WOW, Season 4. Arena or GTFO

[Zehn - Vhex]

Given the two extremes Blizzard has created so far, personally, I'll take 2 minute queue times against moderately apathetic enemies vs. the 2 hour queue times against pre-mades that end up just steamrolling us.

There are better alternatives of course, but y'know...it's Blizzard and they give fuck all about anything but Arena now.

[Adrain]

Originally Posted by TheCutlery

That would require them to watch a fucking node. 13 horde at farm, being the only node we have, does not equal 60k damage.

I know what defense looks like. I know what a fucking hunter pet takes to kill, maybe you should shut the fuck up and quit trying to sound like you've got all the answers, k?

Obviously, sounds like you kept the farm, more then you managed to bring to bear, and sure but only because you asked so nicely.

[Xequecal]

It's a good thing Blizzard concentrates on arena. World PvP that gives character advancement rewards for participating in it is guaranteed to fail. Mainly because the elite players will figure out it's far more efficient to farm noobs repeatedly than it is to actually fight people on their level. That of course drives people away because they hate getting farmed for no benefit and it just falls apart.

[Makata]

Originally Posted by TheCutlery

I say bring on the arena requirements for BG gear. I wasn't sure how I felt about it at the beginning, but I'm all for it now. This will require people to either fucking improve or get the fuck out. They'll need to learn how to play, or they're not going to have anything to buy. Either is preferable to the current situation.

The fact someone can still have this opinion baffles me. Great on paper, retarded in execution. What are the 45-55% of the population who can't even make the 1550 requirement going to do? Really think they're going to continue arena'ing once they get their whooping three items? Remove the 1550- crowd and all the sudden the 1600 crowd becomes the 1300 crowd and the cycle repeats. Obviously it won't be the landslide fall of arena, but you have to be a fucking idiot not to realize it's going to cripple the system not benefit it.

Ultimately you have to ask, what is some scrub wearing 3/5 s4 2/3rds the way through the season do to negatively affect you? Hurts your epeen? I used to be all about the epeen, in fact in many ways I still am. But when you try and swing your huge e-dick around and make all the smaller e-dicks leave the party, all the sudden yours becomes the smallest.

Honestly, enjoy your arena games. I'm gonna be giving resto druid a shot if I can manage to gear him enough but past that, I'm done with anything resembling serious pvp.

[Agraza]

Originally Posted by Makata

...when you try and swing your huge e-dick around and make all the smaller e-dicks leave the party, all the sudden yours becomes the smallest.

That's awesome. Thank you. Seriously, awesome.

[TheCutlery]

Originally Posted by Makata

The fact someone can still have this opinion baffles me. Great on paper, retarded in execution. What are the 45-55% of the population who can't even make the 1550 requirement going to do? Really think they're going to continue arena'ing once they get their whooping three items? Remove the 1550- crowd and all the sudden the 1600 crowd becomes the 1300 crowd and the cycle repeats. Obviously it won't be the landslide fall of arena, but you have to be a fucking idiot not to realize it's going to cripple the system not benefit it.

Ultimately you have to ask, what is some scrub wearing 3/5 s4 2/3rds the way through the season do to negatively affect you? Hurts your epeen? I used to be all about the epeen, in fact in many ways I still am. But when you try and swing your huge e-dick around and make all the smaller e-dicks leave the party, all the sudden yours becomes the smallest.

Honestly, enjoy your arena games. I'm gonna be giving resto druid a shot if I can manage to gear him enough but past that, I'm done with anything resembling serious pvp.

I have that opinion because I actually enjoy mass PvP. I do NOT enjoy the current incarnation of BG's where I can do 6 fold the damage of OTHER MELEE , and when I bring up their shitass play, I get "Well, damage doesn't mean victory." Uhh, okay, I guess you do have a point. Damage does not equate to victory, but you sure as fuck can't heal someone to death.

I don't give 2 shits about scrubs wearing gladiator gear. I just don't. I'll get it faster than them and i'll always be better than them, so I just don't give a fuck. What I do give a fuck about is looking around my team and knowing that we're going to lose because these people can't be bothered to FUCKING TRY. The vast majority of the last few AB's I've been in have been me + a healer fighting 5-7 alliance at a node while the other 13 horde road fight or zerg a node we already own, or something of that nature. Fuck it, i'm fucking sick of it. We used to be able to follow a strategy. We used to be able to realize that if there's 10 alliance attacking one of our nodes, you fucking go behind them and take what they abandoned. That doesn't even register in these mouth breathers anymore.

Make it so people have to give a shit. Make it so they have to either improve, or join some fucking Kara pug that wipes on Moroes 6 times. I'm sick of logging on at 9am for a couple of games after work and getting fucking worked over by just garbage alliance. There is an entire segment of the player base that enjoys PvP for the sake of PvP. It's not a good idea to completely alienate those people so that Johnny Noskill can get some fucking epix. Give him epix, that's fine. Don't ruin my BG's.

[Gnome Eater]

Originally Posted by Makata

Ultimately you have to ask, what is some scrub wearing 3/5 s4 2/3rds the way through the season do to negatively affect you? Hurts your epeen? I used to be all about the epeen, in fact in many ways I still am. But when you try and swing your huge e-dick around and make all the smaller e-dicks leave the party, all the sudden yours becomes the smallest.

Because gear in MMORPG's is meant to signify some progression. You cannot wipe your way to best in slot PvE gear, why should you be able to wipe your way to full PvP gear?

Do you think that if retard mctardo takes 24 of his casual retarded buddies and keeps trying kalecgos without ever getting him below 50%, they are entitled to his drops just because they tried?

Honestly, enjoy your arena games. I'm gonna be giving resto druid a shot if I can manage to gear him enough but past that, I'm done with anything resembling serious pvp.

Any worthwhile PvP'er can easily get over 2k rating currently. If you cannot, you are not very good at the game. If you play a spec that isn't very viable, just respec for arena. I am shadow in PvE, but I have a full suit of shadow/holy arena gear, and mostly play as disc. Almost every class has a viable spec in 2s and 3s.

[Zerai]

Originally Posted by Gnome Eater

Do you think that if retard mctardo takes 24 of his casual retarded buddies and keeps trying kalecgos without ever getting him below 50%, they are entitled to his drops just because they tried?

Kalecgos also doesn't get harder over time.

[Miele]

Originally Posted by TheCutlery

I have that opinion because I actually enjoy mass PvP. I do NOT enjoy the current incarnation of BG's where I can do 6 fold the damage of OTHER MELEE , and when I bring up their shitass play, I get "Well, damage doesn't mean victory." Uhh, okay, I guess you do have a point. Damage does not equate to victory, but you sure as fuck can't heal someone to death.

I don't give 2 shits about scrubs wearing gladiator gear. I just don't. I'll get it faster than them and i'll always be better than them, so I just don't give a fuck. What I do give a fuck about is looking around my team and knowing that we're going to lose because these people can't be bothered to FUCKING TRY. The vast majority of the last few AB's I've been in have been me + a healer fighting 5-7 alliance at a node while the other 13 horde road fight or zerg a node we already own, or something of that nature. Fuck it, i'm fucking sick of it. We used to be able to follow a strategy. We used to be able to realize that if there's 10 alliance attacking one of our nodes, you fucking go behind them and take what they abandoned. That doesn't even register in these mouth breathers anymore.

Make it so people have to give a shit. Make it so they have to either improve, or join some fucking Kara pug that wipes on Moroes 6 times. I'm sick of logging on at 9am for a couple of games after work and getting fucking worked over by just garbage alliance. There is an entire segment of the player base that enjoys PvP for the sake of PvP. It's not a good idea to completely alienate those people so that Johnny Noskill can get some fucking epix. Give him epix, that's fine. Don't ruin my BG's.

It all boils down to rewards for losing and it's sad. On my server AV at 60 is a fucking blast, it seems to me all PvP'ers made an alt specifically to play there. Every now and then a mouth breather start saying "rush you idiots" and he gets the "gtfo, people is here to pvp you dumbfuck" reply, all the times.

There should be no rewards for losers, period. Not all the population dabbles in 25men raids, why all of it should dabble in BGs? Losers that do not cut it, won't play anymore, so good fucking riddance. Let's be honest, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to play wow, not even in PvP and especially in mass battles, just a bit of communication and will to actually play the game instead of AFK'ing in a cave.

I'll never understand why losing should give you anything at all, it should at best give you the title "total loser", instead you get people that do nothing for a month and get a full set of purples. Retention? Yeah, I guess that's the reason in the end.

I stopped doing BGs because 1 out of 10 was fun if I was lucky. My alt is almost 60, can't wait to do some real AV pvp'ing.

[Gnome Eater]

Originally Posted by Zerai

Kalecgos also doesn't get harder over time.

Arena gets easier over time as the higher rated people float to their natural rating. The first week of a new season is tipically a cluster fuck, but later on it is trivial to maintain a high rating.

And further raiding gets harder at a much steeper slope than arena. The difference between killing Illidan and killing M'uru is like the difference between an 1800 player and a 2500 player.

[Zerai]

Originally Posted by Gnome Eater

Arena gets easier over time as the higher rated people float to their natural rating. The first week of a new season is tipically a cluster fuck, but later on it is trivial to maintain a high rating.

And further raiding gets harder at a much steeper slope than arena. The difference between killing Illidan and killing M'uru is like the difference between an 1800 player and a 2500 player.

And this shows you obviously don't know anything about Arena. Last week my 2v2 went 7-3. I'm 1650 rating. I was a terrible pvper and these days I'd say I'm ok. Nothing special. However of the 3 loses, 2 were full S3 teams. Including shoulders. Since a lot of games are wars of attrition, when you are out geared, they win.

Some weeks we'll go against continous S3 teams. You get a small window of opportunity. Beginning is a clusterfuck, then after that the good teams shoot up. If you don't shoot up during that period, the good teams get their gear, and then they start rerolling teams, selling teams, making teams with new friends..whatever...so that the entire 1500-1800 bracket is full of full S3 teams. If you didn't break 1850 and get your weapons by this point, or raid to get weapons, you're fucked.

I agree with the concept of rating requirements. But in this system, they suck. If teams played at their level consistantly, then sure, it'd be great. However with the ease of resetting ratings and the benefit of selling teams, the system becomes a kick in the nuts.

[Makata]

Originally Posted by Gnome Eater

Any worthwhile PvP'er can easily get over 2k rating currently. If you cannot, you are not very good at the game. If you play a spec that isn't very viable, just respec for arena. I am shadow in PvE, but I have a full suit of shadow/holy arena gear, and mostly play as disc. Almost every class has a viable spec in 2s and 3s.

Quoting this for outright stupidity. You realize being 2k or above automatically puts you in something like the 95 or 98 percentile right? Yea, clearly ANYONE can get that. Quite obviously most people never will because this is a fucking ELO system genius. It is DESIGNED such that very few people will reach 2k. Individual cases where a skilled druid and a skilled warrior can team up to faceroll to a good PR is one thing, but considering the system as a whole where 0.1% of the population will get s4 shoulders is just fucking reTARDED.

Originally Posted by Gnome Eater

Arena gets easier over time as the higher rated people float to their natural rating. The first week of a new season is tipically a cluster fuck, but later on it is trivial to maintain a high rating.

And further raiding gets harder at a much steeper slope than arena. The difference between killing Illidan and killing M'uru is like the difference between an 1800 player and a 2500 player.

Except that when 7 out of 10 of your attempts against supremus have him running around 1 shotting everyone because he's point/rating selling to prince malchezzar, it might get just a little annoying. But even taking what you said, you're still wrong. Pretty much every 70 at this point will be able to kill prince if you want to consider that as maintaining a 1350-1400 team. The number of people capable of killing successive bosses compared to the number of people able to clear certain PR thresholds is vastly favored in side of pve. All the way up until early MH/BT it isn't very difficult to be able to have access to defeating the content but good luck saying that about being 1800-1900 in terms of number of people who are physically able (again, read: ELO) to break that threshold.

Finally, wiping on supremus 3 times because he's point selling doesn't mean you have to go back and fight morogrim 5-6 times to get your pve rating back up.

[Jubee]

Holy shit I just agreed with Makata.

Someone delete my account, quick.

[Plorkyeran]

Originally Posted by Gnome Eater

Do you think that if retard mctardo takes 24 of his casual retarded buddies and keeps trying kalecgos without ever getting him below 50%, they are entitled to his drops just because they tried?

If them giving up had any effect on my ability to raid Sunwell, absolutely. I would support giving full T6 to every idiot the instant they hit 70 if that was required for the later bosses to spawn. However, PvE does not work that way. Regardless of how many times you kill Illidan, he does not get frustrated and stop showing in BT.

[TheCutlery]

Originally Posted by Gnome Eater

Arena gets easier over time as the higher rated people float to their natural rating. The first week of a new season is tipically a cluster fuck, but later on it is trivial to maintain a high rating.

And further raiding gets harder at a much steeper slope than arena. The difference between killing Illidan and killing M'uru is like the difference between an 1800 player and a 2500 player.

Look, you're just wrong dude. For reasons stated above, if you don't hit 2k during the early part of the season, your haul is easily three times as hard. I've gotta deal with all of the point selling and reforms and boosting and everything else. You had to deal with none of that. Saying that it's easier now because you're at your natural rating would require that YOU STAY AT THAT RATING. Since we all know you don't (and I'm not talking you specifically, i'm talking "You" as a general "you" meaning all of the people selling points, reforming teams weekly, etc), the entire argument crumbles. It's wrong, period.

Any worthwhile PvP'er can easily get over 2k rating currently.

That's not how the system works. Not anyone can get over 2k. There needs to be scrubs for there to be winners. And there needs to be people in the middle or you don't exist at the top. Period. Continuing to say this bullshit really only hurts your argument, as no one takes you seriously after saying this kind of shit.

Unless of course you're talking about anyone paying people to get them to 2k rating. That's what this fucking thread started with, actually. In that sense, you're absolutely correct, but I fail to see how it's any kind of accomplishment at all.