[WoW] How to start over at this point in the game.

[Vorph]

It's not about it being hard, it's about resilience+agi being a better way to spend item points than defense. I did the math in another thread, but you end up with more avoidance and slightly more mitigation.

It's a bit of an academic discussion though, since it's just about impossible to entirely avoid defense on your items. Any ring with armor will also have defense (Seal of Danzalar excepted), and resilience is also wasted item points beyond a 94 rating, whereas defense past the cap at least does something.

[Deathwing]

Can you post a link to that? I would like to see how 39.4 resilience and 29.4 AGI cost less than 60 defense.

[Shabado]

I'm too lazy to find the maths, saw it myself a few months ago but didn't care.

It's just the spreading the points out logic though, same as rogue gear is better with ap, agi and crit rather than just agi.

[MrGraham]

Defense is a little better point for point than resilience, but resilience is crazy easy to get as any serious tanking druid should have 2 piece s3, which gets you to the cap talented by itself in most cases.

[Deathwing]

Originally Posted by Shabado

I'm too lazy to find the maths, saw it myself a few months ago but didn't care.

It's just the spreading the points out logic though, same as rogue gear is better with ap, agi and crit rather than just agi.

Because the defense all comes at once, on one piece of gear! Look again, chunks of defense per piece are about equal to resilience, and agility is definitely higher. It's not 60 defense = 39.4 res and 29.4 agi, more like 20 def + 20 def + 20 def = 22 res + ....etc

Also, graham, resilience aside, what S3 pieces are better for tanking than T6?

[Zest]

You'll never even get close to the armor cap in S3 stuff either

[Everlast]

I think I saw Blazenfury on Frostmane - Alliance today

[Brando]

I'm not really sure what the heck Deathwing is talking about in regards to 1 piece of gear giving you all the defense you need as a feral druid. That is certainly not the case unless you have some resilience to go with it. Resilience ends up being the preferred stat for feral druids because it allows for a much wider range of gear selection then. Yes it is worse point for point in comparison to +defense but unfortunately there is no +defense leather gear whatsoever and gemming for +DEF over AGI as a feral druid is just stupid.

So what you are left with is having to use resilience which isn't that bad and which then allows you to switch out other high armor pieces over time for more offensive oriented pieces, assuming you mainly off-tank, which allows for better TPS and then better DPS when DPSing in your tank gear.

[MrGraham]

He's being sarcastic, he's saying that the argument that resilience+agi > pure defense is stupid because it's not on a single piece of gear.

And I should amend my earlier comment to sub T6 druids =P

If you're focusing on gemming, defense > resilience for PVE tanking indeedly.

[Deathwing]

Sorry, went back to my other post and I admit it's poorly worded. You need 1 piece of PvP gear, tops. Here's how you get crit immune:

[item]Voilet Signet of the Great Protector[/item]
[item]A'dal's Signet of Defense[/item]
[item]Vindicator's Dragonhide Bracers[/item]
[item]Slikk's Cloak of Placation[/item]
[item]Necklace of the Juggernaut[/item]
[item]Glyph of the Defender[/item]
[item]Greater Inscription of Warding[/item]
[item]Elixir of Ironskin[/item]

Yeah, I cheated a bit and used an elixir. I don't consider the other two that great though. That's only 5 pieces of gear total, 1 pvp item, and it allows full use of PvE tanking sets. Plus, they're the best tanking items for their slots with the exception of the neck piece, but the upgrade(Titans) only have one less defense rating. Band of the swift paw is a slight upgrade to the bracers. Even further bonus: all easily acquired by the end of T4 raiding, Heavy Clefthoof will serve you well up until that point.

As for wearing more offensive minded gear for DPS/TPS, I consider the tiered sets better at that anyway. Socket full of agi gems where possible and you're good to go.

EDIT: dang it, do item tags not work here? How do I do this?

[Braen]

We are trying to get those up on Mistwalkers. So far, since I am not the main admin of the site, I have them able to do pop ups of you have the item number but not the name...

I hope we can figure it out. It's cool stuff

[Agraza]

They don't work here. We use these things called Uniform Resource Locators.

That would be cool though.

[Itzena]

Someone get Gin/FY in here, stat!

[Brando]

Even at T4 you can already look at dropping some high armor pieces as you'll have more than you need. The problem then becomes that the high armor pieces that are best to switch out have defense on them, so again right from the start I'd advocate going for resilience over defense.

Personally I wear the Vindicator's Belt/Bracers + the S3 helm which gives you basically all the resilience you need to be crit immune. Then you can use Pepe's or Phoenix Wing instead of Slikk's which overall is a much better tanking cloak and switch in whatever SotS rep ring you have for the A'dals. Again this is mainly if you aren't main tanking. By doing this you end up with a much more well-rounded set which provides respectable DPS once your add is dead.

The nice thing about the Vindicator's is that the bracers are especially nice. Unless you are in dire need of +hit then I'd say they are better for DPS than Insidious as well. So for very little time investment you get basically the best feral bracers in the game. This isn't anything new though as unfortunately for feral druids the PVE game even with the 2.3 changes really doesn't provide a lot of gear advancement opportunities outside of the tier set.

[Deathwing]

Originally Posted by Brando

Even at T4 you can already look at dropping some high armor pieces as you'll have more than you need. The problem then becomes that the high armor pieces that are best to switch out have defense on them, so again right from the start I'd advocate going for resilience over defense.

Personally I wear the Vindicator's Belt/Bracers + the S3 helm which gives you basically all the resilience you need to be crit immune. Then you can use Pepe's or Phoenix Wing instead of Slikk's which overall is a much better tanking cloak and switch in whatever SotS rep ring you have for the A'dals. Again this is mainly if you aren't main tanking. By doing this you end up with a much more well-rounded set which provides respectable DPS once your add is dead.

The nice thing about the Vindicator's is that the bracers are especially nice. Unless you are in dire need of +hit then I'd say they are better for DPS than Insidious as well. So for very little time investment you get basically the best feral bracers in the game. This isn't anything new though as unfortunately for feral druids the PVE game even with the 2.3 changes really doesn't provide a lot of gear advancement opportunities outside of the tier set.

Druids in T6 can probably start switching out for lower armor items, but they only have about 400(not base) armor to play around with, unless Rawr is lieing to me. I still think you're missing the point, I listed only 5 pieces of gear, one of which is a good dps piece already. The rest of the tier sets are very good dps items too, especially if you socket them with agi gems.

I don't follow your comment on gear advancement though. THere's lots of good feral and cat gear now with badges. As I showed above, you should only really need to get the pvp bracers, that's it.