Nino...One of the upsides of VG.

[UnchainedAcolyte]

Originally Posted by Twobit Whore

Ah the beauty of subjectivity. To you fun is also clearing trash over and over to collect some coins so you can spawn a mob that is basically the same as everything else but has a 'name' and drops some orange or red or whatever loot.

When he dies, he has a name: his name is Bob.

Chorus: "His name is Bob."


There could stand to be a little more originality with some of the tougher mobs though, especially those designed for quests, though not all are as bad as the example you give. Some are.

[Kasi]

Pre 60 WoW mobs that have special abilities and are different? Let's see:

Deadmines: Smite, Shredder
RFK: The giant boar, final boss
SM: Arcanist, Herod, Whitemane and the Lord Commander. All three are interesting and unique fights.
RFD: The Lich, the boss with the ton of skeleton adds
Z'F: Gazrilla, the whole Pyramid defence battle, Antu'sul
Uldaman: The giant, the final boss which is a very nice scripted fight, probably the best pre 60 5 man fight.
Maraudon: Princess, Noxxius
Sunken Temple: Eranikus, Hakkar
Blackrock Depths: Emperor & Princess, Arena, giant elemental guy near the start, the Seven event

See those are all pre 60, and not even getting into the 60 battles and none of those are common mobs found in the dungeon with one more dot or more health and one added ability. I find it hilarious (and sad) that people find it fun to camp mobs for 1+ hours in order to spawn a tougher mob that drops loot. I've never camped mob camps in WoW with the hope of having a rare spawn drop, and having to constantly do that would piss me off majorly.

[xmod2]

Originally Posted by Kendrick

We weren't watching Blizzard, couldn't watch Blizzard like we watched EQ2, so EQ2 (and SWG, and EQ1 expansions) were our benchmarks. Do it better than they did, and do it bigger, while still retaining what we liked about EQ1. By the time WoW was really on the radar, simple inertia prevented many sweeping changes, and faith in our basic concepts took care of the rest.

This really sums it up.

Totally forget about WoW for a minute. The benchmark was to come out with a game that was better than EQ2 and the EQ expansions. They simply failed to do that. Without WoW the game would have just been another Horizons or a DAoC. It's only when you consider the genre with WoW in the picture that the real lulz come out. I think it's the fact that these shitty designers and developers are even considered in the same genre as WoW that is making everyone roll their eyes. The infant MMORPG genre is dosed with professional game developers.

I'm sure comparing EQ/EQ2/VG/SWG in a vacuum there wouldn't be nearly as much drama. Then again, that's pretty insulting to EQ2 Sorry Scott.

[The Hiram Key]

Originally Posted by Kendrick

Whole lotta sweet, sweet behind the scenes goodness and straight forward communication - stuff.

I fucking LOVE posts like that. Thank you Kend for setting the record straight, I learned quite a bit. Awesome man, just Awesome.

[kcxiv]

I agree with Hiram about Kendricks post. That was good reading. I normally wont read something on a message board that is that long, but that was good stuff.

[UnchainedAcolyte]

Great insightful post, Kendricke. Thanks.

[Soygen]

Originally Posted by UnchainedAcolyte

Great insightful post, Kendricke. Thanks.

It's a shame you have to shovel through all the back and forth bullshit in between it.

[QforQ]

Originally Posted by Kendrick

Good stuff

If you were indeed a Vanguard developer thanks for the post. Lots of great insight and I'm glad you're still enjoying the game and have hope for the future.

[Gnome Eater]

Originally Posted by QforQ

If you were indeed a Vanguard developer thanks for the post. Lots of great insight and I'm glad you're still enjoying the game and have hope for the future.

He was one of the older more senior designers of EQ. I still hate him because the rogue epic was so much better than all the other ones

[Camerous]

Originally Posted by Kasi

Pre 60 WoW mobs that have special abilities and are different? Let's see:

Deadmines: Smite, Shredder
RFK: The giant boar, final boss
SM: Arcanist, Herod, Whitemane and the Lord Commander. All three are interesting and unique fights.
RFD: The Lich, the boss with the ton of skeleton adds
Z'F: Gazrilla, the whole Pyramid defence battle, Antu'sul
Uldaman: The giant, the final boss which is a very nice scripted fight, probably the best pre 60 5 man fight.
Maraudon: Princess, Noxxius
Sunken Temple: Eranikus, Hakkar
Blackrock Depths: Emperor & Princess, Arena, giant elemental guy near the start, the Seven event

You gotta be fucking kidding me. 1/2 that shit you mentioned is fucking boring as hell or basic in every way.

"OH WOW!! When Herod dies adds come into the room!!"
"OMG!! When the Commander dies we all get stunned and a bitch comes and rezes him and we have to kill them both... such innovation!!"
"Wow the Princess has a knock back that looks like a fart coming out of her ass! Man these guys really know how to make stuff awesome!!"
"Wow when we attack the end boss of Uld he randomly brings statues alive to kill us! I have never seen that before!"
"WOOT! This pirate guy stuns us and picks up another weapon! My excitement can't be contained!!!"

Get a fucking clue. If you are gonna guzzle Blizz cum fine but at least have a fucking clue when you post.

[kohl]

Even after reading Kendrick's insightful post, I'm not understanding how they are so far behind with the game. Brad made it sound like they were forced to go retail "a few months" early; looking at the state of the game almost 3 months into retail, they needed a good 1/2 a year yet. I'm talking for basic code issues that have caused them to already change fundamental aspects of the game (class abilities, death system, etc).

[kohl]

Originally Posted by Camerous

You gotta be fucking kidding me. 1/2 that shit you mentioned is fucking boring as hell or basic in every way.

Right. And if they had tried to do ANY of that shit in EQ, it would have crashed the servers for a week.

I can see that the attention to detail Bliz put in a lot of their encounters is lost on some people, but hey - thats good because if it weren't for dense twits such as yourself, SOE would be shit out of luck.

[Kasi]

People were complaining that mobs in vanguard were just trash mobs with more health/mana with the possible addition of one extra abilities. Then people came in there and said WoW bosses were the exact same. Just named regular mobs. The ones I mentioned were either mobs with different skins (liches, etc), much more than one additional ability or scripted fights.

Lets look at what you bitched about.

Herod - He is not a mob type or skin that shows up earlier in the dungeon. He has some unique abilities like his whirlwind that no one else in armory has. He also summons adds at the end of the fight.

Commander/Whitemane - Hey it's a scripted fight, one of the better ones in fact. Does Vanguard even have anything like this? From what Hachima and others say, nope. It's just instead of fighting murloc you fight a named murloc with a different color skin.

Princess - Once again a unique mob. No one in Maraudon is like her. She has several unique abilities and is actually a pretty fun fight.

Uldaman - Umm, bitching about this fight? It's considered one of the best fights in 5 mans in WoW and complaining about this really hurts your point and makes you look like a Vanboi. This guy activates several groups of adds at certain times with the addition of having the constant statues spawn.

Smite - Another good fight.

The point is, does Vanguard have fights like this? From what I've read of VG, no it doesn't. The boss fights suck, have no innovation and take no strategy at all. They have no scripting. TBC of course improves a lot on this with their 5 mans. A bad encounter for me with WoW would be something like the second last bost in BFD, who is just another cultist guy. Or most of the bosses in RFK, who are just different types of gnolls with adds.

[woqqqa]

Originally Posted by kohl

Even after reading Kendrick's insightful post, I'm not understanding how they are so far behind with the game. Brad made it sound like they were forced to go retail "a few months" early; looking at the state of the game almost 3 months into retail, they needed a good 1/2 a year yet. I'm talking for basic code issues that have caused them to already change fundamental aspects of the game (class abilities, death system, etc).

Well, from what Kendrick mentioned and what I've heard about it, the entire gameplay was redone after the deal with Microsoft fell through, so much of what you're seeing (besides the graphics and music) was done maybe over the course of one year at the most, not five.

[Korbal]

Originally Posted by Camerous

You gotta be fucking kidding me. 1/2 that shit you mentioned is fucking boring as hell or basic in every way.

"OH WOW!! When Herod dies adds come into the room!!"
"OMG!! When the Commander dies we all get stunned and a bitch comes and rezes him and we have to kill them both... such innovation!!"
"Wow the Princess has a knock back that looks like a fart coming out of her ass! Man these guys really know how to make stuff awesome!!"
"Wow when we attack the end boss of Uld he randomly brings statues alive to kill us! I have never seen that before!"
"WOOT! This pirate guy stuns us and picks up another weapon! My excitement can't be contained!!!"

Get a fucking clue. If you are gonna guzzle Blizz cum fine but at least have a fucking clue when you post.

Wow, you need to be fucking banned. You are by far worse than Utnayan or Twobit.