FoH guide to EVE Online

[Tolanin]

Originally Posted by Wodin

That's probably to fix the absurd passively tanked Myrmidon, actually. It can get regen approximately equal to a permanent Large Shield Booster with a massive amount of shields with the 2xInvuln 3xLSE 4xSPRII 2xPDSII setup while still maintaining enough cap to run the Invuln fields. This only really caused a problem because you can then kill stuff with your drones at the same speed as a Dominix.

poor myrm =( Still it will be awesome tho.

I wonder if it also wasnt done because they had said they planned on adding faction/officer shield mods, it woulda gotten insane pretty fast with passive tanks if they hadnt nerfed them a bit and then added faction stuff.. imagine going against a myrm with 1000/s shield recharge lol you wouldnt even be able to break its tank in a carrier.

[Antarius]

Originally Posted by Sancus

All battlecruisers? That would affect all the command ships, as well.

Nope Command ships are unaffected so far, just the Tier 1 and tier 2 BCs.

Really kinda puts a nail in the coffin for anyone wanting to use a Ferox.

Kinda wierd, I was under the impression that Everyone armor tanked a Myrmidon, I've never ran into a Shield Tanked one.

[Tolanin]

Originally Posted by Antarius

Nope Command ships are unaffected so far, just the Tier 1 and tier 2 BCs.

Really kinda puts a nail in the coffin for anyone wanting to use a Ferox.

Kinda wierd, I was under the impression that Everyone armor tanked a Myrmidon, I've never ran into a Shield Tanked one.

It wasnt that popular of a fit for the myrm but it was extremely good, i think it woulda caught on alot more in a few months when more people realized how good it was... that and it took some odd skills to fly, you basically needed good drone, good shield and good proj turret skills to make it work, and for someone flying a gallente BC those arent really common skills to have, except for the drones.

[Dildo Faggins]

Originally Posted by Tolanin

It wasnt that popular of a fit for the myrm but it was extremely good, i think it woulda caught on alot more in a few months when more people realized how good it was... that and it took some odd skills to fly, you basically needed good drone, good shield and good proj turret skills to make it work, and for someone flying a gallente BC those arent really common skills to have, except for the drones.

I believe it never caught on that much because passive tanks are only good for two things: Missions and gate camping. Drones suck for gate camping, so the drake was always a much better ship at that roll. So that comes to mission, and why would anyone invest the assload of skills into flying a super specialized myrm setup when they could go train cruiser for 2 days and hop into a dominix, one of the most versatile battleships in the game. The myrm shield tanker is extremely good, but its too limited use to be too practical for most people to train for.

[holydevil]

So when will those proposed changes take place? Isn't it too late for these changes, if implemented, to make a significant difference in the current war? It seems as if the coalition has already lost. I definitely wasn't rooting for BOB, it's nothing personal, I just think they're too big, and the dev involvement is sketchy.

[Sancus]

Originally Posted by holydevil

So when will those proposed changes take place? Isn't it too late for these changes, if implemented, to make a significant difference in the current war? It seems as if the coalition has already lost. I definitely wasn't rooting for BOB, it's nothing personal, I just think they're too big, and the dev involvement is sketchy.

You want the other thread.

[Xequecal]

Originally Posted by Wodin

That's probably to fix the absurd passively tanked Myrmidon, actually. It can get regen approximately equal to a permanent Large Shield Booster with a massive amount of shields with the 2xInvuln 3xLSE 4xSPRII 2xPDSII setup while still maintaining enough cap to run the Invuln fields. This only really caused a problem because you can then kill stuff with your drones at the same speed as a Dominix.

You know, if passive tanked Myrmidon is so overpowered, then how broken is doing the same thing on a Nighthawk? Much higher base shield resistances, it has a shield resistance bonus, and you can actually use its weapon bonuses, since missiles don't use cap either.

I just ran it through Quickfit, 2x Invuln 3x LSE 4x SPRII 1x PDSII and two Core Defense Field Purger rigs give you 227.16/sec shield regen with 61.2/84.5/85.5/88.5 resists. Myrmidon gives you 303/sec shield regen with three shield recharge rigs but the resists are much, much worse.

[WillzZz]

Except a Nighthawk is a Command Ship, which would take you approx 5mil more skills to get into, and probably a worse tank than a sleipnir as far as shield tankers go (I know we're talking about passive, but a tank is a tank). I don't think they'll ever touch Command ships survivability, that's kinda their bread and butter.

My roommate is going to be bummed, but atleast he's started thinking about getting into a raven already.

[holydevil]

Originally Posted by Sancus

You want the other thread.

Lol, I shot and missed.

Sorry

[Sancus]

Originally Posted by Xequecal

You know, if passive tanked Myrmidon is so overpowered, then how broken is doing the same thing on a Nighthawk? Much higher base shield resistances, it has a shield resistance bonus, and you can actually use its weapon bonuses, since missiles don't use cap either.

The myrm's weapon bonus is drones, it can still use this while passive tanked, and the reason the Nighthawk isn't overpowered is because:
a) It takes like 6+ months more training to get into a Nighthawk than a Myrm
b) it's a huge un-insurable expense
c) The Nighthawk's dps with 6 medium launcher slots, a 25% rof bonus, and a 25% kinetic damage bonus(level 5 command ships, loooooool) is still far worse than 5 heavy drones with a 50% damage bonus and 6 un-bonused medium turret slots using projectiles which also do not use cap.

Mostly c. This is also the reason that the Drake(even tho its tank is not quite as good, in fact) is not overpowered, dominix drone dps + command ship tank = no.

[Bizanich]

As an aside, them adding more skills to make a Carrier fully efficient . 5 days away from purchasing it (sure, it's a Chimera, but it's still a Carrier) and they go and make the Logistics skill needed for Triage mode.

Arggggh lol.

If I wasn't 1.5 weeks from Sleipnir, I'd /shoelace.

[Manticore]

Originally Posted by Bizanich

As an aside, them adding more skills to make a Carrier fully efficient . 5 days away from purchasing it (sure, it's a Chimera, but it's still a Carrier)

could be worse
could be a nidhoggur coughing them drones out

[Xequecal]

Originally Posted by Sancus

The myrm's weapon bonus is drones, it can still use this while passive tanked, and the reason the Nighthawk isn't overpowered is because:
a) It takes like 6+ months more training to get into a Nighthawk than a Myrm
b) it's a huge un-insurable expense
c) The Nighthawk's dps with 6 medium launcher slots, a 25% rof bonus, and a 25% kinetic damage bonus(level 5 command ships, loooooool) is still far worse than 5 heavy drones with a 50% damage bonus and 6 un-bonused medium turret slots using projectiles which also do not use cap.

Mostly c. This is also the reason that the Drake(even tho its tank is not quite as good, in fact) is not overpowered, dominix drone dps + command ship tank = no.

You'll be able to get IN to a Myrmidon much easier than the Command Ship, but flying it well will require far more training than the Command Ship. The Nighthawk just needs the Command Ship prereqs, good shield skills, and good missile skills.

In addition to the good shield skills required, flying a Myrmidon well requires you to cross train Medium Autocannon Specialization, and have good Gunnery skills in general, which are a lot more SP than the equivalent missile skills. On top of all this, you also need high level Drone skills which the Nighthawk player can mostly eschew for very little penalty. Heavy Drone Operation V is absolutely required for Ogre IIs, and you're kind of locked in to also getting Battlecruisers V and Drone Interfacing V to get the really high DPS numbers from your drones. BC V and Drone Interfacing V are 40.6% more drone damage over having both skills at IV.

Next, while the Myrmidon does more DPS with the requisite skills, the Nighthawk tanks FAR more damage. I ran this with 3x LSE, 2x Invuln Field, on both ships, and 4x SPRII 1x PDUII on the Nighthawk, 4x SPRII 2x PDUII on the Myrmidon. Thermal damage is the most common damage type, and the Nighthawk can tank nearly 2000 thermal DPS indefinetly. The Myrmidon tanks about 750 thermal DPS. The Nighthawk also can tank nearly double the amount of Kinetic DPS. Both the Myrmidon and Nighthawk tank almost identical amounts of EM and Explosive damage. (seriously, they're literally almost identical, both tanking 585 EM DPS and 1485 Explo DPS)

Realistically, the Nighthawk can take a lot more damage. Only against EM missiles are the tanks equivalent, the Nighthawk absorbs MUCH more abuse against any other weapon.

[Dildo Faggins]

Originally Posted by Manticore

could be worse
could be a nidhoggur coughing them drones out

haha, i laughed my ass off when that thanatos appeared.

[Xequecal]

Originally Posted by Manticore

could be worse
could be a nidhoggur coughing them drones out

Seriously, WTF were they thinking when they made the Nidhoggur? I saw a post on the Eve Forums proving that a Nidhoggur with the absolute best piece of faction/officer loot in the game in every slot STILL tanks worse than an Archon with nothing but Tech 1 fittings.