WOW, Season 4. Arena or GTFO

[Sunder]

"Objectives across multiple zones" would definitely cure the population imbalance problem and not simply amplify it. Yup, absolutely. You fucking moron.

[The Ancient]

Leave it to Dumar to post something so dumb Sunder and I agree on it.

[Sunder]

Originally Posted by The Ancient

Leave it to Dumar to post something so dumb Sunder and I agree on it.

The man is a uniter, not a divider!

[Dumar]

Originally Posted by Sunder

"Objectives across multiple zones" would definitely cure the population imbalance problem and not simply amplify it. Yup, absolutely. You fucking moron.

a group of 5 gets a quest from a newly opened zone.

3 of the 5 must fight x npc in y zone. 2 of the 5 must do something else in another zone. secure z or fight q. the possibilities are endless.

that's not a solution. it's a trivial example. real solutions take time and money. blizzard has both, but will spend neither.

[Lambourne]

I think splitting arena off from the rest of the world would be better for both arena and the rest of the game

Each arena player gets the same arena-only gearset. Instantly you have a level playing field where people can prove their skill rather than their gear advantage. This also makes it much easier to balance classes for arena play, as Blizzard only needs to adjust the arena gear without it affecting the rest of the game.

Battleground players no longer have to do arena in order to be competitive in battlegrounds. PVE raids are more meaningful when you can't get equivalent/better gear from doing arena 30 mins a week.

To me it seems a clear case of win-win and I can't think of a reason why Blizzard isn't doing it this way.

[l0z]

You must defeat x unique teams to get points for the week. x = at least 3, I'd say 5. Can't win? Stop resetting your team to 1500.

You cannot be matched with a team that you've played in the last y, where y=whatever number of hours you prefer.

You do not get points and / or your personal rating does not change when you change teams for z weeks.

Its not that hard.

Also keep in mind that Blizzard likes to keep things simple, Kreugen.

It's part of their overarching design philosophy, and always has been. Introducing a heinous ruleset as to what gets you points and what won't isn't something you're likely to see them implement.

So what you'd need to see is something like this:

• Sign up & play -> get stuff based on how well you played.
• Always get something for playing.

I think some changes as to how things work would help out, for sure. Locking people to one team each week once they've participated in a game on that team (in each bracket) would probably solve a good chunk of the issues arising from point selling, as much of the issue with point sellers playing lower brackets arises from keeping multiple farm teams afloat. You'd still have people wanting to sell points/rating doing so in brackets they don't really play in, of course. But at least it would be limited to one team.

In my opinion, the key issues that detract from my arena experience:

• Point selling teams playing well below their bracket.
• Class balance for certain classes must be tuned. Preferably only for the arena rather than overall balance.
• Gear barrier to new teams is too painful.
• The amount and variety of CC is too great. CC & PvP do not mix well.
• Arena maps are poorly tuned for casting classes that require LoS without instant cast spells.

[Sunder]

Originally Posted by Dumar

a group of 5 gets a quest from a newly opened zone.

3 of the 5 must fight x npc in y zone. 2 of the 5 must do something else in another zone. secure z or fight q. the possibilities are endless.

that's not a solution. it's a trivial example. real solutions take time and money. blizzard has both, but will spend neither.

What is the opposing faction doing to counter this?
Is the quest repeatable?
Where is the PvP?
Once "captured" what can the other faction do to change that?
How can the first faction defend their conquest?
How can you be this fucking stupid?

Edit: wait, I know. You aren't a dev. But you play one on these boards.

[Dumar]

Originally Posted by l0z

Also keep in mind that Blizzard likes to keep things simple, Kreugen.

It's part of their overarching design philosophy, and always has been.

they've already failed this goal. wow is not a well designed system, but a giant mish mash thrown together over 4 years. this is very common and is probably the most common case study you'll see in literally every architecture design analysis treatment. design team creates a good product , years later system needs massive additions to keep with demand, designers didn't forsee implications of design decisions.

what do designers do? throw another system onto the existing systems. in wow, this can be seen as armor tokens, arena points, honor points, badges, and whatever other crap they'll throw in.

it works, but it's not good design.

[Zehn - Vhex]

Ever so apt...

[Dumar]

Originally Posted by Sunder

What is the opposing faction doing to counter this?
Is the quest repeatable?
Where is the PvP?
Once "captured" what can the other faction do to change that?
How can the first faction defend their conquest?
How can you be this fucking stupid?

Edit: wait, I know. You aren't a dev. But you play one on these boards.

repeatable quests are a supreme nono. this is an mmo, not a single player game. even single player games don't have repeatable quests. if you can't design a game without literally the worst excuse for either a) lack of content or b) lack of ingenuity in creating content by putting in "repeatable quests" then maybe you should seek another career. i deplore "repeatable quests" even more than the staticness.

how many times have i said i'm not a game designer? you're missing the point.. again.

[Sunder]

Originally Posted by Dumar

how many times have i said i'm not a game designer? you're missing the point.. again.

It's quite obvious you aren't a game designer because your feeble attempts at even the most basic designs are utter shit. Stop trying. You fail every time.

[Grady]

Originally Posted by Sunder

What is the opposing faction doing to counter this?
Is the quest repeatable?
Where is the PvP?
Once "captured" what can the other faction do to change that?
How can the first faction defend their conquest?
How can you be this fucking stupid?

Edit: wait, I know. You aren't a dev. But you play one on these boards.

Well, obviously the population on realms would be completely balanced player wise with equal amounts of people on both factions wanting to PVP. Duh!

Battlegrounds are fine, as far as they go. You go in, get significantly more points for winning, get out and spend said points on gear. There certainly could be more variety on the BG front, but they've pretty much given up on the only halfway decent PVP idea they had in favor of the arenas.

Arenas are an unmitigated disaster. First, it's about who get get out of LOS the best against ranged classes. Second, if it's meant to be an actual measure of skill, which under the current system it isn't, then there shouldn't be gear differences. Go in, pick a set for your spec, and play. Finally, the nerfs needed to "fix" arena play are fucking ridiculous. For example, Druids cyclone range decrease is retarded in PVE. Why it's not treated differently PVE is beyond me, other than the lazy fucking cunts who develop the game are indeed lazy fucking cunts. There are numerous other examples for that too, included unneeded buffs and nerfs to many classes just so they can be represented in the flawed and shitty arenas.

[Dumar]

Originally Posted by Sunder

It's quite obvious you aren't a game designer because your feeble attempts at even the most basic designs are utter shit. Stop trying. You fail every time.

so.. you base the design quality of the schematic of a house on my crayon coloring?

jesus christ honestly.. do you not see the forest i'm describing? do you not understand the implications of what i'm trying to say? "basic designs are utter shit" what i said is NOT a "basic design". i'm sitting here telling you about the forest that blizzard HAS the capability to produce (hopefully), but instead you're arguing with me about the bark on ONE FUCKING TREE.

[Sunder]

Fuck you are dense. YOUR DESIGNS ARE FUCKING SHIT. All of them. From the forest right down to the leaves on the trees. You couldn't design a fucking square if I started you off with 3 of the sides.

[Tullaeniel]

The Blizzard Arena is a Mini-Game at best. It should be a server designed for Arena. Max Level characters, No Respec Costs, All Arena, Honor gear is simply purchased at no cost from an Arena vendor. Now open up a ladder system and let people come up with exploits and gayness in their own little world that doesn't effect the rest of it.

Otherwise, start banning people who exploit the system. No matter how acceptable it becomes I will always full support banning gold buyers, point sellers, or any other assholes who exploit in game mechanics for personal gain.