Nino...One of the upsides of VG.

[Camerous]

After having played Eq1 again and VG I have decided to change my position on instances. I used to hate them but now as I have been trained 4 or 5 dozen times in EQ1 and seen people come into my camps in VG and kill my mobs I beginning to rethink it.

Before when I was playing WoW I never released how convenient instanced content was in comparison to what EQ and VG have. Always having bosses up to kill, never having to worry about what dick head decided to zone in and train you or some high lvl player coming and just clearing the whole zone for the fuck of it.

[kcxiv]

Water looks nice, but them screens look like a updated WoW.

[Kendrick]

Just one little point on the dissected screenshot. That's the Infineum Sanctuary, and it's a newly built (in lore terms) area for a cult that would make L. Ron jealous.

So yes, that place, of all places in the game, is supposed to look new and shiny. As far as texture reuse, that particular texture isn't used much at all anywhere else in the gameworld, and you can't have it both ways...texture loading is a big part of why people have performance issues with VG.

Adding more unique textures all over the place instead of reusing them when applicable just ain't a bright thing to do, in terms of manhours spent AND performance impact.

And I sure as hell recall a LOT of texture/object reuse in EQ, WoW, EQ2, AO, EVE, SWG, DAoC, L2, CoH, AC, AC2, DDO, MX0, etc, and I'm sure I'll see a lot of it in any upcoming MMO or any other 3d title for that matter. It's just how it's done.

The undead in the shot is somebody's necro pet, btw, and not an inhabitant of the area.

[Utnayan]

[kcxiv]

point kendrick.

Now your trying to hard Ut.

[Utnayan]

Originally Posted by kcxiv

point kendrick

-1 vanboi.

[Utnayan]

texture loading is a big part of why people have performance issues with VG.

Hahaha

[kcxiv]

Originally Posted by Utnayan

-1 vanboi.

Yet, your the one that plays the game too?
Give me my point back.

Originally Posted by Utnayan

Happens to me still in rivers. Whenever I enter this area my frame rate drops to 13. Whenever more than 7 people enter my area of view, with a 6800 gt and 2 gigs of ram, I drop even lower.

When do you think it is time to "fix" rivers?

[xmod2]

Originally Posted by kcxiv

Yet, your the one that plays the game too?
Give me my point back.

Ut is pissed off because he's level 50 and there is no damn content for him you idiot.

[kcxiv]

Originally Posted by xmod2

Ut is pissed off because he's level 50 and there is no damn content for him you idiot.

He's been bashing the fucking game since fucking beta, he knew what he was getting into. Try again pal.

Hell i knew what i was getting into. Do i want thier to be raid content? Sure fucking do. I just wont get all crazy

[Utnayan]

Originally Posted by kcxiv

He's been bashing the fucking game since fucking beta, he knew what he was getting into. Try again pal.

Hell i knew what i was getting into. Do i want thier to be raid content? Sure fucking do. I just wont get all crazy

When drunk vanboi's attack. News at 11.

[kcxiv]

Originally Posted by Utnayan

When drunk vanboi's attack. News at 11.

Naw, i dont drink. I havent since about hmm 19 or so. Anyways, i am crashing, peace.

[The Hiram Key]

Originally Posted by Kendrick

Just one little point on the dissected screenshot. That's the Infineum Sanctuary, and it's a newly built (in lore terms) area for a cult that would make L. Ron jealous.

So yes, that place, of all places in the game, is supposed to look new and shiny. As far as texture reuse, that particular texture isn't used much at all anywhere else in the gameworld, and you can't have it both ways...texture loading is a big part of why people have performance issues with VG.

Adding more unique textures all over the place instead of reusing them when applicable just ain't a bright thing to do, in terms of manhours spent AND performance impact.

And I sure as hell recall a LOT of texture/object reuse in EQ, WoW, EQ2, AO, EVE, SWG, DAoC, L2, CoH, AC, AC2, DDO, MX0, etc, and I'm sure I'll see a lot of it in any upcoming MMO or any other 3d title for that matter. It's just how it's done.

The undead in the shot is somebody's necro pet, btw, and not an inhabitant of the area.

Kend, thanks for the clarification on the necro pet. I still stand by my statement on why "mobesque" models seem to have gotten all the love from a texure / skeleton standpoint and the character models didn't.

You mentioned the reuse of textures as standard, and I agree, they do get used alot in different places. A good example from Wow would be the use of area specific buildings. They only have so many buildings for each area in Wow, taking the night elf areas for example, and you often see the same buildings (and caves etc) showing up in different areas, right down to the same internal layout.

The difference that I was getting at, is an incredible amount of attention and craftsmanship (I am talking Wow) went into those copy and paste objects, bordering on perfection, that you don't see alot of the "Same square block of texture looking out of place and used over and over again right next to each other etc". I am sure someone could maybe find an SS that shows that, but I would wager a large sum of money it won't look like those columns in that picture (out of place, hastily thrown together, unnatural).

Additionally, and tieing into what UT is saying, the "meshing" (not an expert by any means) where one texture meets another is just plain awful. Look at the columns where they meet the ground in the original SS, or where the wall meets the ground, or in UT's latest pic, where the earth meets the rock (or whatever those two substances are supposed to be.

It looks cheesy, thrown together, carelessly done, with an eye towards volume rather then quality. I think reusing textures is fine, but I think it can be done in a way where it's not so over the top obvious, and I also believe that in a game that takes alot of pride in the beauty of it's world (as well as it's size, and that it's hand crafted not computer generated) that you would see a higher quality finished product.

But there is the rub really, the bigger the world, the more time / people hours it takes to fill it in, the less time you have to spend on an entire area, the less overall quality (graphically) you can have.

I am not super familiar with timelines, I wan't to say EQ2 has been out for 3+ years now, and VG was in development for 5 years. Taking Wow into account, with it's low system reqs, high polish, versus EQ2's high system reqs, high polish (at least I think so anyway) and comparing that with subscription numbers (excluding launch performance for the sake of arguement) it would be clear to me at least, which model is the way to go for higher subscription numbers. It all boils down to who and how many can access your product.

I realize if my dates and times are right that VG would have been in development for 2 years already when EQ2 was released, and one could argue that VG was far too down the road to make that kind of sweeping changes so late in the game, but they did essentially redesign the game several times (across many aspects) especially in the last few months leading up to gold and release.

In hindsight, it would have been better to look at Wow and EQ2, decide what audience they wanted to go after, and made a decision to cut the world size down dramatically. Polish the living shit out of whatever size world you cut it down to, release that, and then release more of the world overtime as an expansion.

This really goes back the Wow model of development. Start with a small area, polish and perfect it, then expand on it. I want to say these guys are struggling with the world size and content percentage as the #1 concern, when it should be content quality and polish as the big attention getters.

Thats what I think anyway.

[The Hiram Key]

Originally Posted by Kendrick

and you can't have it both ways...texture loading is a big part of why people have performance issues with VG.

One more.... The big part of why people have performance issues with VG is the game is not designed to run well on today's average computer. It barely runs well on an upper tier computer, only hitting it's stride on the very, very top end gaming rigs.

People have performance issues by design, it's not an accident.

[MetalNeo]

Originally Posted by kcxiv

point kendrick.

Now your trying to hard Ut.

I wonder if they shortened the raid lockout out of Kara if that might rid these forums of so many Ut posts....

Cause ah yes the world says so many good things about WoW these days...