Vanguard: Making the game as they go? - Page 52

ZeckEQ · 06-19-2006, 11:37 AM

And if UO's housing won't rate because it's not 3d, AC1 had non instanced housing with windows and SWG without windows. DAoC was also non-instanced, just seperate zones for housing. No frekin windows there tho.

Dyscord · 06-19-2006, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Your really trying hard to hate this game aren't you.

No offense, but it seems like you're trying really hard to like it.

Make no mistake, I wish this game great sucess. Because good ideas get gobbled up quickly by other competing MMOs and everyone's game gets better for it. But from what I've read here and around, the only thing Vanguard seems ready for is another year in development/beta.

Kaxmax · 06-19-2006, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymight

Since when can you own boats in EQ? Not even Google knows about this.

DAoC has had player controlled boats for a long time, since TOA.

Quote:

Different since UO was a top down 2D game.

Didn't SWG have player housing? AC too if I remember correctly (could be wrong there).

Quote:

EQ2 does not have flying mounts. The clouds are like griffins in WoW. WoW currently does not have flying mounts, so it's a new feature.

Vanguard does not currently have flying mounts either. The title of "first to have flying mounts" is going to depend on what releases first: TBC or VG.

Quote:

Oh please, what game has localized economies. I must have missed it.

FFXI and EQ (Gfay/Commons on my server) come to mind

Quote:

I don't see other games where a class have to make a choice which kind of shape shifting he wants to do for the rest of his characters life at level 10.

It's not much different from WoW talents, DAoC SP's/realm points, etc. I wouldn't really call it a new feature.

holymight · 06-19-2006, 11:49 AM

See comments in blue.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaxmax

DAoC has had player controlled boats for a long time, since TOA.
Didn't know that.

Didn't SWG have player housing? AC too if I remember correctly (could be wrong there).
Mistake on my part. Forgot about SWG because I never had a house in that game.

Vanguard does not currently have flying mounts either. The title of "first to have flying mounts" is going to depend on what releases first: TBC or VG.
Uhm, just because the flying mounts is not on the beta server does not mean it doesn't have it. Devs already said they are shipping with flying mounts.

FFXI and EQ (Gfay/Commons on my server) come to mind
Maybe once upon a time on your server (mine was only commons), but it's not like that any more. So semi innovation.

It's not much different from WoW talents, DAoC SP's/realm points, etc. I wouldn't really call it a new feature.
Except wow talents can easily be reset and is not quested. Can't comment on DAoC since I didn't play it very far.

but whatever, it's a pointless argument. A game doesn't need innovation to be enjoyable. Especially not a MMO. In the end people will be playing it based on fun, something we can't really argue at this point in time.

Bizanich · 06-19-2006, 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymight

Different since UO was a top down 2D game.

Did SWG have housing?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Holymight

EQ2 does not have flying mounts. The clouds are like griffins in WoW. WoW currently does not have flying mounts, so it's a new feature.

Will WoW have flying mounts before Vanguard comes out? If so, it won't be new.

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymight

Oh please, what game has localized economies. I must have missed it.

Eve Online

Quote:

Originally Posted by HolyMight

I don't see other games where a class have to make a choice which kind of shape shifting he wants to do for the rest of his characters life at level 10.

Sounds like character spec'ng or how in EQ2 you chose the final class at a certain level. Hardly amazing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymight

Your really trying hard to hate this game aren't you.

Some of the things he said deserved to be zinged, but he was correct with some of it to.

I find myself wondering more and more what 3rd gen would be, really. :/ Could it exist without PvP and, if so, what *exactly* would mark it as 3rd gen?

Itzena · 06-19-2006, 11:57 AM

Edit: Damn it, Biz. Type slower!

Dyscord · 06-19-2006, 11:59 AM

To me 3rd gen is player created content. I think the technology exists to make this happen.

If that Spore game by Will Wright works like it says it does... that opens MASSIVE new horizons for easy, player created environments and models. Imagine an entire dungeon designed and populated by a player's imagination coupled with the easy tools and procedural animation technology.

Items and the challenge of course would be determined by generators set up in game. WoW's already doing this with their item generator, etc.

Give players the tools, and let them create. Provided the playerbase is mature enough to test these new dungeons out and not favor some idiots 'cube deathmatch', the devs can eventually adopt the more popular ones and turn them into real, full fledged, dev polished dungeons.

Thats 3rd gen, if you ask me.

Etadanik · 06-19-2006, 12:00 PM

Sounds like NWN (and NWN 2)

Itzena · 06-19-2006, 12:01 PM

The first semi-mainstream MMOG to have player-created content will end up with GM events such as 'Attack of the Penis People!'

Dyscord · 06-19-2006, 12:03 PM

the trobbing warriors of the erectiles are battering down the gates of the innocent Cunny holes. Won't you please help?

Never before would that little sticker saying "online game, game experience may change while online" mean so much.

Hachima · 06-19-2006, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Since when can you own boats in EQ? Not even Google knows about this.

EQ had little rafts you could control on your own.

Quote:

Different since UO was a top down 2D game.

Ok if you want to get technical then Horizions. Not that it was a good game, but again, nothing new.

Quote:

EQ2 does not have flying mounts. The clouds are like griffins in WoW. WoW currently does not have flying mounts, so it's a new feature.

There is a gnomish flying machine mount. I don't think it is true flight though. But I guess if the WoW expansion comes out before Vanguard you can't call it a new feature then huh.

Quote:

Giving your pets yaks in EQ1 is not the same thing as pet equipment in Vanguard.

Ohh sweet, sign me up for the game now then! There are some differences for a minority of people that play a pet class? I know necros get to use parts to make up their pet. I don't know about equipment. Diable 2 let you gear up your 'pet' with real gear. The concept is nothing innovative to gaming.

Quote:

Oh please, what game has localized economies. I must have missed it.

Silk Road Online, check it out. Different towns attract different levels of players There are mass people spamming their goods in these areas, have fun.

Quote:

I don't see other games where a class have to make a choice which kind of shape shifting he wants to do for the rest of his characters life at level 10.

Are you talking about the old EQ2 or Talents in WoW at level 10? CoH/CoV gives you a huge range of the type of character you can make. What exactly does Vanguard force you to decide that is so altering as to the path your character takes? Auto Assult also makes you decide what skills you want to really specialize in.

Quote:

Your really trying hard to hate this game aren't you.

Never said I hate the game. You sure are grasping for anything Vanguard is actully innovating though.

Soygen · 06-19-2006, 12:07 PM

Quote:

EQ had little rafts you could control on your own.

He said owned, not controlled. I could jump on your skiff and steer it too, in EQ.

Etadanik · 06-19-2006, 12:08 PM

Quote:

The first semi-mainstream MMOG to have player-created content will end up with GM events such as 'Attack of the Penis People!'

For MMOs, you would need a screening system for custom content before letting it go live.

Interesting concept: hiring people to *screen* content, rather than create it.

Still, the bureaucratic issues involved would probably kill the idea. It's not so much the technology as it is the people...

Soygen · 06-19-2006, 12:09 PM

Screening that content would be a monumental task. The ratio of talented content to crap content would be staggering, I'm sure.

Dyscord · 06-19-2006, 12:11 PM

Oh god, I had forgotten about the little boats in EQ. The ones you could run up and right click on and it would let you control em. God that was so long ago. I remember tooling around in Lake Rathe with them.

Or am I going insane and there weren't any. It was such a long time ago.

06-19-2006, 11:57 AM	#771 (permalink)
Itzena SOS-dan #76564674 Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Near a big fucking castle, the UK Posts: 7,159 -25 Internets	Edit: Damn it, Biz. Type slower! __________________

06-19-2006, 12:01 PM	#774 (permalink)
Itzena SOS-dan #76564674 Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Near a big fucking castle, the UK Posts: 7,159 -25 Internets	The first semi-mainstream MMOG to have player-created content will end up with GM events such as 'Attack of the Penis People!' __________________

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06-19-2006, 11:37 AM	#766 (permalink)
ZeckEQ Registered User Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 208 -1 Internets	And if UO's housing won't rate because it's not 3d, AC1 had non instanced housing with windows and SWG without windows. DAoC was also non-instanced, just seperate zones for housing. No frekin windows there tho.

06-19-2006, 11:59 AM	#772 (permalink)
Dyscord Harvey Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: The Command Carrier Posts: 2,180 +38 Internets	To me 3rd gen is player created content. I think the technology exists to make this happen. If that Spore game by Will Wright works like it says it does... that opens MASSIVE new horizons for easy, player created environments and models. Imagine an entire dungeon designed and populated by a player's imagination coupled with the easy tools and procedural animation technology. Items and the challenge of course would be determined by generators set up in game. WoW's already doing this with their item generator, etc. Give players the tools, and let them create. Provided the playerbase is mature enough to test these new dungeons out and not favor some idiots 'cube deathmatch', the devs can eventually adopt the more popular ones and turn them into real, full fledged, dev polished dungeons. Thats 3rd gen, if you ask me.

06-19-2006, 12:00 PM	#773 (permalink)
Etadanik Banned Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 1,643 +0 Internets	Sounds like NWN (and NWN 2)

06-19-2006, 12:03 PM	#775 (permalink)
Dyscord Harvey Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: The Command Carrier Posts: 2,180 +38 Internets	the trobbing warriors of the erectiles are battering down the gates of the innocent Cunny holes. Won't you please help? Never before would that little sticker saying "online game, game experience may change while online" mean so much.

06-19-2006, 12:09 PM	#779 (permalink)
Soygen 100% Pure Soy Monk Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Ft. Lauderdale, FL Posts: 7,447 +107 Internets	Screening that content would be a monumental task. The ratio of talented content to crap content would be staggering, I'm sure.

06-19-2006, 12:11 PM	#780 (permalink)
Dyscord Harvey Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: The Command Carrier Posts: 2,180 +38 Internets	Oh god, I had forgotten about the little boats in EQ. The ones you could run up and right click on and it would let you control em. God that was so long ago. I remember tooling around in Lake Rathe with them. Or am I going insane and there weren't any. It was such a long time ago.