Vanguard Update #1 + First Test Server Patch Notes

[Ravensign]

Originally Posted by Itzena

Why not just borrow rest xp from EQ2/WoW instead?

What's great about rest XP for retention, is that it makes you inclined to come back.

When you "quit" EQ2/WoW and decide to come back, you get all this rest, calling you... "Hey come on back, you have full rest, it'll be fun and easy, you know you want to"

When you contemplate coming back to a, say COH char, there is not that pull, and in fact if you have XP Debt, its still sitting there, a barrier (of sorts) to returning.

[Flight]

Originally Posted by Ravensign

What's great about rest XP for retention, is that it makes you inclined to come back.

When you "quit" EQ2/WoW and decide to come back, you get all this rest, calling you... "Hey come on back, you have full rest, it'll be fun and easy, you know you want to"

When you contemplate coming back to a, say COH char, there is not that pull, and in fact if you have XP Debt, its still sitting there, a barrier (of sorts) to returning.

Rested XP is a terrific idea.

My experience of the game over the last double XP weekend was not good. The folks who Brad has identified it as being aimed at actually didnt benefit too much, as a majority of the areas folks in the lvl 15-25 level use were overcrowded to the extent you hung around with other folk waiting for mobs to spawn, especially quest mobs.

All the higher level folk, with more extensive game knowledge either had less competition due to not so many people of their level or of knowing where to go miles away with fewer folk.

Rested XP caps in other games at 75% of a level extra XP; this would help the people with less time much more and would keep them coming back.

[Ham n Cheese]

Yeah after playing WoW I think rest exp is amazing. It's great for someone like me who doesn't have the same time to play and it keeps us subscribing because we feel like we're able to accomplish something in the amount of time we do have to play. Plus if you can't play for a few days, big deal, FULL REST XP IS WAITING

[Alarion]

Brad,
I am curious what is going on with the test server. Is this going to basically be a live server, that gets the new patches first?

I made a suggestion on another forum, and figured I would restate it in here just to get it seen.

I think having two test servers, of different types would be extremely beneficial.
The two servers:

Normal Test Server
Pretty much like described above. It's a normal server, with no character wipes, that gets the patches applied first. This allows the changes to be tested in a normal gameplay environment.

Unit Testing Server
This is more akin to how WoW's test server is setup, in that character wipes happen frequently and you can start off above level 1. My idea would be to be able to create a level 1 character, then talk to an NPC and get promoted to any level attainable in the game. Another NPC for acquiring some basic gear for the level you are would also be a good idea. Provide some UI enhancments or some way to display some "debug" type of information that you cannot see on the live or normal test server. Nothing major, but being able to see DPS, or some more detailed inner workings of the combat system. The purpose of this server is to allow devs to get concise, targetted feedback for specific changes that need testing - and also to allow those noticing bugs to be able to test them in an environment that let's them reproduce them consistently. You can't "unit test" a quest bug on the normal test server because you only get one shot at the quest. Once it's done - it's done.

But for example, with the big damage changes that were made in Update #1, people could login, create a monk or disciple or cleric or whatever and test their damage output at level 10, at level 20, 30, 40, etc. They could have helped identify inconsistencies in the damage curve. Things like "Well, yeah I am doing less damage now and it's within reason up until level 24, where my dps took a major dip, then shot back up at level 32.


Basically, if you want us to test things for you - you need to give us the ability to do so. Having *only* a "normal" test server us going to result in a lot more patches that end up like Update #1 - unless your internal testing team steps it up.

All that said, I'm a weird one I guess. I enjoy testing stuff out and trying new things and such.

[Hachima]

Originally Posted by Aradune Mithara

Repair costs are being looked into. Nothing to announce yet, but it is an issue being discussed.

This is good to hear. Right now the repair mechanism is really stopping groups from exploring some of the longer deep dungeon areas. As a healer I'm only down to 80% durability when the tank is at 0%, and this is with 0 deaths, if deaths even break gear faster. We have to resort to silly tactics such as killing the tank on purpose so he can go repair and then res him back. I know there are repair items but at the current cost they are pretty expensive for what the crafters charge for them, even at level 40+. Even then you still have the issue where it's usually the tanks that would be the ones buying these and not other classes. Which is fine for set groups when people would pitch in together to get repair stones but for random groups it still isn't the best solution.

[Guzrog]

While I dig the mechanic (to a degree) and benefits of rested XP, I like being able to just log out in the wilderness or near/in a dungeon (especially in VG.) I enjoy not feeling like I have to get to the nearest inn or forced player hub or "I'm cheating myself." It has nothing to do with the travel, I just like logging out wherever I feel like, and not feeling bound to such a mechanic. I'd prefer not to have rest xp for this reason alone. Of course its just a personal preference.

[Braen]

Originally Posted by Guzrog

While I dig the mechanic (to a degree) and benefits of rested XP, I like being able to just log out in the wilderness or near/in a dungeon (especially in VG.) I enjoy not feeling like I have to get to the nearest inn or forced player hub or "I'm cheating myself." It has nothing to do with the travel, I just like logging out wherever I feel like, and not feeling bound to such a mechanic. I'd prefer not to have rest xp for this reason alone. Of course its just a personal preference.

Maybe some sort of tent/camp you can purchase that can simulate an Inn... maybe even player crafted... With different levels of quality granting a faster rested state. maybe even make them drops or diplomacy rewards...

the tent can be single player usable and the "camp" can be a group of friends that can take a benefit from it. If they camp within that area, they they all will get the rested benefit. Helps the whole Fellowship/Caravan idea... people traveling and grouping together.

The "lore" behind WoWs rested state was if you didn't camp in an Inn then you would not get a good rest. Well the tents can give you a parital benefit depending on the quality of the tent you are using.

[Kolle]

nice to see some official replies


as to the chunking issue:

6300 duo
2gb ram
8800 gts 320mb

I get no chunking time usually. Like it was said earlier, I simply stop running forward and have to start running again. Also, I would definitely support rest xp over bonus xp weekends. I don't mind at all that casuals get a little boost to their xp gains.

[kcxiv]

rested XP is nice, but i think he wants everyone to be on at the same time on a weekend. Last weekend zones were just freaking overpacked and crashing left and right. Glad i moved out of the CiS area, its going to be pretty nuts tomorrow i bet.

[Locithon]

Originally Posted by Aradune Mithara

Quite frankly, no BSing around, it's a preemptive attempt at giving players who have less time to play a boost and to give people something to look forward to and to keep subscribing. We want to do things that encourage people to keep subscribing. That said, I think it can be taken too far and it also allows people who already play a lot to advance that much more quickly. It definitely could be taken too far which is something we're aware of.

On the same note I must admit i'm a little concernced with the subscription numbers. Using VGcensus it seems there may only be around 50,000 current subscribers. I mean, this game seems like it took alot of money to make and that you have alot of employees. If subscriptions don't go up dramatically will you be forced to let some people go? What's the number of subscribers you would need to keep things going the way they are now? I'd hate to put 2+ years into this game only to see it dramatically reduced in scope and new content because you don't have enough subscribers to keep all the people you need.

Because more people seem to be leaving than coming in, we've lost i'd say around 8-10 guild members out of about 30 because they didn't resubscribe. Hopefully you can subdue my fears though.

[Vinen]

Originally Posted by Hachima

This is good to hear. Right now the repair mechanism is really stopping groups from exploring some of the longer deep dungeon areas. As a healer I'm only down to 80% durability when the tank is at 0%, and this is with 0 deaths, if deaths even break gear faster. We have to resort to silly tactics such as killing the tank on purpose so he can go repair and then res him back. I know there are repair items but at the current cost they are pretty expensive for what the crafters charge for them, even at level 40+. Even then you still have the issue where it's usually the tanks that would be the ones buying these and not other classes. Which is fine for set groups when people would pitch in together to get repair stones but for random groups it still isn't the best solution.

Crafters can create a repair bot that you can take with you... although they appear to be charging a lot right now (20s)... but, I'm pretty sure that price will drop... I hope.

[Nino]

Originally Posted by Alarion

Brad,
I am curious what is going on with the test server. Is this going to basically be a live server, that gets the new patches first?

I made a suggestion on another forum, and figured I would restate it in here just to get it seen.

I think having two test servers, of different types would be extremely beneficial.
The two servers:

Normal Test Server
Pretty much like described above. It's a normal server, with no character wipes, that gets the patches applied first. This allows the changes to be tested in a normal gameplay environment.

Unit Testing Server
This is more akin to how WoW's test server is setup, in that character wipes happen frequently and you can start off above level 1. My idea would be to be able to create a level 1 character, then talk to an NPC and get promoted to any level attainable in the game. Another NPC for acquiring some basic gear for the level you are would also be a good idea. Provide some UI enhancments or some way to display some "debug" type of information that you cannot see on the live or normal test server. Nothing major, but being able to see DPS, or some more detailed inner workings of the combat system. The purpose of this server is to allow devs to get concise, targetted feedback for specific changes that need testing - and also to allow those noticing bugs to be able to test them in an environment that let's them reproduce them consistently. You can't "unit test" a quest bug on the normal test server because you only get one shot at the quest. Once it's done - it's done.

But for example, with the big damage changes that were made in Update #1, people could login, create a monk or disciple or cleric or whatever and test their damage output at level 10, at level 20, 30, 40, etc. They could have helped identify inconsistencies in the damage curve. Things like "Well, yeah I am doing less damage now and it's within reason up until level 24, where my dps took a major dip, then shot back up at level 32.


Basically, if you want us to test things for you - you need to give us the ability to do so. Having *only* a "normal" test server us going to result in a lot more patches that end up like Update #1 - unless your internal testing team steps it up.

All that said, I'm a weird one I guess. I enjoy testing stuff out and trying new things and such.

I can answer this one.

The test server is indeed a liver server that will receive patches before we fire them off to the rest of the servers. The population is fairly low there right now and we could use some help getting folks established so we CAN get patches tested better before they hit the bulk of our customers. We've been talking about ways to get people interested in moving to test or starting there. Things like accelerated exp gain, flying mount weekends, no exp loss on death, etc. Nothing is set yet, but we obviously need incentives to draw people in. I am actually considering moving my character there strictly out of principle. When we have the final details I will make sure they get posted here.

[Jooka]

Id like to play on the test server but doubt I could get my friends to switch this late into release. If you made the incentives good enough they might consider it. still doubt they would but maybe and I don't get to play enough to play two servers.

[Caocao]

Vinen, which crafters can craft these bots and what tier? The only repair bot I know of is in the Zeraj Arena and I think is a one time use for 100 coins so F' that. Also does this thing last for awhile etc, any extra information would be a lot of help, thanks.

[Aegorian]

Originally Posted by Nino

I can answer this one.

The test server is indeed a liver server that will receive patches before we fire them off to the rest of the servers. The population is fairly low there right now and we could use some help getting folks established so we CAN get patches tested better before they hit the bulk of our customers. We've been talking about ways to get people interested in moving to test or starting there. Things like accelerated exp gain, flying mount weekends, no exp loss on death, etc. Nothing is set yet, but we obviously need incentives to draw people in. I am actually considering moving my character there strictly out of principle. When we have the final details I will make sure they get posted here.

You know, i've never liked the concept of the Test Server being in Live Server format. I understand why you need it as such, but i would much rather be able to make whatever character i want at whatever level i want which starts with some baseline gear so i can get right in and test changes/additions. New Zone? Load up a level appropriate char with baseline gear and go test it. Class changes? Load up a PC of that class and test them. etc. Seems like you detract from actual testing if you dont allow for flexibility in what people can do/test. I want to TEST on the test server, not play.

Just my 2cp.