PM

Hmm, if you're going to have rangers in this list you should have shamen there too.

Benren · 01-22-2003, 10:19 PM

Quote:

What's the best melee to play with tanking ability AND dps in mind? My dilemma is that my bard really can't tank the stuff I need him to, 1 group wise, so I'm going to reroll, and I need a character that can both tank but at the same time do good DPS in a small group situation. Raids aren't really an issue, because all classes contribute to raids.

A few months ago, I would've answered monk here. It still might be a viable option. But now, just from a general standpoint, staring at the game from afar, there really aren't any Tank + DPS classes anymore. You're either one or the other.

Even Furor's suggestion of leveling your bard's AA and getting better gear isn't going to cut what you need it to. A knight with the gear and AA you'd require as a Bard to do moderate DPS is going to do more, and be ten times the tank you are. As far as DPS goes, Bards really are near the bottom of the list. AA makes you respectable, but you can take that time and gear up/AA a different class to do more damage.

So I'll say knight. Paladin if you wanna' tank more, SK if you want a bit more damage (and from the looks of things, I do mean a bit).

Zappo_Crappo · 01-22-2003, 10:29 PM

shammy tank alot better than clerics for some reason!

Quain · 01-22-2003, 10:50 PM

I do fine tanking regular exp group situations as a bard. BoT, PoV, and CoD I've all done within the past two weeks. Sure, we're not the best, and I really wouldn't want to throw me at a BoT mini boss, but the cleric doesn't scream "oom!! plz omg stop" after every pull. And the nice thing about tanking is you'll end up twisting DoTs to hold aggro anyways, so you put out some fair dps. This is all with a rather un-uber set up and only CA3, and CS2 for defensive aa. To top that all off, we have some great pulling tools as well, so we bring a pretty nice all around package to an exp group.

Guild Lackey · 01-22-2003, 10:59 PM

It all depends on the target and situation. Depending on the DPS and mode of attack of the mob, each class's contributions change.

As far as tanking goes, if all members have pretty much equal gear/AA then Warrior is the best, bar none. However, if the warrior's gear isn't the greatest, then other classes can step it up.

I have been in several situations with my monk where I could maintain Agro and out-avoid damage compared to the warrior. This is largely because I play a monk/shammy combo and my gear is specifically suited with that in mind. However, this mainly works for mobs with a greater amount of lesser damage hits. Bring in a mob that puts out a lot of damage or nukes/dots a lot and you run out of hp way too fast to use a monk tank. You need the warriors hitpoints too much.

The Lord Satan · 01-23-2003, 12:04 AM

Fuck all this shit, i've seen every melee class tank well, it's a question of who the fuck is behind the player.

Warriors who are retarded are bad tanks. Beastlords with decent gear who know what the fuck they're doing can tank fine for exp groups.

On the other hand, for raids you need a fucking warrior. Sorry, but when you're getting assraped for 3k a pop you need defensive, i don't give a fuck what your avoidance/mitigation/hp are. Like a believe Furor said in warrior chat one night "when my knights tank it's usually a two second affair"

Bear · 01-23-2003, 12:34 AM

Zappo thats because Bears > all

SirdetVZ · 01-23-2003, 06:08 AM

monks dont tank that good anymore... sure we aviod lots of hits (due to skill caps) but when the mob hits you he offen hits you for max damage.

Ritkhan · 01-23-2003, 12:03 PM

I would go with SKs over Paladins just because of the gameplay aspect. SKs use their offensive spells while tanking and generate extra agro, while Paladins at high levels have useful healing for groups that could be served better in emergencies if they were not main tanking. SKs have no spells to use on others during combat so they are better served for offence. Of course techincally they are equal in most regards.

arax_luminarium · 01-23-2003, 08:23 PM

Just a question on this topic.

Do you guys in FOH (or have you for that matter)
Ever used a Ranger (using wep sh disc),
for the initial 6 seconds of a boss mob fight.?
Just so you can have the MT take over
after the mob is slowed....etc (and the ranger is naturally killed)
????

WarderX · 01-23-2003, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by arax_luminarium
(and the ranger is naturally killed)

No offense, but if that happens after a WS debuff, either your debuff crew or the ranger has down syndrom.

arax_luminarium · 01-23-2003, 08:49 PM

(and the ranger is naturally killed)

Well the reason behind that statement from me..
By my observations only, Feel free to say your experiences.
If you change (in this case the ranger), by
lowering yourself on the mob's agro table..(IE: ranger X casts jolt like mad...etc
I have seen the mob tend to hop about. (prolly
some jolt bug. who knows.)
Hence my original statement. with the thought of not messing with the mobs current hate list and level of hate.

Filandiel · 01-24-2003, 05:54 AM

ass, warrior hits AE taunt for instant agro off the ranger, with at least one support healer on the ranger, thats fucking stupid to die on WS debuff

Apoc CiH · 01-24-2003, 09:48 AM

Monks lost a lot of tanking ability with the nerf. Fully buffed I have like 7400HPs 1600ac and 130 or so AAs. I go down faster than pretty much anyone that can tank in an exp group War/Pal/SK/Ranger. On the same line with rogues as far as taking damage. However I do a lot less damage then the rogue so *shrug* on that.

Spontaneous Cumbustion · 01-24-2003, 12:44 PM

If you aren't tanking better then a rogue or ranger with that AC, plus yer defensive skill caps you are a complete and utter gimp. The nerf barely touched monks of that stature.

01-22-2003, 10:29 PM	#33 (permalink)
Zappo_Crappo Hunka Hunka Burnin luv Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 278 -13 Internets	shammy tank alot better than clerics for some reason! __________________ Zappo: 40 Zealot of Dark Crag

01-22-2003, 10:59 PM	#35 (permalink)
Guild Lackey Samurai Blue Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Omaha Posts: 335 +0 Internets	It all depends on the target and situation. Depending on the DPS and mode of attack of the mob, each class's contributions change. As far as tanking goes, if all members have pretty much equal gear/AA then Warrior is the best, bar none. However, if the warrior's gear isn't the greatest, then other classes can step it up. I have been in several situations with my monk where I could maintain Agro and out-avoid damage compared to the warrior. This is largely because I play a monk/shammy combo and my gear is specifically suited with that in mind. However, this mainly works for mobs with a greater amount of lesser damage hits. Bring in a mob that puts out a lot of damage or nukes/dots a lot and you run out of hp way too fast to use a monk tank. You need the warriors hitpoints too much. __________________

01-23-2003, 12:04 AM	#36 (permalink)
The Lord Satan Registered User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Nobody cares. Posts: 28 -1 Internets	Fuck all this shit, i've seen every melee class tank well, it's a question of who the fuck is behind the player. Warriors who are retarded are bad tanks. Beastlords with decent gear who know what the fuck they're doing can tank fine for exp groups. On the other hand, for raids you need a fucking warrior. Sorry, but when you're getting assraped for 3k a pop you need defensive, i don't give a fuck what your avoidance/mitigation/hp are. Like a believe Furor said in warrior chat one night "when my knights tank it's usually a two second affair" __________________ -The Lord Satan

01-23-2003, 06:08 AM	#38 (permalink)
SirdetVZ Registered User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Sweden Posts: 1 -1 Internets	monks dont tank that good anymore... sure we aviod lots of hits (due to skill caps) but when the mob hits you he offen hits you for max damage. __________________ † † † † † † † † † † † † † † Sirdet Bromstone<Defiant> LvL 65 Transcendent Vallon Zek † † † † † † † † † † † † † †

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01-22-2003, 05:16 PM	#31 (permalink)
feressa Registered User Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 70 -1 Internets	Hmm, if you're going to have rangers in this list you should have shamen there too.

01-22-2003, 10:50 PM	#34 (permalink)
Quain Not gay, flamboyant Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: DeKalb, Illinois Posts: 16 -1 Internets	I do fine tanking regular exp group situations as a bard. BoT, PoV, and CoD I've all done within the past two weeks. Sure, we're not the best, and I really wouldn't want to throw me at a BoT mini boss, but the cleric doesn't scream "oom!! plz omg stop" after every pull. And the nice thing about tanking is you'll end up twisting DoTs to hold aggro anyways, so you put out some fair dps. This is all with a rather un-uber set up and only CA3, and CS2 for defensive aa. To top that all off, we have some great pulling tools as well, so we bring a pretty nice all around package to an exp group.

01-23-2003, 12:34 AM	#37 (permalink)
Bear Registered User Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 51 -1 Internets	Zappo thats because Bears > all

01-23-2003, 12:03 PM	#39 (permalink)
Ritkhan Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 295 -1 Internets	I would go with SKs over Paladins just because of the gameplay aspect. SKs use their offensive spells while tanking and generate extra agro, while Paladins at high levels have useful healing for groups that could be served better in emergencies if they were not main tanking. SKs have no spells to use on others during combat so they are better served for offence. Of course techincally they are equal in most regards.

01-23-2003, 08:23 PM	#40 (permalink)
arax_luminarium Registered User Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 68 -1 Internets	Just a question on this topic. Do you guys in FOH (or have you for that matter) Ever used a Ranger (using wep sh disc), for the initial 6 seconds of a boss mob fight.? Just so you can have the MT take over after the mob is slowed....etc (and the ranger is naturally killed) ????

01-23-2003, 08:49 PM	#42 (permalink)
arax_luminarium Registered User Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 68 -1 Internets	(and the ranger is naturally killed) Well the reason behind that statement from me.. By my observations only, Feel free to say your experiences. If you change (in this case the ranger), by lowering yourself on the mob's agro table..(IE: ranger X casts jolt like mad...etc I have seen the mob tend to hop about. (prolly some jolt bug. who knows.) Hence my original statement. with the thought of not messing with the mobs current hate list and level of hate.

01-24-2003, 05:54 AM	#43 (permalink)
Filandiel Registered User Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 5 -1 Internets	ass, warrior hits AE taunt for instant agro off the ranger, with at least one support healer on the ranger, thats fucking stupid to die on WS debuff

01-24-2003, 09:48 AM	#44 (permalink)
Apoc CiH Registered User Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 17 -1 Internets	Monks lost a lot of tanking ability with the nerf. Fully buffed I have like 7400HPs 1600ac and 130 or so AAs. I go down faster than pretty much anyone that can tank in an exp group War/Pal/SK/Ranger. On the same line with rogues as far as taking damage. However I do a lot less damage then the rogue so shrug on that.

01-24-2003, 12:44 PM	#45 (permalink)
Spontaneous Cumbustion Registered User Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Wilmington, DE, USA Posts: 363	If you aren't tanking better then a rogue or ranger with that AC, plus yer defensive skill caps you are a complete and utter gimp. The nerf barely touched monks of that stature.