[WoW]WotLK

[Praetor]

Originally Posted by Deathwing

I'd be more open to paying for the Benefactor's Bar if the mods there weren't trying to live up to their namesake in every way possible.

They don't even own their hosting anymore, so really, "their" forum is a debatable topic.

I mean, for fuck sake, they suck every bit of fun out that forum. Even the infractions are canned responses.

Honestly, 99% of infractions are the result of reports made by ordinary users -- it's the community policing itself, and moderators filtering out the most inane reports ("he's disagreeing with me lol, ban him"). If you think our forums have slipped (and I agree, they have -- there's no way to have tens of thousands of users and keep a quality level anywhere near what it was when it was a haven for a few hundred theorycrafters and high-end raiders), believe me, they'd be a dozen times worse if every person who arrived and made a first post of "hi can u guys plz tell me whats the best spec to top dms??" didn't get smacked down for it.

Anyway, wasn't this thread about an MMO?

[Pyros]

That's probably cause they have to handle way too many fucking infractions compared to like 2years ago or whatever. I mean nowadays like every page has a warning or an infraction, and yes it's much more filled with idiots than it used to be. You still find decent posts, but there's so many retards on there too, the only saving thing really is the bans, it does reduce the amount of retardation.

As for the DK changes, it's probably still up in the air, and I wouldn't bet on them leaving it like that, mostly because they're not too fond of the idea of having DK tanks just DPSing in frost presence, which is pretty much what happens now that the tree cooldowns are on 2mins. They might add some new stuff altogether, canned beta ideas and what not. Arguably however, it seems DKs could be the worst tanks currently. Not by much mind you, and definitely less than the difference between DKs and pld/war currently on live(but reversed), but still the worst, barring very specific fights. Who knows how it'll end up though.

One thing is the 10% parry have a lot of side repercussions that add up. You lose more bone shield charges, or get less spell deflection procs, you generate less threat(less parry haste, less runestrike procs), stuff like that. Also arguably the cooldowns power were based on a 1min cooldown, now that the cooldown doubled, the power should probably increase to compensate. Maybe not double, but still be better, UA is a pretty shitty 2mins cooldown.

[c8fe]

Originally Posted by Believe

With 10% parry missing, I still feel pretty comfortable in my Bone Shield staying up for quite a bit. Raid buffed, I was pushing 70-80% avoidance pretty easily.

I may try out a build with Vampiric Blood, but it just feels to me that you have to give up a lot in other trees to get it (the cooldown increase to 2min makes it a little less attractive also). Overall though I just feel more comfortable with an Unholy build. I've been Unholy tank specced since I made my character (even leveled up as such). I'm not really against changing builds, I think it's just that at this point, it doesn't feel like any build has a HUGE advantage over any other, except for how it deals damage.

This is basically the exact way I feel except about frost. I've tried other tank specs and they feel extremely awkward and choppy when compared to frost for me. Really comes down to personal preference in my opinion because all specs are "viable", and bone armor may have gone from the worst (imo) to best tanking talent entirely because assuming you can maintain high avoidance after the blade barrier nerf it is defniately possible to keep it going outside the 20/30 second duration UBA/vampiric are limited to and keep a nice uptime that can be filled in with IBF/trinkets.



In all honesty, the sky is not falling, DK's are going from overpowered to tuned, I hate the nerfs as much as anyone else but it is definately best to wait and see. EJ loves to make theorys and bitch but in reality until some extensive testing is put in it's hard to tell how major these changes are. If the +5% DR stacks on top of our armor which can easily be capped at the moment it may potentially provide an equal damage reduction as 10% parry did, it really depends upon alot of things and until it can be tested it's impossible to tell. Considering blizzard also undid the DW nerfs it is obvious they are at least monitoring their changes to some extent and if its overkill it will hopefully be fixed before it hits live

[The Ancient]

Originally Posted by c8fe

bone armor may have gone from the worst (imo) to best tanking talent entirely because assuming you can maintain high avoidance after the blade barrier nerf it is defniately possible to keep it going outside the 20/30 second duration UBA/vampiric are limited to and keep a nice uptime that can be filled in with IBF/trinkets.

I'm confused how you could think Bone Shield is the worst buff on live when we have more avoidance and somehow becomes the best when we lose avoidance and it won't stay up as long.

[Heylel Teomim]

It surprises me to hear GC say that they think DKs and druids made sartharion too easy an encounter. I can only assume what they mean by that is that they never expected sarth3d to be killable until patch 3.1. That jives better with how they talked before it went live.

That leads me to conclude that many of the tanking nerfs are reactions to the unexpectedly effective tactics that players worked up to beat the encounter.

[The Ancient]

Where's the nerf to VW tanks?!?

[Parker]

This?

Voidwalker: The health bonus on this pet has been reduced from 60% to 10%.

edit: WoW -> Test Realm Patch Notes

[The Ancient]

Haha, that'd do it.

[Vinen]

Originally Posted by Heylel Teomim

It surprises me to hear GC say that they think DKs and druids made sartharion too easy an encounter. I can only assume what they mean by that is that they never expected sarth3d to be killable until patch 3.1. That jives better with how they talked before it went live.

That leads me to conclude that many of the tanking nerfs are reactions to the unexpectedly effective tactics that players worked up to beat the encounter.

Sartharion 3D25 is still easily beatable with a Warrior tank. It just requires your DPS... to actually DPS while having awareness and not getting themselves killed while pushing out the maximum dps possible.

It's possible to kill Tenebron before the whelps spawn, for example. I *think* we normally drop Shadron before the 4th OP Breath. I've only tanked 3D25 once and that was last week where I was a gimic HP tank due to our other tanks forcing me to do it -.-; Coincidentally, our melee decided to be melee and a few eat a voidzone like retards. I think we spent 7~8 breaths in the critical period. Still wasn't hard. We don't really stack our raids. We have more then we need of healing, more then we need of tanks, etc...

F, tanking Sartharion. Drake tanking is so much more enjoyable.

[Praetor]

Originally Posted by Heylel Teomim

It surprises me to hear GC say that they think DKs and druids made sartharion too easy an encounter. I can only assume what they mean by that is that they never expected sarth3d to be killable until patch 3.1. That jives better with how they talked before it went live.

That leads me to conclude that many of the tanking nerfs are reactions to the unexpectedly effective tactics that players worked up to beat the encounter.

Drastically underestimating 25-man raid DPS is what made Sarth+3 easier than intended, I think. That's the core reason the 10-man version is harder -- you simply have to take more breaths and deal with the "hard" part of the fight for a longer period of time. By contrast, in 25-man on good nights we've killed Shadron before Vesperon landed, and literally had zero breaths that needed to be timered through. If the drakes all had 30-40% more hp in Heroic, then it would be a harder fight than the 10-man version.

The fact that DKs and druids can soak more breaths without external assistance than warrior and paladin tanks can further compounds the issue, of course.

[Alamando]

Originally Posted by Praetor

The fact that DKs and druids can soak more breaths without external assistance than warrior and paladin tanks can further compounds the issue, of course.

Which seems less like a tanking issue and more like a stupid-fucking-gimmick-cooldown issue.

[James]

Originally Posted by Vinen

F, tanking Sartharion. Drake tanking is so much more enjoyable.

Not by much. It's all about the add tanking, that shit is hella fun.

[Vinen]

Originally Posted by James

Not by much. It's all about the add tanking, that shit is hella fun.

My guild made me do that once. They found the one tanking spot that will make me bitch. THX no 360 Damage Aggro ability.

Originally Posted by Alamando

Which seems less like a tanking issue and more like a stupid-fucking-gimmick-cooldown issue.

Druids don't need cooldowns for it, least I really didn't. It's just our retarded high HP and ability to remain Crit Immune while stacking green FR Gear.

[Hatorade]

Originally Posted by Tuco

Lowk: Try to get on some raids where they are short one or two healers. 10man naxx is a lot of fun with two healers and downright boring with three if the other two are on the ball. Same with 10man malygos and 2D sarth.

Use those meters to show off.

As for which fights are good for that, Sarth and Malygos are good, as well as Kt, Sapph and 4H in that order.

This, did 10 man Naxx last night with the guild. Resto Druid(me) and Holy Priest were the only healers. We got the Undying achievement as well, was probably the best time I have had in WoW in years. Will get the wow web stats up when they get posted.

[Camerous]

Sorry to interrupt this regularly scheduled circle jerk but I just got this sent to me and laughed my ass off and decided to share with you guys.

Funnies

yes I know it's from 2006 but it's still funny. :-)