[WoW] The Arena Thread

Jubee · 02-20-2007, 11:08 AM

We are 5 days into season 1 and I'm curious how other people feel about the arena. I'm sure this will turn into a "nerf everything except my class" thread in under a page, but I might as well try. Let me start off by saying I'm a 41 Holy/20 Prot BE Pally.

Geography: As a healer, I'd like to give a huge middle finger to Nagrand arena. Fights tend to hug the pillars and it's ridiculously easy to lose LOS mid-heal. Blade's Edge is more my style though. The LOS issues aren't as bad and I think the pillars are a perfect distance from the bridge. I'm sure they would be a little more aggravating for melee classes that can get sniped from the distance, but with my team setup they can be handy some times.

Brackets: I've played 20+ games in all 3 brackets and I'm a little surprised at what is actually winning. CC isn't nearly as effective as I thought it would be in the 2v2 brackets. My 2v2 team has a frost mage and a shadow priest of similar gear and I'm doing much better with the pure DPS of the priest rather than the "ok I'm going to Poly the healer. He trinketed. I'm gonna polly again" style of the Mage. They have similar problems when it's the mage/priest. Pure burn DPS seems to be winning the 2v2.

Our 3v3 is where we shine. Between the 3 of us we have 5 instant cast spell interrupts and the pollies can be spread out to burn trinkets/wait off diminishing returns. Our CC keeps healers in check for the most part and then they focus fire down the biggest threat (which isn't always the squishiest class.) We started finding some even matches once we hit 1700 rating, but they were beating us with CC just like we were beating them with CC.

5v5 is a fight between the healers. We created a 5v5 last night just to dick around and we plateaued much faster than the 2v2 or 3v3 brackets. We definitely didn't have the optimal setup (Frost Mage, Shadow Priest, Holy Pally, MM Hunter, Rogue) but our healing just couldn't keep up, even with the priest going Healbot. Maybe we would have been better off if he was specced Holy, but it was obvious we needed some more healing power.

Cad · 02-20-2007, 11:16 AM

I've been having alot more fun in 5v5 (27 and 5 as of last night) than 2v2. Haven't tried 3v3 yet but it's on the plate. My 2v2 team is me (feral druid) holy priest and affliction warlock. Me and the warlock sub in and out.

5v5 is holy pally, disc priest, mm hunter, mutilate rogue, and me. Pure dps burn has pretty much ruled both brackets imo; we've been able to successfully assist train 2 of the 5 of the other team in almost every game to start, even with BoP's flying. Then again our priest/pally combo are probably 2 of the best players I've ever seen.

And I'd just like to say, fuck blades edge with a rusty fork. That bridge screws melee so bad it's not even funny. Especially stealth melee.

Wildstone · 02-20-2007, 11:40 AM

The very concept of the "terrain" in an Arena is fucking stupid. All the classes are pretty well balanced in an open field group fight. All the pillars and bridges do is fuck over certain classes (ranged in Nagrand, melee in Blade's Edge).

Weritech · 02-20-2007, 11:48 AM

Unfortunately, the only people I know who are really interested in arena matches are lazy about leveling and are just now hitting 70.

So far I've just been doing randoms and I've been very disappointed with how often I've wound up in lopsided (2v5) 5v5 practices.

WarderX · 02-20-2007, 12:06 PM

3v3 is the funnest, to me at least, because it somehow ends up being the most unpredictable.

My friends and I have access to (sometimes multiples of) every class except druid atm, and we have tried some pretty fun combos.

My favorite "fun" build so far is Shadowpriest, Mage, Warlock brute force team. There are a lot of fun 'edge of your seat' moments with this build, we have not lost yet but the close fights end pretty close.

Our most effective but boringly slow team is warrior, paladin, rogue.

Jubee · 02-20-2007, 12:41 PM

I just logged on a few minutes ago and only 1 person out of our team has honor points calculated. We wound up with 498. So I flew up to Area 52 just to stare at the epics that I won't be able to afford for another 2 weeks (which is acceptable for the effort required.) As I'm scrolling through em, it finally hits me. The only +dmg 1 hander is a fucking dagger. No sword/axe/mace for Pallies. Bummed, I go "Meh, I'll just get the HWL version." I hopped on Wowhead and sure as shit, no sword/axe/mace version either.

Awesome. Gratz me on using the Keepers of Time Revered Sword forever.

Olio · 02-20-2007, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jubee

I just logged on a few minutes ago and only 1 person out of our team has honor points calculated. We wound up with 498. So I flew up to Area 52 just to stare at the epics that I won't be able to afford for another 2 weeks (which is acceptable for the effort required.) As I'm scrolling through em, it finally hits me. The only +dmg 1 hander is a fucking dagger. No sword/axe/mace for Pallies. Bummed, I go "Meh, I'll just get the HWL version." I hopped on Wowhead and sure as shit, no sword/axe/mace version either.

Awesome. Gratz me on using the Keepers of Time Revered Sword forever.

Lower City exalted hammer is probably better. Hope you like Shadow Labs.

XI- · 02-20-2007, 01:14 PM

There's a few problems with the arena now that can be seperated into 2 distinct categories.

The first is class balance. Gibcraft is still alive, and highly successful, at least on BG6. People are getting burned down in seconds by timers, with the prime offenders being AP spellpower/frost mages, and elemental shaman.

Another thing in this category is cyclone. Uncounterable CC is stupid, it was stupid in WC3, it's still stupid now, especially for a spell with a relatively short cast time and no cooldown.

You can also look at racials here. I really don't want to start this shit again in another thread but I wouldn't be surprised to see the vast majority of teams left standing in the world competition are horde. BLA BLA BLA about the other bullshit but I can tell you plain and simple AoE fear has cost us matches, that could have been prevented with wotf. I can't say that any match has been won by stone form or perception or anything else that alliance brings to the table.

The second is the way rewards are doled out. A top 5v5 arena team would need to maintain a ranking of 2250 or so to be able to purchase every reward in 2 months. Right now people are plateauing so fast, and with not nearly high enough ratings. Perhaps this is due to not enough people queuing up but I forsee it being hard for even the best teams to generate sufficient points to be able to finish their sets inside of 1 season.

As a sidebar to this doling out special arena rewards by server is stupid. Competition is cross server now, so the rewards should be also. There's 18 servers in my battlegroup. Our 5s rating is only 18xx so pretty good, but nothing spectacular and definitely not in range of earning said rewards. Yet I only get games against people from 3 servers, Korgath, Mug'thol, and 1 guild from Garithos. That's it. There's no way some mouth breathing fucktard from a backwater server deserves X reward or title for sucking dick and ending the season with a 1700 rating. It doesn't matter to me that I'll never see them, the concept of it is fundamentally idiotic.

XI- · 02-20-2007, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jubee

I just logged on a few minutes ago and only 1 person out of our team has honor points calculated. We wound up with 498. So I flew up to Area 52 just to stare at the epics that I won't be able to afford for another 2 weeks (which is acceptable for the effort required.) As I'm scrolling through em, it finally hits me. The only +dmg 1 hander is a fucking dagger. No sword/axe/mace for Pallies. Bummed, I go "Meh, I'll just get the HWL version." I hopped on Wowhead and sure as shit, no sword/axe/mace version either.

Awesome. Gratz me on using the Keepers of Time Revered Sword forever.

I wouldn't be surprised to see healing accessories, gems, weapons, etc coming down the pipeline, remember how late into beta they ever bothered to add healing armor sets to the mix.

Johnnyseattle · 02-20-2007, 01:54 PM

I'd like to say that I really enjoyed the two years that I didn't have to play against paladins. Fuck, they're annoying if played well. I haven't seen a 5v5 team without at least one, and most of them have two that i've seen. Including a 2 paladin, 3 warlock team that I just laughed at as they annhilated us.

Still having a good time though, it's a good break in the monotony of instancing/raiding for us.

Jubee · 02-20-2007, 02:00 PM

I'm interested in seeing how the points eventually even out. My 27-10 3v3 team got a whopping 96 points more than my brother's "lets create a 5v5, kick out 10 games, then log" team. I'm fine with 2v2 and 3v3 getting a smaller percent of the points since it's easier to manage, but if my team plateaus I will finish my full set about 1 week before he does just playing 10 random games and logging.

Digo · 02-20-2007, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XI-

The first is class balance. Gibcraft is still alive, and highly successful, at least on BG6. People are getting burned down in seconds by timers, with the prime offenders being AP spellpower/frost mages, and elemental shaman.

The assist trains in 5v5 are unbelievable.

If you don't have at least 2 different kinds of mass crowd control or way of breaking up the assist train, you are hosed. For this reason, I vastly prefer 2v2 and 3v3 since the fights tend to go on longer and are less prone to instagibbing, unless of course you're up against 2 PoM mages in which case you are probably fucked.

JustSoul · 02-20-2007, 04:07 PM

My point of view as an arena warlock.

Fuck blizzard really. Healthstone ritual takes up a shard, my insta dd takes up a shard, because damn kills dont give exp or honor. My team really enjoys waiting for me till i farm shards for a new fight.

Engineering is broken right now. 4k absorb shield, net, poly, 300% speed boost you name it.

Melee dps , namely rogues, own too much. Best 2vs2 team : Pala rogue or Pala warrior. Best 3 vs 3 team: Pala rogue warrior. WoW? In 5 vs 5 warlocks do have some use, but you absolutely must have a good pally to stand a chance and ours is not playing nearly enough.

Edit: A +45 stam trinket that makes you immune to fear for 30 sec? Make warlocks more useless please?

Twobit Whore · 02-20-2007, 04:10 PM

Sorry, but warlock tears do not sway me. Fear is so broken in arenas right now its not funny. That and cyclone. I have been chain feared for full duration I don't know how many times. I have been perma cycloned for entire fights. Diminishing returns seem to not be in effect, or maybe they just don't work on me.. but there is no way that fear should be 12 seconds, over and over.

JustSoul · 02-20-2007, 04:14 PM

Get a trinket that makes you immune to fear for 30 sec? Or maybe the fact that 50%+ of high ranked groups consist of paladin and melee dps train? Can fear be more useless?

Warlocks own casters. Me and a priest have lost maybe 1 out of 30 fights vs caster teams. We ve won maybe 2 out of 15 rogue + paladin fights tho. Trust me its freaking impossible.

02-20-2007, 11:16 AM	#2 (permalink)
Cad Registered User Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 5,243	I've been having alot more fun in 5v5 (27 and 5 as of last night) than 2v2. Haven't tried 3v3 yet but it's on the plate. My 2v2 team is me (feral druid) holy priest and affliction warlock. Me and the warlock sub in and out. 5v5 is holy pally, disc priest, mm hunter, mutilate rogue, and me. Pure dps burn has pretty much ruled both brackets imo; we've been able to successfully assist train 2 of the 5 of the other team in almost every game to start, even with BoP's flying. Then again our priest/pally combo are probably 2 of the best players I've ever seen. And I'd just like to say, fuck blades edge with a rusty fork. That bridge screws melee so bad it's not even funny. Especially stealth melee. Last edited by Cad : 02-20-2007 at 11:20 AM.

02-20-2007, 04:10 PM	#14 (permalink)
Twobit Whore Insert Quarter Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 8,826 -26 Internets	Sorry, but warlock tears do not sway me. Fear is so broken in arenas right now its not funny. That and cyclone. I have been chain feared for full duration I don't know how many times. I have been perma cycloned for entire fights. Diminishing returns seem to not be in effect, or maybe they just don't work on me.. but there is no way that fear should be 12 seconds, over and over. __________________ I got a list of demands written on the palm of my hand. I ball my fists and you gonna know where I stand.

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02-20-2007, 11:40 AM	#3 (permalink)
Wildstone Meh Join Date: May 2006 Location: Florida Posts: 507 +0 Internets	The very concept of the "terrain" in an Arena is fucking stupid. All the classes are pretty well balanced in an open field group fight. All the pillars and bridges do is fuck over certain classes (ranged in Nagrand, melee in Blade's Edge).

02-20-2007, 11:48 AM	#4 (permalink)
Weritech Registered User Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 383 +0 Internets	Unfortunately, the only people I know who are really interested in arena matches are lazy about leveling and are just now hitting 70. So far I've just been doing randoms and I've been very disappointed with how often I've wound up in lopsided (2v5) 5v5 practices.

02-20-2007, 12:06 PM	#5 (permalink)
WarderX Registered User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Atlanta, Georgia Posts: 1,593 +1 Internets	3v3 is the funnest, to me at least, because it somehow ends up being the most unpredictable. My friends and I have access to (sometimes multiples of) every class except druid atm, and we have tried some pretty fun combos. My favorite "fun" build so far is Shadowpriest, Mage, Warlock brute force team. There are a lot of fun 'edge of your seat' moments with this build, we have not lost yet but the close fights end pretty close. Our most effective but boringly slow team is warrior, paladin, rogue.

02-20-2007, 01:14 PM	#8 (permalink)
XI- Registered User Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 71 -5 Internets	There's a few problems with the arena now that can be seperated into 2 distinct categories. The first is class balance. Gibcraft is still alive, and highly successful, at least on BG6. People are getting burned down in seconds by timers, with the prime offenders being AP spellpower/frost mages, and elemental shaman. Another thing in this category is cyclone. Uncounterable CC is stupid, it was stupid in WC3, it's still stupid now, especially for a spell with a relatively short cast time and no cooldown. You can also look at racials here. I really don't want to start this shit again in another thread but I wouldn't be surprised to see the vast majority of teams left standing in the world competition are horde. BLA BLA BLA about the other bullshit but I can tell you plain and simple AoE fear has cost us matches, that could have been prevented with wotf. I can't say that any match has been won by stone form or perception or anything else that alliance brings to the table. The second is the way rewards are doled out. A top 5v5 arena team would need to maintain a ranking of 2250 or so to be able to purchase every reward in 2 months. Right now people are plateauing so fast, and with not nearly high enough ratings. Perhaps this is due to not enough people queuing up but I forsee it being hard for even the best teams to generate sufficient points to be able to finish their sets inside of 1 season. As a sidebar to this doling out special arena rewards by server is stupid. Competition is cross server now, so the rewards should be also. There's 18 servers in my battlegroup. Our 5s rating is only 18xx so pretty good, but nothing spectacular and definitely not in range of earning said rewards. Yet I only get games against people from 3 servers, Korgath, Mug'thol, and 1 guild from Garithos. That's it. There's no way some mouth breathing fucktard from a backwater server deserves X reward or title for sucking dick and ending the season with a 1700 rating. It doesn't matter to me that I'll never see them, the concept of it is fundamentally idiotic.

02-20-2007, 01:54 PM	#10 (permalink)
Johnnyseattle Bollocks Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Virginia Beach Posts: 12 +0 Internets	I'd like to say that I really enjoyed the two years that I didn't have to play against paladins. Fuck, they're annoying if played well. I haven't seen a 5v5 team without at least one, and most of them have two that i've seen. Including a 2 paladin, 3 warlock team that I just laughed at as they annhilated us. Still having a good time though, it's a good break in the monotony of instancing/raiding for us.

02-20-2007, 04:07 PM	#13 (permalink)
JustSoul Registered User Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 3 +0 Internets	My point of view as an arena warlock. Fuck blizzard really. Healthstone ritual takes up a shard, my insta dd takes up a shard, because damn kills dont give exp or honor. My team really enjoys waiting for me till i farm shards for a new fight. Engineering is broken right now. 4k absorb shield, net, poly, 300% speed boost you name it. Melee dps , namely rogues, own too much. Best 2vs2 team : Pala rogue or Pala warrior. Best 3 vs 3 team: Pala rogue warrior. WoW? In 5 vs 5 warlocks do have some use, but you absolutely must have a good pally to stand a chance and ours is not playing nearly enough. Edit: A +45 stam trinket that makes you immune to fear for 30 sec? Make warlocks more useless please?

02-20-2007, 04:14 PM	#15 (permalink)
JustSoul Registered User Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 3 +0 Internets	Get a trinket that makes you immune to fear for 30 sec? Or maybe the fact that 50%+ of high ranked groups consist of paladin and melee dps train? Can fear be more useless? Warlocks own casters. Me and a priest have lost maybe 1 out of 30 fights vs caster teams. We ve won maybe 2 out of 15 rogue + paladin fights tho. Trust me its freaking impossible.