38 Studios Copernicus, Mercury and other stuff

[Dumar]

Originally Posted by Agraza

"Real gamer" is too vague not unlike "mmo done right". We're not the core. The most vocal of us are along the fringe toward the hardcore side of the spectrum. The core that is willing to both pay a subscription for a game and finds the majority of wow challenging/interesting is quite different.

As the market expands there will be more games that are both good and intended for our level of interest. It's hard to say whether we're there or not as most MMOs aren't even good regardless of their target audience.

You can maintain good gameplay while focusing on johnny retard. In fact properly focusing on your audience is how you make a good game. We don't make children play adult sports to the same standards. Perhaps 6 year olds should have to hit 100 mph fastballs and shoot a basketball at an NBA height net. They're not capable of keeping that pace. It wouldn't be fun to play or watch, and it wouldn't encourage many of the children to keep playing. The point here is that the inherent difficulty as it relates to the quality of the game is relative to the audience it is intended for.

no, it's not vague. it's someone who enjoys a challenge and takes a commitment to the game. yeah, you can use different terms for it--core gamer, et al. i don't want to get bogged down in definition nonsense. any with any history on this board understand exactly what i'm talking about here.

of course we're not the target audience. the target audience is johnny retard. that's what i've been saying in the past bazillion posts. and i'm sure to him, it's a great gamplay experience. but you have to step back and look objectively; the same objectivity as comparing chess to candyland. to a six year old, candyland is better gameplay obviously, but there's an objectivity that's required to say 'chess may be a little more involving and complex game than candyland'. you need to tell the truth and say that. the same way the truth needs to be said of wow and every other game out in mmo space.

if it's designed for retards, more than likely the gameplay will reflect that--and guess what? it does.

[Tananthalas]

Despite your distrust of capital letters, your Candy Land/Chess analogy is pretty decent.

[Dumar]

i actually find capital letters annoying.

usually in life, people enjoy something that's hard or challenging, whether it's a chess match vs a great opponent or anything else (even if it's something outside their control, say sky diving). on the whole, many people enjoy risk and challenge.

but turn to the game industry, and you see nothing but easy and totally risk-averse everywhere, especially in mmo space. anything that involves risk or challenge is mocked as 'tedious' and is eventually thrown-out or dumb down to the point of trivializing it. this is seen as successful game design because it makes the most money. and it makes the most money because every retard from here to the moon can not only play it, but succeed in it.

now, what i DO NOT get is the mmo vets, esp on this board, who play these games clamor for the same shoveled-up trash that the idiotic 6 six year old candyland kid wants: easy, no-loss, and risk-averse to the point of absurdity. don't you want a challenge? don't you want to take a risk and maybe, just maybe, gain or lose something important? don't you want gameplay that is impactful and meaningful?

give me a 3+hr dungeon crawl, or a house and items to be stolen or lost, and territory to gain and lose. give me these things because i want to feel the feeling of not just succeeding where risk and challenge is involved, but also the feeling of loss when i fuck up. THAT is great gameplay.

you know what wow is. everyone knows what wow provides. tell the truth and call it like it is, and the industry may, just may start progress instead of regress.

[Twobit Whore]

Take this tired tripe to another thread. This has nothing to do with 38 Studios.

[Ngruk]

Originally Posted by Utnayan

Getting this back on track because trying to get Zehn to be creative in his flames is about as sorry as killing an innocent puppy for dinner in Vietnam.

While 38 can definitely succeed with a new IP, and while nothing has been announced yet, I was wondering if the thought came to mind to use past IP's from Salvatore, if you can even say anything on that.

Whether it was beat to death or not, the first books I ever read as a kid were about Breunor, Drizzt, Cattie Brie, etc. That series of books and David Edding's Sparhawk series were really the only ones I could get into, no matter how many other Forgotten Realms books I tried.

Basically it would be cool to know if that IP was considered, or if not now, will it ever be? An MMORPG in that fantasy scope would be awesome to see come to life.

It did, a ton. However, the nightmare negotiations that would have had to take place, and the price tag on those IP's, was not a path to go down. Hasbro/WotC hold the rights to the FR and Drizzt.

After we nail this, and make billions, we'll pursue that one...

I for one want to see Menzoberranzon in an MMO....

[Bloodget]

I, for one, don't need to see Menzoberranzon in a mmo, as mmo towns are made of 3 streets, 4 vendors, 1 blacksmith, few closed houses (for may be 10 families total in the whole town) and if lucky 1 pub.

[Agraza]

I always imagined it was a pretty big place, and that Drizzt's business only involved the social elite. The houses had to have been fed by a large population of peasants, and they each had private armies. There were also a few other races present as servants or foes. Maybe I'm thinking of something else. /boggle

[Araxen]

The entire Underdark could be a MMO by itself. Also being beholden to WOTC would suck ass and I dont hold out any hope for any D&D MMO to be any good. It's alot better to be close to D&D like and using your own rules like EQ did.

[roger]

neriak !

[Ninen]

As much as I dislike the idea that I game I would otherwise enjoy is being built for the Johny Retards out there, those games have their place.

Hrm, I was going to write something about how the biggest problem is that WoW (Candyland) really doesn't teach the Johnys the skills they want/need to succeed at a more advanced game; but then it hit me. Call this crazy tinfoil hat talk; but since Blizzard doesn't actually have a "Chess" game out, it's in their best corporate interests to *NOT* enable the Johnys, to NOT give them the skills to enjoy something more advanced than Candyland.

[Wuzit]

Didn't say anything about DemonWars Saga though.....

[Araxen]

Corona MMO would be awesome..

[Ngruk]

If you, or anyone you know, is looking for work in the industry check out the latest postings!
Check it out here....

[Screamfeeder]

Originally Posted by Ngruk

If you, or anyone you know, is looking for work in the industry check out the latest postings!
Check it out here....

Bleh Maya.

You guys need to get on board with allowing your artists to use the software of their choice and then just export the .objs to Maya for whatever implementation into your engine you need.

EDIT-and just noticed you have 3Ds Max and Mudbox requirements for characters and animation, but are using Maya exclusively for environment. That seems a tad odd if not backwards.

[rangoth]

I just saw the new Halloween munch, that damn green blob better be in the game somehow cause the design, artwork, and animation of that stupid thing is just awesome. I know it's just a stupid web monster, but if that is an indication of the art style and creativity you plan to bring, I think it's safe to say you at least have the visuals in the bag.