Lots of new Vanguard info released, plus videos & screenshots - Page 41

Dashal · 11-13-2006, 01:28 PM

No no, they need the animation. And you need to be able to slow-mo it so I can watch as my arrow flies up a gnomes nose catapulting him off his Wyvern and plummeting down to the rocky cliffs below.

glue · 11-13-2006, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dildo Faggins

Combine failure is a-ok in my book if its some noob crafter attempting something above their skill. Its realistic, and reasonable. They are gonna mess up and ruin the piece. A master craftsman though, failing horribly and losing the pieces? Thats just stupid. Maybe they may not have the 'perfect' piece every time, a nail may get bent or something, but they arent gonna lose anything of value.

thats how master crafters actually did their work! YES they failed CONSTNATLY

you think Stradivarius made a PERFECT violin everytime? NO. He would make thousands and thousands discard thousands, and out of every 1000 goes he would get one that was good to keep.

Real crafting is the art of successive refinement with one-hundred times more failures than moderate successes and one-thousand times more failures than masterpieces.

What games should add is subtle, unique flaws to items. Once you make an item it should not be finished, you still should be able to add to it to try and make it better, but everytime you risk screwing up and making it worse, making an irreperable flaw, or destroyign the item completely.

A good crafter should be able to build a workshop where he can store his items and tools and hire NPCs to do the grunt work, but it's still going to cost a lot to make epic items, and a realistic, immersive, fun part of that cost is using failures, flaws, and destruction of the item sometimes.

There should be challenge in getting the ingredients yeah, but also DEDICATION in getting those uber items. Crafters should not be "make-to-order" bots that makes the game stale. It's much more interesting if crafters are whole-salers who are DEDICATED to the role rather than just another player who happens to have Master Axesmith because he farms nodes all day and raids with his guild all night.

The farm-then-raid model is not a good model. Crafters should be dedicated merchants with shops like you could do in UO and to a lesser extent Shadowbane.

Elgonn · 11-13-2006, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dashal

You're probably right but I hope you're wrong. Even shooting a dude out of the sky... if the mount poofs and you fall that'd still be damn funny.

I can do this in WoW already. *poof* sheep/pig/etc.. I'd hope for more than that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by glue

The solution to crafting epic items has been around since at least 1996 in The Realm Online

I still cannot believe how many Wraths I destroyed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arbitrary

Rather not have failure at all. The difficulty should be in obtaining the items. Getting everything together and hoping the RNG doesn't fuck you isn't epic, doesn't add to difficulty, and just isn't fun to begin with.

Horizons style? Minimum mats meant you could "try" to make something. Your success/quality wasn't guaranteed. Maximum mats meant you'd autosucceed. You choose how much to gamble whenever you made something.

glue · 11-13-2006, 01:42 PM

Quote:

I still cannot believe how many Wraths I destroyed.

destroying wraths trying to get 6X and 7X was the best part of the realm

at one point i tried starting an insurance business to sell insurance to people who wanted their precious items enchanted :P insurance breaks down around 5X tho because the premiums become so expensive that anyone who can afford the premiums can afford to insure himself

Dashal · 11-13-2006, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elgonn

I can do this in WoW already. *poof* sheep/pig/etc.. I'd hope for more than that.

You can shoot a person off a flying mount in WoW? I'm talking shooting a guy 100 feet in the air off his Griffon and watching him plummet to the floor and die horribly.

I dont care if the mount poofs or your char just "pop" animates below the mount and starts fallin, as long as you fall

EDIT: I'd also like to be able to strafe and dive bomb newbies with my Wyvern or whatever.

rinthea · 11-13-2006, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glue

you think Stradivarius made a PERFECT violin everytime? NO. He would make thousands and thousands discard thousands, and out of every 1000 goes he would get one that was good to keep.

I recall reading that Stradivarius (how good is firefox spellcheck btw) made exceptional violins because he was the only one who had access to, for lack of a better word, awesome wood.

This relates to how I think about crafters making epic items. I think they should be better than raid loot. But you need "awesome wood", or raid loot to craft these epic items.

Daerath · 11-13-2006, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glue

thats how master crafters actually did their work! YES they failed CONSTNATLY

you think Stradivarius made a PERFECT violin everytime? NO. He would make thousands and thousands discard thousands, and out of every 1000 goes he would get one that was good to keep.

Perhaps you missed the memo. These are fantasy games. Escapist entertainment. People don't play them for realism. They play them to be entertained, to have fun, not to experience computer simulated realism (unless it's porn).

If we wanted the realism of crafting imperfect items we'd take up woodworking and do that shit in real life.

Rythonn · 11-13-2006, 11:02 PM

I want crafting to be like SWG. The better the mats the better the item. Also you should be able to loot certain items that can be used during crafting to make items better. Ala SWG you could use rancor parts and krayt dragon parts to make your items better. I would like to make a dragon tooth hilt from an dragon tooth is what i'm tryign to say.

Cadrid · 11-13-2006, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rythonn

Also you should be able to loot certain items that can be used during crafting to make items better.

I have a lawn gnome surveillance system in place at Sigil HQ, and they've reported that this is already in game.

Rythonn · 11-14-2006, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cadrid

I have a lawn gnome surveillance system in place at Sigil HQ, and they've reported that this is already in game.

It is to use during crafting or after to make the item better?

James · 11-14-2006, 12:40 AM

During. The crafting system VG has is pretty damn complex, and if done right, probably pretty satisfying. It's rather neat.

Dildo Faggins · 11-14-2006, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glue

thats how master crafters actually did their work! YES they failed CONSTNATLY

you think Stradivarius made a PERFECT violin everytime? NO. He would make thousands and thousands discard thousands, and out of every 1000 goes he would get one that was good to keep.

Lol, bullshit. Are your really gonna claim that stradivarius made thousands of violins/cellos a year and kept only a handful? This is so stupendously stupid that it defies description. Sure, im sure he had some that HE considered failures, but these failures would still be of the highest quality. Imagining stradivarius pounding away at a cello and breaking it in half by accident makes my day. You really think a master crafter would do that shit? Retard.

Turzem · 11-14-2006, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dildo Faggins

Bullshit. Are your really gonna claim that Stradivarius made thousands of violins/cellos a year and kept only a handful? This is so stupendously stupid that it defies description. Sure, I'm sure he had some that HE considered failures, but these failures would still be of the highest quality. Imagining Stradivarius pounding away at a cello and breaking it in half by accident makes my day. You really think a master crafter would do that shit? Retard.

(I cleaned up your post a bit!)

You are correct in your summation. Virtually all of his surviving products are highly valued, and he only made a few hundred in his lifetime.

Tuco · 11-14-2006, 11:52 AM

I just wiki'd Stradivarius, that's pretty cool, I had no idea that instruments like that were that expensive (millions). It's like phat lewt IRL

glue · 11-14-2006, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dildo Faggins

Lol, bullshit. Are your really gonna claim that stradivarius made thousands of violins/cellos a year and kept only a handful? This is so stupendously stupid that it defies description. Sure, im sure he had some that HE considered failures, but these failures would still be of the highest quality. Imagining stradivarius pounding away at a cello and breaking it in half by accident makes my day. You really think a master crafter would do that shit? Retard.

Theres a huge difference in quality between the best strad and the worst strad, and there is significant variation between each strad

and this guy is the absolute pinnacle of his craft

every crafted item is unique

11-14-2006, 12:40 AM	#611 (permalink)
James You are just another normal! Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 9,383	During. The crafting system VG has is pretty damn complex, and if done right, probably pretty satisfying. It's rather neat. __________________ Like a ship without an anchor, like a slave without a chain, just the thought of those sweet ladies sends a shiver through my veins. And I will go on shining, shining like brand new. I'll never look behind me, my troubles will be few. Goodbye stranger, it's been nice. Hope you find your paradise. Tried to see your point of view, hope your dreams will all come true. Goodbye Mary, goodbye Jane, will we ever meet again? Feel no sorrow, feel no shame. Come tomorrow, feel no pain.

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes	Rate This Thread
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode	Rate This Thread:

LinkBacks (?) LinkBack to this Thread: http://www.fohguild.org/forums/mmorpg-general-discussion/25222-lots-new-vanguard-info-released-plus-videos-screenshots.html
Posted By	For	Type	Date
Cleric Information - TenTonHammer Forums	Post #63	Refback	11-22-2006 10:59 AM
Vanguard Japan Forum :: Home	Post #655	Refback	11-22-2006 08:32 AM
MMORPG General Discussion - Fires of Heaven Guild Message Board	This thread	Refback	11-22-2006 07:28 AM

11-13-2006, 01:28 PM	#601 (permalink)
Dashal Registered User Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 1,278 +2 Internets	No no, they need the animation. And you need to be able to slow-mo it so I can watch as my arrow flies up a gnomes nose catapulting him off his Wyvern and plummeting down to the rocky cliffs below.

11-13-2006, 11:02 PM	#608 (permalink)
Rythonn Registered User Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 2,707	I want crafting to be like SWG. The better the mats the better the item. Also you should be able to loot certain items that can be used during crafting to make items better. Ala SWG you could use rancor parts and krayt dragon parts to make your items better. I would like to make a dragon tooth hilt from an dragon tooth is what i'm tryign to say.

11-14-2006, 11:52 AM	#614 (permalink)
Tuco Forum Janitor Join Date: May 2002 Location: Detroit Posts: 10,720 +75 Internets	I just wiki'd Stradivarius, that's pretty cool, I had no idea that instruments like that were that expensive (millions). It's like phat lewt IRL