Nino...One of the upsides of VG.

[Aphextwin]

Originally Posted by Bizanich

I guess what I mean is that, down the road, are newbs going to be able to complete these involved questlines, or is it going to be a straight grind to max level and all this will be for naught?

In my experience getting a full group for some of the dungeon quest lines can take quite a while as a few posters above have already mentioned, however, if Sigil does intend to implement a way for easier travel to and from the more out of the way dungeons like those on the far side of Thestra (Dargun's, Von Tuniel), beef up the LFG tools and we don't see a steady decline in server population then it might not be as bad as it is today, only time will tell.

[Sunder]

Originally Posted by JulesDrools

I don't know if you played EQ1, but you could run Freeport to Queynos in less time than that, and no dungeons had any quests in them. Any joe could come and help out in the Ghoul Lord or Frenzy camp, without needing to first kill the Squire and Ancient Croc in Upper Guk...

I did play EQ1. For years in fact. What you aren't getting is that Vanguard is EQ1 with a modern-day quest log. The fact you weren't expecting that is what really shocks me. If you wanted good rewards in vanilla EQ where did you go? Rare named mobs in the dungeons. You want good rewards in Vanguard? Rare named in the dungeons. Only difference is when you get your reward. One gives it to you upon death of MoB, the other gives it to you upon return to a quest NPC.

[Xitix]

Your missing that the current "Modern quest log" means linear gameplay which makes no sense in a game that otherwise is wide open. I enjoyed the actual Trengal Keep mission series, I did *not* enjoy repeatedly doing earlier ones when I was in a different group to get everybody on the same one.

Non-flexible linear quest sequences are something for single player games and should be used very sparringly in MMOs I think. Allmost all quests in VG should be shareable to avoid repitition with some final rewards flagged to require the player to have completed all previous steps. Choose gameplay over quest story line rigidity.

[Draegan]

Linear quests are fine if they tell a story through a dungeon. Whats wrong with that? A game so wide open should have quests that send you all over the place just to get you to explore and aim you in the right direction.

[Twobit Whore]

Yes, but having 6 quests that lead you in and out of the same dungeon over and over while not having good tools to match you with people on the same step as you is retarded.

The problem with VG is that it is too quest based, way more so than WoW.. and the quests are uninspired, tedious, and nothing but a grind/timesink. No one wants to repeat previous steps because they suck ass..

[Draegan]

Originally Posted by Twobit Whore

Yes, but having 6 quests that lead you in and out of the same dungeon over and over while not having good tools to match you with people on the same step as you is retarded.

I agree to a certain extent, but not having a quest line that continues on its pretty shallow. I like long indepth quest lines. They tend to tell a good story. I.E. epic questline in LOTRO or the Defias questline in WOW.

The problem with VG is that it is too quest based, way more so than WoW.. and the quests are uninspired, tedious, and nothing but a grind/timesink. No one wants to repeat previous steps because they suck ass..

I agree they are bland. But then again I feel that was about the whole game so my opinion is obviously slanted. But I'm sure there are good quests out there as well. But I don't think VG is too quest based.

LOTRO is almost exclusively quest based.

[Twobit Whore]

Yes, I should say it is based too much on tedious quests that require days of factioning and farming. If the quests were fun and relatively painless, then it would be different. Of course then you wouldn't 'earn' those pixels or whatever it is they justify it as.

[tad10]

Originally Posted by Twobit Whore

Yes, but having 6 quests that lead you in and out of the same dungeon over and over while not having good tools to match you with people on the same step as you is retarded.

The problem with VG is that it is too quest based, way more so than WoW.. and the quests are uninspired, tedious, and nothing but a grind/timesink. No one wants to repeat previous steps because they suck ass..

1. VG is not more quest based then WoW. It is however too quest based right now because of the quest xp being so much better than grind xp.

2. You sound like an idiot saying "6 quests that lead you in and out of the same dungeon." I can't think of anything like that -- Tsang quest line -- grind outside then go in and get items. CIS quest line -- kill different quest mobs, get different quest items, all in different quest areas (lower CIS, Infinieum Plateau, Upper CIS). I honest to God don't know what you're talking about. Maybe Trengal Keep? In which case you're generalizing all quests based on one dungeon.

3.14159 All quests suck? We just discussed the quest types above - did you read them? There are sucky quests (Tahatamani Harbor) and good quests (Tsang/CIS/RV/Xenn). No different than any other MMO.

* * *
Dude you haven't played since Beta -- go back to LOTRO or WoW or whatever you're playing and STFU.

[Twobit Whore]

Originally Posted by tad10

* * *
Dude you haven't played since Beta -- .

Says... who? Fucking moron.

[Lusiphur]

And Tad and Twobit are off again

I swear you two are in denial about your deep regard for each other ...

[Vinen]

Both of them are partially right but both of them are so blind that they can't see anything other then what they want to.

[Elsebet]

Originally Posted by Twobit Whore

Yes, but having 6 quests that lead you in and out of the same dungeon over and over while not having good tools to match you with people on the same step as you is retarded.

I'd like to see something like this:

The Legend of Trengal Keep [Group] 0/6

> Task 1

Learn about Gulgrethor orcs, Shinak goblins, entities of Koth Teros, meteor fragments and meteor shards by killing them. Find these beings in the main entry corridor of Trengal Keep.

* Meteor Fragments and Shards (10)
* Entities of Phalebrus (3)
* Orcs and Goblins (30)

> Task 2

In the west wing of Trengal Keep, destroy storm elementals, their controllers, and skeletal remains. Return to Sage Maenor at Trengal Watch.

Find these beings primarily in the west wing of Trengal Keep.

* Spellcasting Shinak (15)
* Elemental Storms (15)
* Skeletal Remains (15)

> Task 3

Examine the crystal spire Maenor has given directions to. Walk onto it to get a full vantage for studying it. Nearby, destroy beetles and spiders mutated by the presence of the crystals. Return to Sage Maenor at Trengal Watch.

* Mutated Beetles (10)
* Mutated Spiders (10)
* Visit the Meteor Crystal

^ Task 4
^ Task 5
^ Task 6

and so on, for all 6 parts. That way you can complete any of the steps in any order and that truly feels like a HUGE quest.

Once you complete a step, the quest log updates:

The Legend of Trengal Keep [Group] 1/6

At this point you can turn in the step you completed for xp, or you can just wait until you finish more steps or the entire quest. Either way works. A player would only get the final reward after all 6 steps are complete.

[Soygen]

Originally Posted by Twobit Whore

Says... who? Fucking moron.

Have you played since beta?

[Seths]

I think there are plenty of epic quest lines. CIS was mentioned, Pantheon, Death from above in Cragwind, etc.

There are fun quests too like the Bounty Hunters line in western Qalia (hihi Jhonny 5). But you can't have every quest be like that in the game. It would take too long to add enough quests to keep people with things to do, and people would then complain that quests were too long and epic.

There are quests of every type in the game, with some more neat ones coming down the pipe very shortly so I don't understand what you want...you want them all epic so that people then can complain about that?

[GamerGod]

Speaking of Nino.

I heard he finally got fed up with the disgraceful mismanagement of the project and stepped down a week ago Friday. Worse still, they replaced him with some clueless guy who is fresh out of the GM department and doesn't even play the game.

Someone at Sigil doesn't know what the heck they are doing.