World PvP preview [WoW]

[Zehn - Vhex]

Originally Posted by xilsharn

The battlefield command shit is garbage. All it's going to do is create bickering and squabbling during battles by the various people capable of calling down airstrikes/whatever. Planetside has shown that this concept needs some work. Unlss you're going to let 25 commander-level dudes call in airstrikes simultaneously. Yeah you can limit it but then you're going to get airstrike spams.

Which is why you put it on a weekly reset. You make be Rank 1 one week, but if you do shit the next, you're put down to Rank 20 and lose all your perks, etc...you make battlefield command abilities a very high ranking ability so you don't have dozens of people with it.

This way, pvp grinding is something you might do to give yourself a competative edge, not because you have to in order to keep ranking.

All this fancy-pants battlefield azeroth shit will go down the tubes as people just grind up their PVP rank to get the best gear then find another character to play or a PVE guild to join.

Sure eventually people will cap/max out, but the point of it is making the journey more fun and entertaining. As a priest I have absoultely zero reason to ever pvp other then to chill with my friends. With this system, I might just put the beatdown a few weeks out of the year to try to get rank 1 just for the pleasure of dropping airstrikes on rang rangs. And even with my casual pvp schedule I'll eventually hit higher ranks and have access to phat pvp gear should I ever need it.

[Cad]

Originally Posted by Olio

It should probably take a casual two years to hit max pvp rank since that's how long you want to keep them entertained between expansions.

Olio

Nobody with any sense would ever participate in such a system, I hope this is sarcasm.

[Cad]

Originally Posted by muninn

You guys talking about the linear system in parallel with the current honor grind do realize you're idea is already implemented right? You're talking about battleground faction, just with different rewards.

Yes, because right now you get spotty rewards with bg faction - the armor sets and weapons require the honor grind, which is outlandish.

There should be blue versions of the weapons available at rank 11.

[Zehn - Vhex]

Originally Posted by muninn

You guys talking about the linear system in parallel with the current honor grind do realize you're idea is already implemented right? You're talking about battleground faction, just with different rewards.

You missed the point. The current honor scale where standing gives you rank points which increases your PvP rank is turned into a static linear scale with no decay. You add more scaling gear to the various ranks and whatnot. So at like ranks 4/5 you get a green pvp set or something, rank 6 green weapons, etc...

So while effectively it is like faction, the difference is you keep adding new ranks with new expansions/patches. Basically it's a pvp leveling system where when you ding you get access to gear/weapons/etc..

Then you have a second system which resets every week. You may be top dog at Rank 1 one week, then you take a week off and do no pvp and get Rank 20, then you pvp casually the next and get Rank 15, next week you pvp hardcore again and get Rank 3, next week casually and back down to 15. Etc...

So even if you just dinged 60 and it's your first time pvping ever, you can get Standing 1 which will give you Rank 1. At Rank 1 you'll get all kinds of nifty shit. I posted some examples earlier, some others might be a warstomp-like ability while mounted from being at least Rank 6. A 30 minute cooldown ability that let's you instantly force a graveyard rez wave from being at least Rank 3. At Rank 5 you get a special bonuses from the battlefield buffs like the berzerker buff also increases you chance to crit by 2%, speed buff gives you a one charge grounding totem like effect, etc...

[Zehn - Vhex]

Originally Posted by Cad

Nobody with any sense would ever participate in such a system, I hope this is sarcasm.

Doesn't sound entirely unreasonable to me. Keep in mind max rank would keep increasing. It would take roughly 1 year to hit rank 14 which would have slightly less then MC quality weapons/armor available, then rank, say 18 for sub BWL/AQ quality weapons, then rank 22 for sub-Nax quality weapons which all in all should take about 2 years playing 1-2 hours a night.

Considering you don't have to put up with 300g repair costs for each new encounter, spending 4-5 hours a day farming eels, gromsblood, etc..., don't have to learn how to not be a douche bag and get into a decent end game guild, etc...etc...

One of the problems casual people have is they see their friend get into an uber guild and in one night get a dozen epix without realizing it simply doesn't work that way. Sure once a zone is on farm status you can fully outfit an applicant in one week, but it takes 6-7 months to get to that point, plus you hvae to rely on chance drops.

It'd be like if every week the PvP vendor only had a 5% chance to have the item you wanted to buy.

[Cad]

If you're saying 2 years for someone who plays 2 hours a night, Zehn, lets just run the numbers on that shall we?

5 days a week, 2 hours a night is 10 hours a week for 104 weeks. Thats around 1000 hours, or 43 days /played just to hit your pvp goal. Thats unreasonable. I don't even have 43 days /played on my BWL geared hunter, and I was in the group that did MC and BWL from wipe 1.

I can PuG BG all week, several hours a day (like, 3-4) for 5 days and get around 150k honor. If the honor target for rank 14 (*current* rank 14, which includes melee and ranged epics. More ranks can be added in a linear system) was 5 million, it'd take me 33 weeks or almost 8 months to get rank 14, longer if I took time off from it.

Every 6 months or so, about the time blizzard's raid team shits out another complete raid instance, add another 3-4 ranks with a new 8-peice armor set, new weapons, and some accessories. These new ranks should add around 3 million honor to the total to achieve them, which is around 20 weeks. I'd never actually get "max" rank, but I'd be able to get something useful out of the honor system, which is more than I can say now. If I took a month off of work and joined an honor farming team I could probably hit rank 13 - rank 14 would take an extra month. And thats after I spent time part-timing it up to rank 11. The current system is retarded. Making it a linear grind makes it alot more like every other system in the game.

[Dyscord]

Back on the topic of the actual world pvp...

Who thought this stuff up? I read over it again today, and from the face of the preview, it was clearly the moron who removed NPC's from AV.

In the proud tradition of AV or what we now call "The Mount Race" BG, they continue to create pvp where you don't actually fight anyone. The Silithid area sounds a lot like this. Oh noes, I've collected teh dirt that has flagged me for teh pvps! Then you run back to your camp. Is there really any reason at all to attack players carrying dirt?

And with no rewards other than small amounts of faction and honor... why the fuck would you do this? For a stupid temp buff? If BG's remain the primary source for honor, all of the PvPers will simply stay in the BG. And thanks to population imbalances, the side with more players will go to these zones and collect dust unopposed! How much fun is that!

Unless this little preview has missed some serious key points, this world pvp stuff is an incredible failure on the scale of the rickshaw rocks.

[Lleauaric~EW]

This outdoor shit is the WOW PvP equivilant of Gems..

woot?

[Cad]

Dyscord, world PvP is dead because BG PvP is better, both from a rewards standpoint, a lag standpoint, and a fair teams standpoint. Not to mention the rez mechanics and bonus honor.

World PvP isn't dead because there wasn't a little tower to control. World PvP is dead because it's stupid. The problems you mention are exactly the problems with the very concept - why would I attack this guy? What stops the higher pop faction from rolling in unopposed? Why are epic mounts relative immunity if you're not stupid? Etc..

[Dyscord]

I finally understand the thinking behind this! Guys at blizzard bought stock in EA, and they want us to go play this game to pvp:

http://www.gamespot.com/pc/rpg/warha...&mode=previews

[Dumar]

Originally Posted by Cad

Dyscord, world PvP is dead because BG PvP is better, both from a rewards standpoint, a lag standpoint, and a fair teams standpoint. Not to mention the rez mechanics and bonus honor.

World PvP isn't dead because there wasn't a little tower to control. World PvP is dead because it's stupid. The problems you mention are exactly the problems with the very concept - why would I attack this guy? What stops the higher pop faction from rolling in unopposed? Why are epic mounts relative immunity if you're not stupid? Etc..

you're an idiot.

[Bizanich]

Originally Posted by Cad

Dyscord, world PvP is dead because BG PvP is better, both from a rewards standpoint, a lag standpoint, and a fair teams standpoint. Not to mention the rez mechanics and bonus honor.

World PvP isn't dead because there wasn't a little tower to control. World PvP is dead because it's stupid. The problems you mention are exactly the problems with the very concept - why would I attack this guy? What stops the higher pop faction from rolling in unopposed? Why are epic mounts relative immunity if you're not stupid? Etc..

Just when you were starting to not post stupid shit, Cad, you regress.

Originally Posted by Dyscord

In the proud tradition of AV or what we now call "The Mount Race" BG, they continue to create pvp where you don't actually fight anyone. The Silithid area sounds a lot like this. Oh noes, I've collected teh dirt that has flagged me for teh pvps! Then you run back to your camp. Is there really any reason at all to attack players carrying dirt?

The new server I'm on began with the mount race..now? Horde was losing the race everytime, so now Horde turtles Iceblood until Lokhalar's up, then push and win.

Every...fucking....time. Alliance suck.

[Deris]

Pull the Lok Shaman summoner chick out of the base and kill her? :>

[Bizanich]

Originally Posted by Deris

Pull the Lok Shaman summoner chick out of the base and kill her? :>

Alliance..suck. From the guy who everytime he tanks a major NPC shout spams "LOOK, I'M TANKING! OT/DPS WARRIOR LOOKING FOR PVE GUILD!" to the morons who insist on fighting in FoS, it's painful.

All the talented Alliance got exalted and only come back in between WSG and AB games (which is dumb, since the honor from a quick win is good). Thank god I got exalted already.

[Cad]

So what exactly were you guys looking for in World PvP that wouldn't be plagued by exactly the same problems Dyscord was complaining about?

Problems:

1> Population Imbalance
2> World server lag with large groups
3> Reward structure
4> Rez mechanics (rez timers are going to suck ass, warlocks rezzing with no pets, casters with no buffs and at half mana/health, etc)
5> Visible distance out in the world hampering pvp (on an epic mount people often don't appear on your screen until you've actually ridden past them..)

You will have to fix all of these to make world pvp work. Personally I don't care where the PvP is, World PvP is fine if it has a point and the mechanics make it fun. Why is me saying BG PvP is more fun and has more of a point due to mechanics and instancing for lag/visibility/balance reasons stupid?