Plan to resolve WoW dungeon issue casual vs raider

[Tuivian]

So they release a 5 man dungeon to be balanced to all parties involved... perfect resolution no matter the gear.

Step 1: to make it interesting make the instance randomly generate the layout and location of all npc's. Diablo series did this perfectly so the technology exists.

Step 2: create a formula that takes the Item level average of the *highest item currently equipped or in inventory for the entire party, this then would place your group into a category based that can scale with the difficulty and loot of the dungeon upon zoning in.
Many issues can arise with attempting to exploit this scale i.e. zoning out and changing equipment. If upon entering again, it re-calculates your Item level average, if that average goes up the difficulty of the dungeon is increased while the loot stays the same, so in turn it just made the dungeon harder for easier loot. (The dungeon would never scale down once created to prevent exploitation)

In example... an entire group of players are equipped with blues averaging a total of Item level 60 for all pieces. The difficulty of the dungeon would scale on creation to be suitable for that degree and loot would be on par to I62-64. That way the items are an upgrade.

If the group is composed of all purples and their Item level average equates to 75, the enemies would scale accordingly and drop loot around Item level 78.

Obviously the #'s can be toggled to get the right fit, but this delivers to every group.

Thought on the mind boggling theory of creativity?

[xilsharn]

Originally Posted by Tuivian

So they release a 5 man dungeon to be balanced to all parties involved... perfect resolution no matter the gear.

Step 1: to make it interesting make the instance randomly generate the layout and location of all npc's. Diablo series did this perfectly so the technology exists.

Step 2: create a formula that takes the Item level average of the *highest item currently equipped or in inventory for the entire party, this then would place your group into a category based that can scale with the difficulty and loot of the dungeon upon zoning in.
Many issues can arise with attempting to exploit this scale i.e. zoning out and changing equipment. If upon entering again, it re-calculates your Item level average, if that average goes up the difficulty of the dungeon is increased while the loot stays the same, so in turn it just made the dungeon harder for easier loot. (The dungeon would never scale down once created to prevent exploitation)

In example... an entire group of players are equipped with blues averaging a total of Item level 60 for all pieces. The difficulty of the dungeon would scale on creation to be suitable for that degree and loot would be on par to I62-64. That way the items are an upgrade.

If the group is composed of all purples and their Item level average equates to 75, the enemies would scale accordingly and drop loot around Item level 78.

Obviously the #'s can be toggled to get the right fit, but this delivers to every group.

Thought on the mind boggling theory of creativity?

So, Lost Dungeons of Norrath. Roger. Not saying it's not a bad idea, but I don't think anyone except whiny b.net tards give a crap about casual vs. raider. Five man instances are supposed to be (or have been, so far) a place to gear up your folks to take on raid instances. If they're going to put in this much effort they're going to have to create an entire line of five-mans that build off each other. And they're not going to do that, nor should they.

Progression. Without it what's the point of this game?

[Duppin]

Rickshaw in 3...2...1...

[Szlia]

Randomly generated layouts for dungeons have been made allready and often. If have yet to see one where the dungeons were not bland though.

If you get rid of the dungeon and just make it some arena where you get a boss unleached on you and do it with a somewhat clever reward and mob generation system with a ranking system on top of it, it could provide many hours of entertainement. Do solo, group and 4 and 8 groups raid versions and voilà.

I don't know about you, but having a single try at a mob you don't know at all and will never see again sounds pretty exciting to me.

[Brikker]

Couldn't you just do this dungeon over and over and over to get upgrades every run?

[Hateyou]

Originally Posted by Tuivian

Thought on the mind boggling theory of creativity?

How are randomly generated dungeons and formula created items creative? Your idea is fucking horrible for WoW. That's just my opinion though~

[Stragi]

If you want diablo, go play diablo and stop posting stupid threads.

[Cybsled]

While this may seem like a simple and easy solution to implement to you, it would fail for numerous reasons. Furthermore, what if you zoned in with a bunch of uber people, then booted one and replaced him with some gimp. Hi2u insta-uber gear.

[theawddone]

The only placed I'd want to see randomization for instanes in WoW would be if they made some sort of FFA bg(s) or something to that effect, for PVP...

[Weritech]

In most genres, players of different tastes end up served by different games.

In 2000, I didn't expect that there would be a massive game like WoW successfully serving so many different tastes. I foresaw a number of 300K-1M subscriber titles that catered to specific playstyles.

Now, I've come to believe that these players of different castes need each other.

Casuals need goals permanently beyond their reach and raiders need masses of lesser players to excel amongst. Every game is going to face this problem because one cannot exist without the other.

[Weritech]

[quote=SzliaIf you get rid of the dungeon and just make it some arena where you get a boss unleached on you and do it with a somewhat clever reward and mob generation system with a ranking system on top of it, it could provide many hours of entertainement. Do solo, group and 4 and 8 groups raid versions and voilà.

I don't know about you, but having a single try at a mob you don't know at all and will never see again sounds pretty exciting to me.[/QUOTE]

Didn't FFXI do something like this? Basically a MMOized version of the coliseum from FF6?

[Zehn - Vhex]

Thing most "omg casual epix!" people forget is that the point of large scale raids isn't your own personal skill. Shit, I would love to get phats based on my personal skill. I'd be equiped in ilvl200 epix by now.

The -major- limiting factor is that as encounters get bigger and bigger, you rely more and more on other people not fucking up. From Vael bombing, to a rogue turning the mob, to faggots agroing the fucking bugs, to people standing too close to you and getting you green beam'd, etc...etc...it's much easier to find 4 people who can follow instructions then it is finding 40 people.

Grouping just can't simulate that. Nobody wants to spend 4 months wiping to a 5 man instance either, yet we have almost no qualms with throwing ourselves against a 40 man raid zone for a quarter of year.

Content is easier to make harder too when you can assume that you'll have at least X of every class. You might have a boss that requires a feral druid to tank it among other things. Then the boss after that requires at least two mages with blast wave among other things. Then another boss requires a priest with silence among other things.

Simply designing an encounter and then deciding, "lol okay if ur ilvl 82, it hits for 3k!" does not an interesting dungeon make, nor does making every dungeon basically a carbon copy of all the others. As others have pointed out, hi2u LDoN (or ).

The pretext is noble, but the concept is retarded. Learning your class is the first step to getting good loot. Then you learn how to work well with a group to get the next step of good loot. Then you learn the skills required to be a cog in the machine, and that gets you the best loot.

[Hateyou]

Originally Posted by Weritech

In most genres, players of different tastes end up served by different games.

In 2000, I didn't expect that there would be a massive game like WoW successfully serving so many different tastes. I foresaw a number of 300K-1M subscriber titles that catered to specific playstyles.

Now, I've come to believe that these players of different castes need each other.

Casuals need goals permanently beyond their reach and raiders need masses of lesser players to excel amongst. Every game is going to face this problem because one cannot exist without the other.

People came to this conclusion in the year 2000 pretty much. Everyone's been saying this for years, it's pretty much the point of MMO's. Casuals need goals...Hardcores need carrots and bragging rights. You can continue feeling that it's completely your unique idea though if you want to.

[Weritech]

Originally Posted by Hateyou

People came to this conclusion in the year 2000 pretty much. Everyone's been saying this for years, it's pretty much the point of MMO's. Casuals need goals...Hardcores need carrots and bragging rights. You can continue feeling that it's completely your unique idea though if you want to.

Look bitch, I don't keep my finger on the pulse of the MMO world! Don't shit on my late epiphany.

[xilsharn]

Originally Posted by Weritech

Look bitch, I don't keep my finger on the pulse of the MMO world! Don't shit on my late epiphany.

sissyfight!