WOW, Season 4. Arena or GTFO

[Petra~]

Any team that is serious makes sure they are stacked properly.

So, basically, there should only be 5 classes/specs in the entire game that get gear?

What saddens me is the fact that "Blues" on the WoW boards feel the same way. I am far too lazy and honestly don't give a shit to look it up, but they posted that if a team composition is not working out like we had hoped, to replace the ones that we feel are not cutting it.

So, we should all roll arms warriors, holy paladins, sl/sl warlocks, discipline priests and rogues (or whatever the "perfect" team is now). Anything else and you are gimping yourself and its your own fault for not being one of these classes/specs... Sorry, but that is not even close to the way it should be in any "game", except a FPS where everyone is already the same.

[The Ancient]

Originally Posted by Makata

Don't you think if I could grind arena points I would?

I know you would if you could, that's why I'm happy the very best gear is designed to be reserved for those people who exhibit some talent for the system.

The only problem is it can be defeated by people selling points. If it couldn't you'd have no way to slack your way into a S4 set and the system would be perfect.

[spronk]

Blizzard is 100% consistent in their delivery for the past 2 years - release new shit that only the top 5% of players can get, then a few months later nerf it so anyone can get it. S4 will be no different. The top arena teams will get the new gear and have the big epeens as they walk around shatt, then magically 2-3 months later, when hardly anyone is playing arena anymore, the requirements will all be removed, point selling will magically return, and everyone and their mother will be able to get all S4 gear, just in time to level up in WOTLK.

At this point WoW is really a MMO-vacation, I'll play 4-5 months/year and keep my account suspended the rest of the time. Next time I'll reactivate is probably the summer holiday time in June, farming the new ragnaros pet will be fun. I have no idea how some of you are playing the same game 3 years running without any breaks.

[Wodin]

Originally Posted by Petra~

So, basically, there should only be 5 classes/specs in the entire game that get gear?

ok go fish (Straight from the cold, hard streets of Stormstrike):

Warrior/Druid
Warrior/Shaman
Warrior/Paladin
Warrior/Mage (lol)
Mage/Rogue
Mage/Warlock
Warlock/Rogue
Warlock/Druid
Warlock/Priest
Warlock/Shaman
Warlock/Paladin
Rogue/Druid
Rogue/Paladin
Rogue/Priest
Rogue/Rogue
Rogue/Shaman
Hunter/Druid
Hunter/Priest

Every class has at least two compositions that work above 2200. And this is in 2v2, the bracket where class imbalance is most obvious. Yes, some classes have fewer combinations than others. Some classes are massively overrepresented. But every single fucking class has at least two combinations that would get it all the gear in Season 4. If you go up to 3v3, the number of compositions stays the same but the flexibility increases based purely on the fact that now there are 3 members of the team.

As far as the whole "oh boohoo I can't use that spec to pvp with" shit goes, spec is not an excuse anymore. With the fountains of gold raining down upon players in 2.4 you're looking at a trivial cost to swap back and forth. 30-40m of the easy dailies on Quel'Danas will get you two respecs, a planned circuit of dailies will get you ~400g worth of rewards and materials (Shattered Sun Shattrath Dailies -> Easy TBC dailies -> Quel'Danas Dailies -> Hellfire Dailies).

[Praetor]

Originally Posted by Makata

I have been getting roughly 250 pts a week (up to 350 on really good weeks) on my mage for months now. He's at 4200 points. That's barely enough for a weapon (if I was able to buy it) or about 2.5 armor pieces. If you honestly think that 15 weeks for 2.5 items is so heinous, then frankly I have no idea what to say.

It's not the rate at which items are earned, it's just an abomination of game design.

If they set up a system where you have to spin in circles for 30 minutes once a week to get a token and when you get X tokens you can redeem them for one decent epic, would that unbalance the game? No. Would it be a fucking stupid idea and embarrassingly bad design? Yes.

[Araxen]

Well this is Blizzard we are talking about. The PVP part of WoW has been poorly designed from the start. I feel though that the way BG's are implemented now is pretty good(AFK's aren't too much of a problem on Nightfall that I've seen at least), but the Arena is just one big clusterfuck of a system. I honestly believe they don't now how to fix it and just throwing shit at the wall and hope it sticks.

[GrobbeeTrull2.0]

Originally Posted by Makata

What does game time matter? When you level a toon do you only go w/ rested exp and log out the second you hit unrested just so the /played time is lower? I really fail to see the logic here. Don't you think if I could grind arena points I would? The fact I can't is a DISadvantage not an advantage.

You can... if you can stop sucking.

[l0z]

Originally Posted by Wodin

As far as the whole "oh boohoo I can't use that spec to pvp with" shit goes, spec is not an excuse anymore. With the fountains of gold raining down upon players in 2.4 you're looking at a trivial cost to swap back and forth. 30-40m of the easy dailies on Quel'Danas will get you two respecs, a planned circuit of dailies will get you ~400g worth of rewards and materials (Shattered Sun Shattrath Dailies -> Easy TBC dailies -> Quel'Danas Dailies -> Hellfire Dailies).

Normally I pretty much agree with you on things Wodin, but this one isn't really looking at the bigger picture.

Sure, I probably don't need to deal with much other than a respec on my hunter (which is retarded for the arena anyway - thanks LoS pillars & drain nerf). However, quite a few classes would require complete re-gearing to a viable spec for the arena.

Just off the top of my head:

• Protadin would have to regear holy or ret.
• Prot warrior would have to regear.
• Feral druid would have to regear.
• Resto shaman probably has to regear.

I actually just don't like arenas anymore because it's more about the CC that you bring to the table and whether or not you can kite people around pillars or not. CC in PvP is an abysmal flaw.

[Mist]

Originally Posted by spronk

I have no idea how some of you are playing the same game 3 years running without any breaks.

It's because we want to do cutting edge content, and therefore we are in guilds that require us to not take multiple month long breaks once we get all our gear from the last tier.

[Digo]

Originally Posted by l0z

Normally I pretty much agree with you on things Wodin, but this one isn't really looking at the bigger picture.

Sure, I probably don't need to deal with much other than a respec on my hunter (which is retarded for the arena anyway - thanks LoS pillars & drain nerf). However, quite a few classes would require complete re-gearing to a viable spec for the arena.

Just off the top of my head:

• Protadin would have to regear holy or ret.
• Prot warrior would have to regear.
• Feral druid would have to regear.
• Resto shaman probably has to regear.

I actually just don't like arenas anymore because it's more about the CC that you bring to the table and whether or not you can kite people around pillars or not. CC in PvP is an abysmal flaw.

I largely agree with this. If I'm doing arenas to fill itemization gaps or, say, gear up my prot paladin, respeccing ret and acquiring ret arena gear doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

[Grizzlebeard]

Originally Posted by Mist

It's because we want to do cutting edge content...

I had to chuckle.

[The Ancient]

Originally Posted by Digo

If I'm doing arenas to fill itemization gaps or, say, gear up my prot paladin.

I think the system is better when you CAN'T gear up your PvE prot paladin through PvP.

That isn't to say I'm against a vialbe PvP prot spec.

[Xurlitil]

Originally Posted by TheGoat

I really don't get why most of you think these wellfare epics as you put it for casual players are bad. Honestly who is it hurting? The players losing 10 games a week for their pvp gear is only good in pvp (aside from weapons) and honestly its not harming anyone in the arena system anyways. The average arena player would still be in the same bracket if they had full season 3 or t6 or whatever. The gear difference isn't what stops most people who want to to succeed in arena from progressing. The same players 1600 players in full season 3 are still going to keyboard turn, s-key, and make all the other mistakes that earn them their 1600 rating. At the higher ratings you're already playing against people using the same gear anyways so I don't really see how having these PR required items is really a status. I think myself and most other high rated players would much rather more people playing all around so when we do games on our main teams we don't sit in 5 minute que to take 5 points from some 2k team or drop 27 on the occasional loss. I mean its so bad right now that at 2300 on Stormstrike I'm playing the same 3v3 teams I'd be playing at 2k. This new change will only worsen the problem, it also makes it an extreme pain in the ass to change up teams or play with friends who just aren't that good at pvp in the early season. Which I think as a whole will have a much larger affect on people quitting arena then bads like Makata that can only buy two pieces of gear.

The current system does do harm though, with the way it is right now, no rating requirements on anything except shoulders/weapon, there is absolutely no reason for most people to even try to be competitive in the arenas, why do so when you can spend 10 minutes a week losing your way to some nice gear. It takes the competition out of a competitive ladder.

[Kreugen]

Sorry, any system where you can be rewarded without ever winning is complete shit from the start. Hopefully they will completely change the entire system in WOLK instead of this band aid crap.

[Izuldan]

Originally Posted by Makata

You say 90% don't deserve it. Okay. Why will they even queue then? No it won't be the cataclysmic prediction where all of the scrubs will refuse to queue, but don't for a second think the queuing population won't plummet.

Originally Posted by Makata

I have been getting roughly 250 pts a week (up to 350 on really good weeks) on my mage for months now. He's at 4200 points. That's barely enough for a weapon (if I was able to buy it) or about 2.5 armor pieces. If you honestly think that 15 weeks for 2.5 items is so heinous, then frankly I have no idea what to say.

You've answered your own question then, haven't you? Queues aren't going to be affected in any dramatic fashion.

The 90% of the people who casually do arenas and never achieve a rating above 2000 will continue to do the arenas. First, at the slow rate they are acquiring pts, it will take a long time to get their items. So "scrubs", as you so put it (pot calling kettle black?) will continue to queue and lose just to get points, because it will be months and months before they get the items they need.....and guess what? Before you know it, the new season is upon them, so they will continue to queue to replace their items.

Secondly, you don't need to be rated high to get items in about 6-8 of your inventory slots. Is it really gonna kill someone to the point of quitting arenas if they can't get the shoulder item or weapon? No. They will still queue. Too many other slots to fill with S4 gear that will still rate better than what they currently have. Not having an S4 weapon is gonna hurt, true, but 1) honestly, is it like they deserve it if they can't maintain a high ranking? 2) should people who constantly lose at arena just to get points have access to some of the best weapons in the game?, and 3) they can still get the S3 weapon which incredible considering how little effort it takes to get it....and the S3 weapon will STILL be better than anything outside of the highest tier of raids.

So no....fixing ratings so you cannot equip say the shoulder item once you're rating drops below the requirement is NOT going to cause a massive reduction in the amount of people participating in arenas. There are still plenty of items to be gained, and casuals will still take forever in getting them.....so still plenty of incentive to participate in arenas, even if that participation means taking 2 hours out of the week to lose 10 games.