SoE Station Launcher

[Xaen]

Originally Posted by Soriak

And the price difference between the 360 and ps3 is meaningless, considering you get a bluray player with the ps3. I say it again, a standalone player is over $1,000 - personally, I want to watch bluray movies now, not in 3 years when the players drop to acceptable prices.

I think that bluray player will lure in a lot of people who otherwise wouldn't be playing games. It's a great way to make it "acceptable" in a home entertainment system for adults.

I somewhat doubt this. Right now you can walk into Best Buy and buy a HD-DVD player today, and pick up a few HD movies. And watch them tonight. For under $500. The add-on to the 360 is going to be around $150-200, which will make the 360 fall in line to the same price as the PS3 with Bluray.

The only difference between the two at this point is that HD-DVD is out now, and has the market the same way Microsoft has the gaming market with the 360.

It's basically a moot point to argue over as the pricing is about the same in the end if you're looking for an HD content player in addition to your gaming.

What format will "win"? Who knows. I really couldn't say. We might see movies with Bluray on one side, and HD-DVD on the other.

[Tancred]

Originally Posted by leane

Oh there is no doubt that the PS3 will be the top dog graphically and it needs the blueray for the amount of detailed textures that will natrually be required for that graphics. Problem is the hardcore gamer market is much, much smaller, compare most MMPOG to WoW, that casual market is the king. Sony is betting on the shear power of their system (their show before E3 was mostly numbers, they didn't really show anything) Microsoft is betting on Sony dropping the ball and will probably price drop just before the launch to tap out people plus their better setup for online play. Nintendo is aiming for the casuals with cheap hardware and lot of games

The demands of games are in no way driving the need for Blu-Ray's capacity. It's going in the PS3 so Sony gets mass-market uptake as soon as possible and wins the format war.
I doubt there are many games that have come close to filling a standard DVD without padding it with FMV and 6 channel soundtracks. It's all very well having bucketloads of fill rate and geometry crunching power but you still need RAM to store it. Nobody bothers streaming graphics because the seeks kill you.

[Tasso]

my 2 cents

Price

for some people 600 bucks is not that big of a deal. My xbox 360 cost me 600 after all the accessories and 2 games (core 399.00 + hd 99.99 + 3 wireless controlers + remote and hd connector). And even with that price point there were still lines to pick it up.

But at a 500/600 pricepoint with no games in the box sony might have an issue if the xbox360 drops it's price another 100 bucks for the xmas season.

for average households (44,000) thats a lot of money. I have talked to a few parents and they think the xbox360 is a lot. Ask them to spend another 100-200 bucks (or 200-300 if they drop the price) on another console and xbox360 starts looking better on the shelf.

even if microsoft does not drop the price and instead bundles 2 games (pgr3 and another for example) your still looking at a 100-200 dollar diffrence in price and not having to buy as many games.

BlueRay vs. HDDVD

As far as blueray as a reason to buy the ps3, you will be able to get a hddvd player addon for the xbox360. So for people like me I get one for 200-250 bucks. Granted you cannot play games from it but my thought is more games are going to start using hd space on the consoles rather than the disk (ffx for example)

If Microsoft comes out with another hd at 200 gigs then the size of the content becomes less of an issue (other than the 30 min it will take to load up the game the first time)

Games

exclusive games will start being less of an issue for what console is better. For example one of the biggest exlusives for ps2 was the gta games. Coming out 1 year before they were on the xbox. Now gta4 is going to be released for both consoles at the same time.

Granted sony games like god of war and others are going to be a + for that system but fable2 (don't laugh) and Halo3 are looking good as well. Gears of war is looking like its going to be the game to combat the ps3 launch and nobody thinks thats not going to be a huge seller.


Online
xbox live is good and sounds like it is only getting better. classic arcade games like streetfighter online and the new deal with Mame is going to be cool. some of its restrictions are preventing games from coming over to the xbox360 (an interview said WOW won't due to how xboxlive works) so thats the space Sony can try to get some ground on them.

As far as Sonys online goes we will have to see how it works and then write about it. My guess is that its viewed as a money maker rather than a feature. The last thing I want to do is buy music that only plays on my ps3. The biggest reason for me not getting a psp is the fact that movies cost as much on that as they do on dvd. To me thats being greedy.


Power

There is no denying that the PS3 has a stronger core. But people do not take into effect the xbox360's advantages like chip embedded ram and larger l2 memory. We also forget that the stronger console does not make for a automatic win. First to market is a huge advantage.


Conclusion
I have too much time on my hands.

In the end price, games and timing will be what console "wins" for me (microsoft fanboy) i see that the xbox 360 has at least 2 out of 3. Games by sony currently seem to have the upper edge over MGS. if this changes then you will see the xbox360 win.. if not I think sony will see success but not as large as it was with ps2 vs xbox .

[leane]

Originally Posted by Tancred

The demands of games are in no way driving the need for Blu-Ray's capacity. It's going in the PS3 so Sony gets mass-market uptake as soon as possible and wins the format war.
I doubt there are many games that have come close to filling a standard DVD without padding it with FMV and 6 channel soundtracks. It's all very well having bucketloads of fill rate and geometry crunching power but you still need RAM to store it. Nobody bothers streaming graphics because the seeks kill you.

Thats true, there is limited demand, although I'm thinking that the space will be needed because PS3 is aiming at high definition and as such will have texture files that are natrually larger than systems such as Wii would ever need.

Although this is just guesswork i'm wondering WHY would you need Blueray? Movies seem to fit perfectly fine on a regular DVD, maybe you could put that extra features disk on the same disk as the movie but is that actually an issue? Game content? well like you said, unless its loaded up with FMVs (say helloe to the next generation version of night trap) its not gonna use that space (hell Oblivion is only a single DVD) Is there really any reason to even bother with it for another 5 years?

[findar]

Originally Posted by leane

Although this is just guesswork i'm wondering WHY would you need Blueray?

so sony can own the market on it. since they have such a huge stake in the movie industry they are promoting it heavily. funny is you can fit a 1080p(sean correct me here) movie on hd-dvd just as easily as blu-ray.

[Utnayan]

Originally Posted by findar

so sony can own the market on it. since they have such a huge stake in the movie industry they are promoting it heavily. funny is you can fit a 1080p(sean correct me here) movie on hd-dvd just as easily as blu-ray.

Not Sean, but you are correct. HD DVD will be able to display 1080p as soon as they release players with HDMI output.

[Cad]

Originally Posted by Utnayan

Not Sean, but you are correct. HD DVD will be able to display 1080p as soon as they release players with HDMI output.

I don't believe the "capability" to display 1080p has anything to do with HDMI or HD-DVD - it's a copy-protection restriction, for whatever reason. I can output 1080p from my home theater PC with no issue over VGA or Component.

[Aethn Anvel]

I spent over $2500 on my PC's upgrades last year. Pretty much everyone on this board dumps alot of cash into our systems / networks and fees for games.

$600 is nothing to a serious gamer. I will be buying this and not even blink an eye about it. Blue-Ray technology alone makes this worth $600.

[Soygen]

Originally Posted by Aethn Anvel

I spent over $2500 on my PC's upgrades last year. Pretty much everyone on this board dumps alot of cash into our systems / networks and fees for games.

$600 is nothing to a serious gamer. I will be buying this and not even blink an eye about it. Blue-Ray technology alone makes this worth $600.

Seriously. Top of the line video cards are 600 bucks alone. This is an entire system with a blu-ray player for the same price. If you can't afford it, fine. But to say it's overpriced is not really giving it a fair look.

[Hachima]

Originally Posted by Aethn Anvel

I spent over $2500 on my PC's upgrades last year. Pretty much everyone on this board dumps alot of cash into our systems / networks and fees for games.

$600 is nothing to a serious gamer. I will be buying this and not even blink an eye about it. Blue-Ray technology alone makes this worth $600.

My thoughts exactly. I paid almost that much to get a brand new video card upgrade for my PC. As time goes on it seems like console gaming keeps getting closer to the power of PC gaming and so I expect the price will too.

For now PCs will have constant made available to them which will let them stay ahead. Consoles start out strong and over the years drop in performance compared to PCs. Upgrades to consoles as far as hardware have not been successful in the past and probably won't any time soon.

Not one but two FF13 titles being developed for the PS3 has me looking forward to the system. It's hard to say if their online system will match up to Xbox Live which I like a lot about the 360.

Have they said what the prices, if any, will be for that? I'm debating whether to get the PS3, but it would sway me to buy it if they gave the PS1 games at no extra cost. Or at least if they do charge for them they should throw in a certain amount of PS1 titles for download free. Eitherway, the idea itself being able to download games instead of going out to buy them is good thinking.

They just mentioned it while talking about downloadable content. My guess is a price like Xbox Live arcade games but I dunno. Since its for the PSP and you copy the games to memory card it's hard to think you won't see downloadable versions floating around on the net too.

SF2 for Xbox Live arcade coming out soon with old school tournaments to play. Should be fun =)

[Utnayan]

Originally Posted by Cad

I don't believe the "capability" to display 1080p has anything to do with HDMI or HD-DVD - it's a copy-protection restriction, for whatever reason. I can output 1080p from my home theater PC with no issue over VGA or Component.

The problem will be if it will be allowed though.

http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=1424

Sorry, I should have been more clear on that.

[Cad]

All that said, buying either system to use as a player I believe would be a bad move - it's only going to be a matter of time before dual-capable players come out that can play both. Unless you were going to buy one anyway and just see the HD-DVD or Blu-Ray capability as a neato bonus.

[Utnayan]

Originally Posted by Cad

All that said, buying either system to use as a player I believe would be a bad move - it's only going to be a matter of time before dual-capable players come out that can play both. Unless you were going to buy one anyway and just see the HD-DVD or Blu-Ray capability as a neato bonus.

I agree. They also already have dual standard product coming out too that will play both. Either way, it's a mess when this happens and it sucks for the end user. Especially if you get invested in one standard, and another takes the cake - ala VHS/Beta wars.

With that said, I know that the PS3 will still sell well. I just think that it isn't going to be nearly as good as the PS2 launch. There is just too much viable competition out there right now, and I still feel the price point is way too high. If they were to hit $399.99 for the 20gb version, with HDMI, and the 60 gb version at $449.99, then I think people would be going crazy over it.

[Soriak]

Originally Posted by leane

Why not just put together a kick ass computer system and run the games at twice the resolution of any of the consoles which are limited to a TV reso, have far more utility and a hell of a lot more power for the next 5 years.

Dual top-of-the-line graphic cards might just cost you $1,200 alone. Then you need a 64bit processor, top RAM etc etc - that's easily breaking the $3,000 mark. And that's before you add a new widescreen high def monitor, which might just add another $1,000+

And before the year is over, your pc will be worth half as much and already lag behind the cream of the crop - 2 years later you won't run games on max settings anymore. That's quite a lot of money to invest.


With a console you can just plug it in and KNOW that everything is going to run smoothly without the need to upgrade anything. That and you get to play it on however big your TV is. Gaming on a 42'' Plasma has a certain appeal


And as mentioned before: the two final fantasy XIII games will be exclusive to the PS3. That alone should be reason enough to buy it

[Cad]

FYI you can play computer games on any HDTV as well - 1280x720 looks nice as does 1920x1080 if your TV can do the detail.

And playing games on a plasma is a bad idea - I'll let you google on it to find out why.