[WoW] WotLK - Beta Patch Notes

[Zehn - Vhex]

Well, the argument holy paladins are using now is it's not much different then what holy priests did for almost 3 years before holy nova/circle of healing/etc...became non-shit. The best holy spec was a holy/disc hybrid because the top tier talents in both trees were complete ass.

The resolution shouldn't be nerfing the shit out of the talents in the hybrid spec, but making the top tier talents non-shit. Beacon of light should cause any and all heals to hit the target, not just the paladins own effective healing. The cleanse talent should give holy shock a 33/66/100% chance to dispel one magic/disease/poison effect on a friendly target or one magic effect on a hostile target.

The haste/range judgements should be rolled up into one talent and a new 9th tier talent added that increases the amount your spellpower affects holy light/flash of light/holy shock by 35% for 5 points to bring it more in line with the other healing tree's.

[Makata]

Originally Posted by Zehn - Vhex

The cleanse talent should give holy shock a 33/66/100% chance to dispel one magic/disease/poison effect on a friendly target or one magic effect on a hostile target.

Right because we need ANOTHER offensive dispeller in arena. And saving a GCD every 6 seconds by adding cleanse to holy shock is pretty suspect too considering the rather large buff to its healing throughput and its ability to trigger an instant cast 8k heal 40% of the time.

Especially with the rather generous spell pushback change pvp needs to be moving away from instant cast spells or kick/pummel need to be redesigned to actually have a use against instant spammers.

[Zehn - Vhex]

Ultimately it would be nice if they did add more incentive to go deeper into prot/holy. Right now sheath of light is very enticing for protadins right now as well as hammer of the righteous doesn't really fit into the current threat rotation. It would be nice if instead they changed it into some kind of paladin-shield reflect or something. Or even better, something we've all wanted for forever and a fucking day, "Stalwart Casting" or some shit which allows you to parry/dodge/block while casting as well. That way the paladin 'gimic' would be being able to heal himself (albeit for shoddy amounts) while tanking.

I would pay cash money for that instead of swipe.

[Zest]

Right. They should implement a talent or something so you can attach a silence to your interrupts.

8k HLs are an underestimate... and just because I want to see you fume, the template Paladin can offensively HS and Judge for 4k on a crit.

[Xequecal]

Originally Posted by Zehn - Vhex

The resolution shouldn't be nerfing the shit out of the talents in the hybrid spec, but making the top tier talents non-shit. Beacon of light should cause any and all heals to hit the target, not just the paladins own effective healing. The cleanse talent should give holy shock a 33/66/100% chance to dispel one magic/disease/poison effect on a friendly target or one magic effect on a hostile target.

That's an incentive to bring less Paladins, not more. That just brings us to raids consisting of one Paladin for Kings and Beacon on the tank while the rest of your healing squad is seven Shaman facerolling on Chain Heal.

[Mageling]

Originally Posted by Makata

Right because we need ANOTHER offensive dispeller in arena. And saving a GCD every 6 seconds by adding cleanse to holy shock is pretty suspect too considering the rather large buff to its healing throughput and its ability to trigger an instant cast 8k heal 40% of the time.

Especially with the rather generous spell pushback change pvp needs to be moving away from instant cast spells or kick/pummel need to be redesigned to actually have a use against instant spammers.

Stop right there. Stop the fuck right there goddamnit.

You were the one who bitched FURIOUSLY about the problems of Paladins having to cast every one of their goddamn spells and getting locked out. Don't go talking about "generous spell pushback" when you obviously haven't even bothered looking at the changes to spell pushback in 3.0+

You're going to get two pushbacks and then you're golden. The problem is the fact that you have a 1.5 second cast and a 3.0 (2.5 after you manage to get another off) before you get spell locked and you get to sit on your thumb for a while.

Get the fuck back in your cave goddamnit. Get back there right fucking now.

[Drtyrm]

I propose that Makata is the first real life person to master the skill of Doublethink as described in George Orwell's 1984.

The power of holding two contradictory beliefs in one's mind simultaneously, and accepting both of them . . . . To tell deliberate lies while genuinely believing in them, to forget any fact that has become inconvenient, and then, when it becomes necessary again, to draw it back from oblivion for just so long as it is needed, to deny the existence of objective reality and all the while to take account of the reality which one denies — all this is indispensably necessary. Even in using the word doublethink it is necessary to exercise doublethink. For by using the word one admits that one is tampering with reality; by a fresh act of doublethink one erases this knowledge; and so on indefinitely, with the lie always one leap ahead of the truth.

[Believe]

Well, finally got my hands on a beta account (thanks to a friend). Must say, Death Knights are pretty good. I like the Rune system. The starting area is fucking top notch. Everyone deserved to run through it just for the awesomeness, even if they don't plan to level beyond 58.

I don't think I'm going to level the Death Knight anymore than 58 at the moment (because I'd rather have levels that actually matter). So I'll probably play a pre-made so I can still contribute in testing.

[Zehn - Vhex]

Stop responding to Makata. Notice how I didn't respond to him despite him being retarded after my post? I do the same thing with people like Lyenae and Cad. While I certainly miss pointing out how terribly wrong they are about everything, I began to feel like Utnayan with how often I was repeating myself.

Originally Posted by Xequecal

That's an incentive to bring less Paladins, not more. That just brings us to raids consisting of one Paladin for Kings and Beacon on the tank while the rest of your healing squad is seven Shaman facerolling on Chain Heal.

Not really. Yes, you'll bring one healadin, but I could very well see raids bringing one if not two protadins and if they up retadin dps, we could see an ideal raid consisting of a 1 holy, 1 prot and 1 ret.

The issue of stacking healers 7~11 high when only 4~5 specs in the game are heal-oriented needs to go and is really more of a relic of the pre-tbc days when off-spec healers were a waste of oxygen. Now that feral/prot/shadow and enhance/elemental are worthwhile...we may hopefully see the day when the only class-double up is priest with one holy (for raw healing) and one discipline (which should have more talents geared towards reducing damage dealt to the raid and buffing peoples damage abilities).

And it would fit more into the proper mold now that we'll be looking at 4 tanking classes. 3~4 tanks/4~5 healers/14~18 dps should be what raid encounters are based on since it follow closely to the 1:1:3 precedent set by 5 and 10 man dungeons.

[Goliath]

Uhh so anyone have any tips for a poor premade copied Hunter on Murmer who got the coolest looking pet in the game from Azuremyst Isle, then let him die, then couldn't revive him because of course you don't start with it with premades and I didn't quest it and now I can't quest it because he's dead and I can't get him alive because the spirit healers in Wintergrasp are all broken? Lol sucks.

Edit: Got him. There's apparently one spirit healer that works, in chilld quagmire. What a clusterF.

[Makata]

Originally Posted by Zest

8k HLs are an underestimate... and just because I want to see you fume, the template Paladin can offensively HS and Judge for 4k on a crit.

I doubt it will go live as such so don't worry.

Originally Posted by Mageling

Stop right there. Stop the fuck right there goddamnit.

You were the one who bitched FURIOUSLY about the problems of Paladins having to cast every one of their goddamn spells and getting locked out. Don't go talking about "generous spell pushback" when you obviously haven't even bothered looking at the changes to spell pushback in 3.0+

You're going to get two pushbacks and then you're golden. The problem is the fact that you have a 1.5 second cast and a 3.0 (2.5 after you manage to get another off) before you get spell locked and you get to sit on your thumb for a while.

Get the fuck back in your cave goddamnit. Get back there right fucking now.

There's this thing called conc aura. There's a talent to improve it. Your 1.5 will still be a 1.5 because the 2 pushbacks will be each reduced to 0%. Paladins like all healers and frankly all casters need SOME instants. Imperative word here: SOME. Never stopping to use a cast time spell is absurd. At least druids heals can be dispelled and can be caught in a low armor stance.

[Goliath]

Somebody mentioned the premade gear sucking, but I think it's pretty good. In fact it might be too good for being all basic PvP stuff that everyone and there mother will have...guess it makes no difference if everyone can get it. The armor set is level 1 blue arena, the rest is purple bg epics.

[Emrok]

uh your stats are less then mine at 70, its safe to say that pm 80 shit is junk

[Goliath]

Originally Posted by Emrok

uh your stats are less then mine at 70, its safe to say that pm 80 shit is junk

Well if you aren't in beta and aren't informed you can't really talk and even if you are you are exagerrating. The diminishing return on stats is super ridiculous from 70-80. You lose over 2% crit a level. This premade stuff is all the very basic of Wotlk. First arena (blues) and epics from battlegrounds that most will have day 1 of level 80 from saved honor. So it may suck in comparison to some t6 shit. But relatively speaking it's pretty good and possibly too good for the very first wave of arena/bg crap.

[Lithose]

Originally Posted by Emrok

uh your stats are less then mine at 70, its safe to say that pm 80 shit is junk

It is safe to say you don't know how stats scale down.