WOW, Season 4. Arena or GTFO

[Gnome Eater]

Originally Posted by Zerai

Warriors are nice, but the only reason they are there is MS. It's our one trick. Thats why warriors get annoyed when other classes get it.

Other than hamstring, 15second intercept, a 10 second school lockout, spell reflect, complete longevity, you are correct.

[Niafix04]

Originally Posted by Gnome Eater

Other than hamstring, 15second intercept, a 10 second school lockout, spell reflect, complete longevity, you are correct.

pummel is 4 seconds, shield bash is 6 and they share a cooldown. warriors are fairly vulnerable to CC and if we get targeted for burst we have to turtle up and intervene out of LoS or we die.

without MS we are easily replaced by classes with more mobility/control/survivability.

[Gnome Eater]

Originally Posted by Niafix04

pummel is 4 seconds, shield bash is 6 and they share a cooldown. warriors are fairly vulnerable to CC and if we get targeted for burst we have to turtle up and intervene out of LoS or we die.

The only two classes less vulnerable than warriors to crowd control are druids and rogues. Possibly mages if they are going to use their invulnerabilities to get out of CC, but I cannot imagine that coming up often. Warriors are a lot less vulnerable to being kited because of an undispellable snare with no cooldown and a long duration, and a 15 second intercept.

without MS we are easily replaced by classes with more mobility/control/survivability.

MS is crucial, but making it sound like warriors are only brought along for MS is retarded. The slight dip in popularity for warriors is because druids dominate arenas and roots are a very viable way to CC warriors but don't really work versus rogues.

[Cybsled]

One of the classes I fear most as a warlock is MS warriors...fuckers hurt bad if they get in range of me ;(

[TheCutlery]

Originally Posted by Cybsled

One of the classes I fear most as a warlock is MS warriors...fuckers hurt bad if they get in range of me ;(

You're destro, doesn't count.

[Makata]

Originally Posted by Trifle

This is pretty retarded. While its true that a 2hander has a big stat advantage over a wand, its also true that a staff has a big stat advantage over a bow, so it works out basically even.

No, it doesn't work out even at all. First of all, melee (or rather physical damage dealers) are scaling with gear far better than casters so every season their edge gets bigger and bigger. Second, even if the stat portion of mh + ranged is identical in these situations, hunters get to use both of their items while casters use 1. Bow is comparable to staff because both require rating reqs and both contribute strongly to that class's damage ability. But wand vs axe is not even a contest.

And while raptor strike crits look impressive with a big 2hander, you have to remember that the highest rank of raptor strike is only +170 damage on next hit. Its not an instant attack, so ignoring the extra crit if you have it talented, raptor strike is a massive ~28 dps (pre-armour) extra over just using auto attack.

TBH I wasn't even referring to raptor as much as auto-attack and mongoose bite (hey don't knock it, since the buff this thing is good damage). On my hunter I had a macro "/cast Raptor Strike, /cast Wing Clip" that I spammed when I was in melee range and wanted max damage and it was a godsend. Especially vs casters and their pushback w/ dual r14 swords anyway.

[Kaxmax]

Originally Posted by Gnome Eater

MS is crucial, but making it sound like warriors are only brought along for MS is retarded. The slight dip in popularity for warriors is because druids dominate arenas and roots are a very viable way to CC warriors but don't really work versus rogues.

I'd guess that last sentence is his point. Without MS I'm not sure you can justify a warrior over a SHS rogue. It would still be pretty close due to hamstring, but I think the rogue brings more to the table in that case.

[dak]

I'd guess that last sentence is his point. Without MS I'm not sure you can justify a warrior over a SHS rogue. It would still be pretty close due to hamstring, but I think the rogue brings more to the table in that case.

Except for that fact that the majority of 2v2/3v3 teams at higher rank have a druid which can purge the rogues "mortal strike" and crippling poison.

[Kaxmax]

Originally Posted by dak

Except for that fact that the majority of 2v2/3v3 teams at higher rank have a druid which can purge the rogues "mortal strike" and crippling poison.

And? A 5 stack of Wound with 5 VP is better than no healing reduction at all (which would be the case in the hypothetical warrior with no MS).

[Jubee]

Originally Posted by Makata

So in other words, they're paying extra for something that doesn't even give them an advantage. Great fucking logic there, Ace.

Except that the reason the two healers that don't wear shields are better represented in the arena has nothing to do with their fucking armor and everything to do with the spells they cast. An afk pally/shammy *is* more durable than an afk Druid/Priest. It does give them an advantage.

[Makata]

Originally Posted by Jubee

Except that the reason the two healers that don't wear shields are better represented in the arena has nothing to do with their fucking armor and everything to do with the spells they cast. An afk pally/shammy *is* more durable than an afk Druid/Priest. It does give them an advantage.

Your first sentence is entirely correct. Your second sentence is completely irrelevant. Your third sentence is false. If it gives them an advantage, they should be better healers because of it. If druids are going to be "balanced" (rofl) around having travel form, hots, roots, cyclone, feral charge, stealth, etc, etc and paladins are going to be balanced around being able to use shields, you have to take BOTH for granted. Penalizing the paladin for using the shield you assume he's going to use anyway makes as much sense as making cyclone have a rating requirement to cast. It's part of the class. Armor comes standard, it isn't a luxury. That being said, shields and offhands should have the exact same cost and requirement.

[Frax]

What FOTM are you playing right now? Mage? warlock?

[Antoine]

because mages and warlocks are clearly the strongest classes right now

[Zerai]

Yes. Warriors have nice skills besides MS, but MS is the one skill we can't live without.

Other classes have better survivability (near all of them). Running out steam is nice, but rogues do it better.

Our fear is on a 3 min cooldown. It's nice but it's not anything amazing.

If they gave every class an MS, I'd say you'd see warriors as one of the least used classes.

I don't like the situation either as a warrior.

[Makata]

Originally Posted by Frax

What FOTM are you playing right now? Mage? warlock?

In pvp? Mage is semi-retired as I have 4.2k arena points and 48k honor and with the s4 requirements I have no need to get any more of either til they fix it. My druid's almost 68 and I'm hoping to jump on the overpowered 2v2 bandwagon a little before wrath comes out.