Soo.. Why can we still not 'join as grp' AV?

boy- · 08-24-2006, 11:52 AM

The idea that you still can't 'join as group' in AV totally mystifies me. Was AV not the battleground designed to require a large amount of strategy and coordination to win?

It made sense (sort of) previously in that joining as large groups totally blew up the queue (you could realistically only get in when a new av started, which for most servers was 0-1 times per night). But with the new x-server system, this at least is no longer an issue.

AV is going to die if this is not readded. Currently with it being x-server pugs there's no ability for any sort of 'leader' of the bg to emerge and direct people around, because no one knows who anyone else is. EJ already has a thread about how retarded people are in AV. The last people who still don't have exalted will power their way up there, then never enter again -- I know no one in my guild will ever enter AV once the novelty wears off. Then AV will become just be a haven for retards, the LOIO of battlegrounds where retards can go to get easy HKs but never actually get past the middle gy.

There is no reason why you shouldn't be able to queue as grp in AV but you can in the other 2 instances. It's not like "pugs get stomped" is a valid excuse, since the exact thing happens in wsg and ab. It seems awfully stupid that the one battleground designed that rewards good coordination is the one battleground which mechanically forbids it.

The idea of x-server guild v. guild AV seems incredibly appetizing. It's a shame that it doesn't exist.

Warrian · 08-24-2006, 11:56 AM

FUCK AV! GIVE ME TBC!

Darkmyst · 08-24-2006, 12:07 PM

AV doesn't exactly require strategy anymore. Now it's just a race to see who can zerg the other teams leader the fastest.

boy- · 08-24-2006, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkmyst

AV doesn't exactly require strategy anymore. Now it's just a race to see who can zerg the other teams leader the fastest.

And do you not think that the prevailing strat degenerated into this becuase it's the easiest strat that you can possibly get 24 other people to follow?

The unrealized potential of AV is massive. More importantly, it could actually become fun. Right now I don't know anyone that actually likes AV, all games are either a stalemate with retards running around playing stupidly, or is a race to the other side like you said.

Cad · 08-24-2006, 12:21 PM

I recently got exalted in AV on an alt, and it is a race, but it's more subtle than that if you want to win by anything more than sheer luck. You've got to have a crack defense team that slows the other side down just enough/harasses them just enough that you can win. You've got to keep your towers and destroy theirs, battlemasters slow you down that critical amount.

AV was always envisioned as PvE with PvP going on around it, and it's very much that now. Who wants to go back to the retarded 40+ hour games where nobody moves out of the FoS?

Fris_Leafshadow · 08-24-2006, 12:39 PM

as much as I'd love to walk into AV w/ my guild, I'd completly hate to walk into one solo and see a full raiding guild on the other side.

Weritech · 08-24-2006, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cad

I recently got exalted in AV on an alt, and it is a race, but it's more subtle than that if you want to win by anything more than sheer luck.

Bullshit.

Sheaf · 08-24-2006, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fris_Leafshadow

as much as I'd love to walk into AV w/ my guild, I'd completly hate to walk into one solo and see a full raiding guild on the other side.

Exactly.

I really want to join as a group, but until they make some sort of matching system, it probably shouldn't allow full guild groups to join together.

Regardless, I bet you can still get in 20-30 of you in the same AV if you coordinate queueing up at the exact same time.

Warrian · 08-24-2006, 01:00 PM

Will AV still be around when TBC comes out due to the 25 man raid cap? Or would AV count as a "Legacy" dungeon so you could still 40 man it?

Magnum PI · 08-24-2006, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fris_Leafshadow

as much as I'd love to walk into AV w/ my guild, I'd completly hate to walk into one solo and see a full raiding guild on the other side.

That's why I LOVE /afk. Instant removal from the bullshit at will.

Man0warr · 08-24-2006, 01:16 PM

We used to run AV as guild back when you could multiple times a day after raids, were and are the #1 guild in PvE at the time so 40 people with the best gear.

It was a massacre, we could win in less than 45 min everytime, this was when there was still a ton of npc's in too. With Vent and groups designed around PvP it wasn't even a challenge, I felt bad for the Horde. Only challenge we would have is if the top horde guilds would join as group too, but then no one would win, one time we had Guild vs Guild AV that lasted like 5 hours.

Ravensign · 08-24-2006, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boy-

And do you not think that the prevailing strat degenerated into this becuase it's the easiest strat that you can possibly get 24 other people to follow?

It may be easy to follow but it also seems to work. The zone design obviously doesnt prevent it from happening, and its an efficient way to get it over, get your necklaces and repeat.

Last night, people were screaming to please defend, to please take this, that or the other objective, and were mocking the rest of the raid, but we won, and we won quick. Why listen or try to do anything else when the W is produced and in a hurry?

The longer queues were preventing people from just wanted to get it over with and to get some HK. Now its a total race to get back in.

If Blizz wants it to be more epic in feel, or to keep people from just getting it over with, link the ability to kill the boss to objectives or something.

For now, people are going to to what people always do, take the fastest, easiest path.

marketa · 08-24-2006, 01:35 PM

you should be able to queue with a 5man group, no more. Would be fun to introduce organized smallscale combat behind the lines.

Adrain · 08-24-2006, 01:43 PM

They could make towers/bunkers and graveyards buff your general like they were highpriests of Hakkar. Anything to make sure the ground is burned or turned in between. No more assinine matches with 10 HKs please.

Could make one give him a snare AE, crazy regen, armor/resists/etc.

Saban · 08-24-2006, 01:46 PM

almost everything is usually destroyed on the way to the enemy general, except sometimes galv and usually balinda gets spared, almost every tower is always popped.

AV is a joke now, i miss guard zergs.

08-24-2006, 11:52 AM	#1 (permalink)
boy- Registered User Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 269 -1 Internets	Soo.. Why can we still not 'join as grp' AV? The idea that you still can't 'join as group' in AV totally mystifies me. Was AV not the battleground designed to require a large amount of strategy and coordination to win? It made sense (sort of) previously in that joining as large groups totally blew up the queue (you could realistically only get in when a new av started, which for most servers was 0-1 times per night). But with the new x-server system, this at least is no longer an issue. AV is going to die if this is not readded. Currently with it being x-server pugs there's no ability for any sort of 'leader' of the bg to emerge and direct people around, because no one knows who anyone else is. EJ already has a thread about how retarded people are in AV. The last people who still don't have exalted will power their way up there, then never enter again -- I know no one in my guild will ever enter AV once the novelty wears off. Then AV will become just be a haven for retards, the LOIO of battlegrounds where retards can go to get easy HKs but never actually get past the middle gy. There is no reason why you shouldn't be able to queue as grp in AV but you can in the other 2 instances. It's not like "pugs get stomped" is a valid excuse, since the exact thing happens in wsg and ab. It seems awfully stupid that the one battleground designed that rewards good coordination is the one battleground which mechanically forbids it. The idea of x-server guild v. guild AV seems incredibly appetizing. It's a shame that it doesn't exist.

08-24-2006, 01:16 PM	#11 (permalink)
Man0warr Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 1,573	We used to run AV as guild back when you could multiple times a day after raids, were and are the #1 guild in PvE at the time so 40 people with the best gear. It was a massacre, we could win in less than 45 min everytime, this was when there was still a ton of npc's in too. With Vent and groups designed around PvP it wasn't even a challenge, I felt bad for the Horde. Only challenge we would have is if the top horde guilds would join as group too, but then no one would win, one time we had Guild vs Guild AV that lasted like 5 hours. __________________ Manowarr - Ranger - Dominus Letum

08-24-2006, 01:43 PM	#14 (permalink)
Adrain Registered User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Lost Vegas Posts: 356 -1 Internets	They could make towers/bunkers and graveyards buff your general like they were highpriests of Hakkar. Anything to make sure the ground is burned or turned in between. No more assinine matches with 10 HKs please. Could make one give him a snare AE, crazy regen, armor/resists/etc. __________________ No gods, no masters.

08-24-2006, 01:46 PM	#15 (permalink)
Saban Registered User Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 2,334 +5 Internets	almost everything is usually destroyed on the way to the enemy general, except sometimes galv and usually balinda gets spared, almost every tower is always popped. AV is a joke now, i miss guard zergs. __________________ Saban - Paladin, Dark Iron I does things.

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08-24-2006, 11:56 AM	#2 (permalink)
Warrian crushin' them guts Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 1,158	FUCK AV! GIVE ME TBC!

08-24-2006, 12:21 PM	#5 (permalink)
Cad Registered User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Dallas Posts: 6,609 -41 Internets	I recently got exalted in AV on an alt, and it is a race, but it's more subtle than that if you want to win by anything more than sheer luck. You've got to have a crack defense team that slows the other side down just enough/harasses them just enough that you can win. You've got to keep your towers and destroy theirs, battlemasters slow you down that critical amount. AV was always envisioned as PvE with PvP going on around it, and it's very much that now. Who wants to go back to the retarded 40+ hour games where nobody moves out of the FoS?

08-24-2006, 01:00 PM	#9 (permalink)
Warrian crushin' them guts Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 1,158	Will AV still be around when TBC comes out due to the 25 man raid cap? Or would AV count as a "Legacy" dungeon so you could still 40 man it?

08-24-2006, 01:35 PM	#13 (permalink)
marketa Registered User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Tucson, Az Posts: 94 +0 Internets	you should be able to queue with a 5man group, no more. Would be fun to introduce organized smallscale combat behind the lines.