Nino...One of the upsides of VG.

[Twobit Whore]

It wasn't hard to determine that holymight is the one who sent that to Ut, but you are acting like Utnayan laid Nino's name out there for all to see with the intent of getting him fired. I don't see it that way. Maybe what Ut did was dirty pool, but insinuating that he was being malicious towards Nino personally is too much of a stretch.

What baffles me is why holymight would send that to Ut in the first place, I mean seriously.

[Nólaquen]

Originally Posted by Rayne

Well, if the rule is only selectively applied, what is the purpose of having it? Clearly, the free-for-all is the better answer, because the alternative shows a clear bias toward one side or the other when used in a selective manner.

Alright, now you're arguing just for the sake of arguing and I think you're trying to trap me into it. And I know this because of the strangeness of your claim. You would rather there be a forum that devolves into this or this instead of letting a single slightly inflammatory post go unmoderated. In RL, the police don't catch all criminals. Yet you would rather live in anarchy?

Nobody is perfect and all moderators have (OMG!) bias. But if you're well behaved, you're less likely to be biased against. Being well-behaved, however, is only likely if there are rules of conduct in place. Bounds for behavior. That's what the rules are. We try to enforce them, but can't get them all. Could we use additional moderators? Probably, but it is really tricky to get multiple moderators to be consistent.

Anyway, that's all I want to say on the matter. Take it or leave it.

[Greyform]

Originally Posted by Twobit Whore

It wasn't hard to determine that holymight is the one who sent that to Ut, but you are acting like Utnayan laid Nino's name out there for all to see with the intent of getting him fired. I don't see it that way. Maybe what Ut did was dirty pool, but insinuating that he was being malicious towards Nino personally is too much of a stretch.

What baffles me is why holymight would send that to Ut in the first place, I mean seriously.

Obviously he miss judged his character. Considering his entire rant about VG and SOE has been about honesty. You might tend to believe the man had a few fucking morals of his own.

Also it is UT who named the source of the PM as Nino. Are you saying he accidentally typed that name?

[Twobit Whore]

Originally Posted by Greyform

Also it is UT who named the source of the PM as Nino. Are you saying he accidentally typed that name?

Yeah, you are right. My bad.

[Cadrid]

Originally Posted by Nólaquen

Nobody is perfect and all moderators have (OMG!) bias.

Just because a person is biased does not mean they have to act based on it. Yes, there are people with enough common sense and decency out there to take a moment and think before they leap.

[r.gun]

Originally Posted by Greyform

Obviously he miss judged his character. Considering his entire rant about VG and SOE has been about honesty. You might tend to believe the man had a few fucking morals of his own.

Also it is UT who named the source of the PM as Nino. Are you saying he accidentally typed that name?

I don't recall Utnayan naming Nino as the source.

[gremlinz273]

What about a limit to the number of times you can post in the same thread per day?

If you cant make your point in a few posts, than perhaps you never will. This should put a stop to some of the forum domination, and trying to be right via brute force repetition. Hopefully, it would encourage more thought out posts and less derailment in to off-topic inanity.

Some points against it that I can think of, you might hit the post limit without being able to answer questions or make corrections. Well, if your message is valid, someone else will likely pick it up and continue it. Also, you can just come back the next day to respond. It discourages the sort of hot-fire rapid discourse some of you prefer, well, thats kind of the point.

edit: may lead to abuse of the edit button.

[Frax]

Originally Posted by Twobit Whore

What's bullshit to one may be pertinent or enlightening or flat-out entertaining to another. The problem is that it is very subjective, and anyone that would want to clean it up is already biased one way or the other.

True to an extent. There is certain level of repetitiveness in some of the 'particular game flamers' that should garner them a beating every once in a while, however.

[Cadrid]

Originally Posted by gremlinz273

What about a limit to the number of times you can post in the same thread per day?

If you cant make your point in a few posts, than perhaps you never will. This should put a stop to some of the forum domination, and trying to be right via brute force repetition. Hopefully, it would encourage more thought out posts and less derailment in to off-topic inanity.

Some points against it that I can think of, you might hit the post limit without being able to answer questions or make corrections. Well, if your message is valid, someone else will likely pick it up and continue it. Also, you can just come back the next day to respond. It discourages the sort of hot-fire rapid discourse some of you prefer, well, thats kind of the point.

The number of posts isn't the issue, though. One post is enough to send a thread spiraling out of control, making a bee-line toward the Rickshaw. Even ignoring that, why should a great number of perfectly reasonable forum-goers have their rights limited based on the actions of a few bad apples? Punish those responsible, not those harmed.

[Twobit Whore]

Originally Posted by r.gun

I don't recall Utnayan naming Nino as the source.

He didn't, directly. He launched a pre-emptive strike at holymight in a post days ago. By using the amazing powers of deduction you can conclude that the PM he posted was the thing he had previously threatened to post in that initial post. When I went back and scanned that post looking for the source who sent it to him I only saw holymight's name.

I still don't buy into the malicious intent though. He had the option of denying that PM in question is the one he posted, even though it isn't difficult to figure out. Nino stepped in and owned up to it, which is certainly commendable if not foolhardy.

Equal blame all around really.

-holymight never should have sent that shit to Utnayan, especially in an attempt to 'show him up', which is likely the case. He wouldn't send that to him as a 'friendly guide on where he could go at 35+', because he knew he didn't even have a character in that level range.

-Utnayan should not have posted it in the way he did. There are ways to post it without quoting it verbatim, and while the supporters may call bullshit on it, they will do that anyway. Anyone can forge a post, and even if the post is real they can call it outdated. No way to win there really.

-Nino confessed to it. A potentially noble sacrifice, maybe.. but one he made willingly. Gotta commend the spirit however. No one here has ever questioned Nino's passion or dedication to the project.

[woqqqa]

Originally Posted by Twobit Whore

He didn't, directly. He launched a pre-emptive strike at holymight in a post days ago. By using the amazing powers of deduction you can conclude that the PM he posted was the thing he had previously threatened to post in that initial post. When I went back and scanned that post looking for the source who sent it to him I only saw holymight's name.

Really? I distinctly recall reading about him mentioning that "PM from Nino", before Nino came out and owned up to it later. Maybe he edited out Nino's name later, realizing he'd mentioned something he shouldn't have? And he claims the PM didn't come from a regular poster on here. I'm a bit confused, really.

[Rayne]

Originally Posted by Nólaquen

Alright, now you're arguing just for the sake of arguing and I think you're trying to trap me into it.

Well, not exactly. And I apologise if it seemed that way. But that thread directly deals with the reasons players are leaving Vanguard. And given the current state of the entire issue, of course its going to draw a crowd of dissention like an ATM exploding in the middle of NYC

Taking into account that SV is a Vanguard "affiliate" site, of course its going to be crawling with vanbois out for naysayer blood. So yes, i'd certainly expect that a much more stringent form of moderation would be in place before corralling those naysayers into a single thread. Theres only one way it could possibly go without strict moderation.

I'm sure it was a good faith gesture, and those posters were given that thread to air thier reasons for leaving. And since it seems that SV is a bit understaffed, i'd think that someone exemplifying a few of those replys as "how not to respond to a player leaving" would get the message of the rule across loud and clear. I'm sure you all have your hands full over there, so I can certainly understand getting a few days behind.

[Duppin]

It is amazing the lengths that people will go to to excuse Utnayan's actions and try to foist the blame off on, well, pretty much anyone else.

Regardless, back to the original topic: Nino rocks and, even if he violated some sort of policy, an exception should be made for the goodwill he's fostered.

[Twobit Whore]

Originally Posted by woqqqa

Really? I distinctly recall reading about him mentioning that "PM from Nino", before Nino came out and owned up to it later. Maybe he edited out Nino's name later, realizing he'd mentioned something he shouldn't have? And he claims the PM didn't come from a regular poster on here. I'm a bit confused, really.

Yes, in the original post he said 'holymight don't make me post that PM from Nino'. In the super mega OMG post, he claims it was a different post from an unnamed source who doesn't post here. All very confusing, really.

[woqqqa]

Originally Posted by Twobit Whore

Yes, in the original post he said 'holymight don't make me post that PM from Nino'. In the super mega OMG post, he claims it was a different post from an unnamed source who doesn't post here. All very confusing, really.

Oh okay, I though you'd gone back to the original post where he threatened Holymight with the PM and Nino's name was no longer mentioned. Nevermind then, it all makes sense. I just misunderstood your earlier post.