Nino...One of the upsides of VG.

[The Hiram Key]

Originally Posted by leane

Thing is its like Nino said, Furor's ranting wasn't just some asshole spewing venom, it was him trying to improve the game. This is about the other kind of posters just spewing venom and trying to destroy, their actions only drive away developers who WANT to be open with the community, but now can't.

Why should any other developer even try to be open with players if all they are going to recieve is insults and attacks? Might as well hide behind a screen of CMs and just implement game changes.

Couple points you bring up here that I want to cover. Depending on who was reading Furor's comments, it's entirely possible that "somone" could have considered him (back then) an "asshole spewing venom". Part of what got me here to these forums in the first place, was a link (from where I don't know) of a rant by Furor about cockblocking and mobs being unkillable or something along those lines.

He was not nice, he was insulting in the extreme, and he talked to the developers like they were morons and needed to get with his program. (if anyone want's to dispute that, go right ahead, that's how I remember it).

You mention developers being "driven away" and to date, I cannot recall a single developer who claimed to be "driven away". Sure, it's a convenient explanation for why a dev might stop posting for a month or two, but so is "we have an expansion in the works" or "my wife just had a baby" or "I am on safari in Africa". Do you have any links to where a dev said they were "driven away" by the tone of this forum ? Please do link them if so.

Finally (as been said in this thread several times) there are several developers who come here, and make "straight shooter" posts, they have clean, productive and enjoyable threads with next to no flaming. They are open, they communicate, there is no issue.

The only developer I can see (currently) who is having a hard time around here (of course) is Brad. I won't go into the reasons WHY he is (others have covered it very well) but in essence, he asked for it.

In closing, there is nothing wrong with these forums whatsoever. You are buying into the hype (or shall we call it "brainwashing" ?), are on the bandwagon, and have no idea what you are talking about.

[kcxiv]

got me my sig. thx gnome.

[The Hiram Key]

Originally Posted by Gnome Eater

I am going to repeat this a few times till you get it.

You or Utnayan are no fucking Furor. Furor was a brilliant guild leader of the most cutting edge guild on EQ with great ideas on game design. You are anon dipshits who abuse the anonimity of the internet to try to get nerdthug fame by flaming developers who cannot fight you on your own terms.

Gnome, I never claimed to be, or wanted to be "Furor". I am forced to use him as an example to defend how this forum works, because it seems many people don't understand it at all. I do not dispute that Furor was a brilliant guild leader or that he had great ideas on game design (obviously).

I am not really sure why you are attempting to associate what we do with what he did, beyond the very basic concept of ranting / speaking our minds. I can recall furor saying something along the lines of "If you dumb fucks don't fix this shit soon me and my entire guild are out of here" (thats paraphrased of course). Assuming my memory is serving me well, how is that not being a nerdthug flaming a developer who can't fight on their terms ?

I think you are way off base, and are misunderstanding what I at least am doing around here, I urge you to go back and reread whatever it is that set you off, after you have a chance to cool down.

PS: I wonder if calling me a dipshit would get you a temp ban if this forum goes heavy mod.. ? Hmmmm

[Ssinurn]

I was thinking Requiem could modify his forum watch software to be a rated/bubble up sort of view for the board. If you don't like it don't use it. I don't really wanna see perma bans. Even the worst posters sometimes make a good post.

I know I personally am on information overload with the forums I visit, and I love some good drama and a rant more than anyone, but somedays I just want to come see good discussion about whatever game I'm playing (hopefully high end content). Not every game has EJ or Order of the Blue Gartr LS (FFXI) to limit the BS.

If a good rating system was used (I'm sure there are some boards that have some that are good), and a VIEW was used of the board in /. style that would work.

That way if you don't want any moderation and prefer to scroll past trash posts/users yourself you can do that, but if you are short on time or prefer a bit of board modded discussion you could use that view.

That way if a really good thread seems like you are missing some leet drama and you have time to read you could switch views and read it all if you so choose.

[kcxiv]

They are just scared that they wont be able to post here any longer. Well, maybe not scared, but they just wont be able to post the same stuff 20 times in 1 thread. More moderation is needed for some decent discussions.

[Twobit Whore]

I'm pretty sure THK is right, there would be far more VG supporters (or Utnayan haters) recieving vacations than the people you would silence.

[The Hiram Key]

Originally Posted by Twobit Whore

I'm pretty sure THK is right, there would be far more VG supporters (or Utnayan haters) recieving vacations than the people you would silence.

Thanks, I don't understand why these guys are so blind to the very obvious. One of the Axis of Equal posters jumps in a thread, make a comment, and 10-20 people flame the shit out of them for what they say.

They want to ban the flamers, when in reality it is themselves who they want to ban, which is crazy. Do you have any ideas on how we can make these guys wake up and smell what they are shoveling ? I am trying to reason with them but I don't seem to be having alot of luck

[Szlia]

The Hiram Key would be a good politician. Let me ask the same question more directly: When you post a rant about something, anything, what is your intention? Furor's intention was to make the game he and his friends played better. What's yours?

[Kildace]

Originally Posted by Twobit Whore

I'm pretty sure THK is right, there would be far more VG supporters (or Utnayan haters) recieving vacations than the people you would silence.

And? If these people post piles of worthless crap I don't see the problem, in the end it only improves the quality of the board.

I'm all for the same rules applying to everyone.

[xmod2]

Originally Posted by Szlia

The Hiram Key would be a good politician. Let me ask the same question more directly: When you post a rant about something, anything, what is your intention? Furor's intention was to make the game he and his friends played better. What's yours?

This board is now about the MMORPG genre as a whole.

Therefore new crusades must be fought for the genre as a whole and not just some particular game.

Duh

[Twobit Whore]

Originally Posted by Kildace

And? If these people post piles of worthless crap I don't see the problem, in the end it only improves the quality of the board.

I'm all for the same rules applying to everyone.

Yes, that is fine. I was just offering a response to the notion that people are 'scared' they might lose posting rights or something.

[Lyenae]

Originally Posted by Szlia

The Hiram Key would be a good politician. Let me ask the same question more directly: When you post a rant about something, anything, what is your intention? Furor's intention was to make the game he and his friends played better. What's yours?

To make the game worth playing for him and his friends.

[woqqqa]

Originally Posted by xmod2

This board is now about the MMORPG genre as a whole.

Therefore new crusades must be fought for the genre as a whole and not just some particular game.

Duh

In other words, let's make it known that if someone puts out a half finished them and then tries to hype it here that they're not wanted?

[The Hiram Key]

Originally Posted by Szlia

The Hiram Key would be a good politician. Let me ask the same question more directly: When you post a rant about something, anything, what is your intention? Furor's intention was to make the game he and his friends played better. What's yours?

Wouldn't that be neat if I revealed that I was a major politician with national exposure and hanging out on this forum is what I do in my free time ? That would be a gas !!!

Not that I have posted much ranting as of late (there was no point, VG was released, the truth was out there for all to see) but when I rant I try to get people to see what I see. To understand why what I am ranting about is wrong, and why it needs to be fixed.

I don't pretend to be someone who knows everything from mechanics to zone design or anything like that, but I can definately tell you when something sucks, and I can tell you why. Occasionally, I can even offer an alternative, and generally speaking, the rant itself should steer you in the direction you need to go to to fix the issue in the first place.

I suppose I could offer 3 possible solutions for every rant I post (and hell I may be required to do so to continue posting here if some people have their way) but I figure if I say "Vanguard's world is too fucking big, I don't see other players for hours and it's 10 minutes of running before I even see a mob" I would think the solution to that problem is pretty obvious.

Maybe some people just need it spelled out for them, letter by bloody letter.

Alas~

[The Hiram Key]

Originally Posted by Lyenae

To make the game worth playing for him and his friends.

Lyenae, you are hot, let's make out !