Lots of new Vanguard info released, plus videos & screenshots

[Eomer]

No more CR unless on a special server ? If you have followed VG since the beginning, you would know just how huge a change this really is (could be).

You know, when I first heard about the death penalty in WoW, I thought "shit, that's a joke" after not having played EQ in a few years, and probably 5 years since I'd played the game outside of a guild with fifty or so epic-ized clerics. I thought that CR was a necessary evil in a MMOG, that surely you should have to trudge back and retrieve your beloved possessions.

Then I got into the early VG beta, and died repeatedly in the newbie dungeons due to bugs, crashes, and the like (<3 the ant dungeon outside of Tursh, maybe it's fixed now, but we're talking Blackburrow type trains just popping out of walls randomly). And I thought "fuck this, having to CR is just a flat out kick in the balls, surely the death penalty can be implemented some other way" after about the 5th time a group of mine got whiped out. This was also not helped by SGODesign people who were in the group logging off immediately and not helping with CR, that was real cool btw (even though the corpses/characters are worth nothing due to the beta nature, it was still exceedingly gay for 3 of 4 SGO people to log).

So are you complaining that there's (potentially) no CR in the game? Because then I'd say, fucking rights there isn't, that's just a shitty feature that causes nothing but frustration.

If you're complaining that they changed their minds and aren't sticking to The Vision, then I'd say fucking rights, they realized that their idea was wrong, and they're acting to rectify it for the good of the game.

[Fammaden]

Really though, the one huge standout point of interest about VG has always been that Brad was in charge. People, justified or not, have expected that this means that the game would fill an MMO niche of being unforgiving like EQ was for the first few expansions. I can't say that they were imagining things either, from the way the FAQ read back pre-alpha/beta when I still cared to read it and also based on Brad's posting history. Anyone else remember the early critiques of WoW by Brad? Calling it a beer and pretzels game and saying they intended to make VG:SoH more in depth, more a home than a themepark? I do. People came to expect the hardcore design philosophy.

If that is gone, then why play VG? For diplomacy and crafting? Sure people like those things, and so do I to a degree, but the meat of these games for the majority of people is still advancement, adventure, and combat. So far they seem hard pressed to show us what they bring to the table that we can't find elsewhere. Or for cutting edge graphics? We already have EQ2, which by all accounts is a game with a couple years of polish and content now and a stable population of players. I'm sure 15 vanbois will have reasons why this is just something not to be missed, but quite frankly without Zee Visone I no longer understand what niche it is VG is supposed to fill.

[The Hiram Key]

Originally Posted by holymight

Great, more SOE conspiracy theories. The changes to the game has nothing to do with SOE.

I am not going to say you are right or wrong, but you go on telling yourself that if it makes you feel comfortable about Vanguard and it's future. Is it really any cooincidence that VG was chugging along with it's CR and hardcore nitch outlook until right around the time Microsoft said "fuck you, publish now or were pulling our money" and Smed and SOE rode to the rescue with funding, hosting, network support and the like ?

You have to have your fucking head in the sand all the way to China to miss this type of connection here. I don't doubt Brad listens to his team, I don't doubt that at all. I also don't belive Brad doesn't pick up the phone when Smed calls listens to every word he says. Your fucking dreaming if you think SOE handed over (probably) 10's of millions of dollars to help Brad finish his game and they have zero, none, zilch impact on how its going to come out in the end.

As another poster said, a huge selling point to VG was (is)
"FROM THE MAKER OF THE ORIGINAL EVERQUEST !!!!!!!!!!!!!"

not from

THE MAKER OF THE ORIGINAL EVERQUEST AND HIS 1000 TOP ADVISORS WHO PUSHED HIM TO A NERVOUS BREAKDOWN SO HE GAVE IN AND MADE HIS GAME EASIER FOR THE PUSSIES.

I won't play VG, not ever (the SOE connection sealed that door for me) but I really was looking forward to a harder game, a niche game, something that if you were actually good at it, it was an accomplishment. Something without !'s and ?'s as my lollipop road to advancement goodness.

Who knows if it would have been successful, were no longer getting that game, but at least have the balls to build what you say your going to build, and let the chips fall where they may. If you can't do that, you probably shouldn't step up to the plate.

[Duppin]

Don't you need to go join Utnayan for a "cutting eyes out of pictures of Smed" party?

[D3ll]

Originally Posted by Slick Willey

Please, go back to the VG boards. Either you have never played Vanguard or are just plain stupid. To say that VG is catering to WoW-style MMORPGs or even implying it is a "WoW-clone" is just ignorance at its best. Just because the two games have SOME mechanics in common does not a WoW-clone Vanguard make. ANYBODY who has half a brain and has played the two games knows they are different games offering different gaming experiences.

WTG on totally misconstruing my post. The point is since it's inception, Sigil has stated that VG was not going to go head to head with WOW and was going to target a niche audience.

As the game has progressed over the years it looks like that niche keeps broadening into something that is now mass appeal rather than a niche. As your post infers it looks like you've played VG, maybe you've seen this happening as they add more and more mass appeal mechanics to the game?

Inotherwords, what was promised and what's going to be delivered are not going to be the same by any stretch of the imagination.

[The Hiram Key]

Originally Posted by Duppin

Don't you need to go join Utnayan for a "cutting eyes out of pictures of Smed" party?

While I certainly don't trust Smed any farther then I could throw him, I have no ill will fantasies as do the likes of Utnayan.

[Siddar]

all items tradeable/BoE/Nodrop - lied about it (every item in the game is BoE/Nodrop now)
Mini-Map - lied about it (yep there's a mini map)
challenge - lied about it (nope it was too hard for WoW players to get phat lootz so /nerf)
innovative combat system - lied about it (same old BS different arrangement absolutley nothing new)
meaningful travel - lied about it (I won't even start on all the BS we were fed about this)
linear quest chains - lied about it (Welcome to an exact copy of WoW's quest system + huge exp rewards for questing) What happened to quests are for items not exp Brad? Oh yeah lied again there huh.
slower leveling longer exp curve - lied about it (Lol some of the things being said about your beta are not too pleasant Brad, and most of them came from the beta testers who you drove away with BS WoW mechanics.)

Must say my desire to play Vanguard is growing think im going to end up with a all acess pass.

[Itzena]

Braen on suicide watch?

[Neric]

I am pretty amused by people acting surprised when they find out that Brad lied to them for years. Kinda obvious that they don't know him from the old EQ days. He has about as much backbone as this guy and I wouldn't be surprised if he could blow himself.

[kcxiv]

Shocked, anyone can have a positive opinion about the game. Shit is practically unplayable unless you got brads computer.

LAGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG

[Kaxmax]

Originally Posted by Itzena

Braen on suicide watch?

It is somewhat amusing that Braen no longer spouts the virtues of VG in every post. Perhaps he actually got a chance to play it?

[Eomer]

Originally Posted by The Hiram Key

You have to have your fucking head in the sand all the way to China to miss this type of connection here. I don't doubt Brad listens to his team, I don't doubt that at all. I also don't belive Brad doesn't pick up the phone when Smed calls listens to every word he says. Your fucking dreaming if you think SOE handed over (probably) 10's of millions of dollars to help Brad finish his game and they have zero, none, zilch impact on how its going to come out in the end.

Did you miss the part where SGO actually bought the rights from MS? I'm almost positive that the actual development of VG is self-funded, and SOE was brought on for distribution, support, hardware etc.

I could be wrong.

[holymight]

Originally Posted by D3ll

As the game has progressed over the years it looks like that niche keeps broadening into something that is now mass appeal rather than a niche.

Vanguard was never a niche game.

Originally Posted by Neric

I am pretty amused by people acting surprised when they find out that Brad lied to them for years.

I know I am going to regret this, but exactly how did Brad lie to us for years? I have never seen him make any absolute claims.

Originally Posted by Kaxmax

It is somewhat amusing that Braen no longer spouts the virtues of VG in every post. Perhaps he actually got a chance to play it?

Or maybe he is under NDA and doesn't want to lose beta access because he like the game?

[Digits]

Originally Posted by Eomer

Did you miss the part where SGO actually bought the rights from MS? I'm almost positive that the actual development of VG is self-funded, and SOE was brought on for distribution, support, hardware etc.

I could be wrong.

Shut up with your "Facts" and don't get in the way of misinformed misanthropy. Brad lied and people died. No blood for loots.

[ArkturusMaximus]

Originally Posted by Eomer

Did you miss the part where SGO actually bought the rights from MS? I'm almost positive that the actual development of VG is self-funded, and SOE was brought on for distribution, support, hardware etc.

I could be wrong.

I think, THINK, his point was you have to be pretty naive to think SoE has no influence on Vanguard. Sigil might own the rights to the game, but they are piggy-backing on SoE's network.

It's like trying to say ABC has no influence on Lost. They don't produce it...they just own the network it gets shown on. Pretty powerful position I'd wager.