I hate to do it but how about some Priest discussion? - Page 13

Shiftin · 06-29-2005, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frott

Because MC is fucking boring and good luck getting priests to feel engaged when they're in fast heal pissing matches with paladins (who get no aggro from heals and if they do can actually defend).

I've never cleared MC because it sucks and endgame priests suck as well. Get the hint? Shadowpriests running around saying durrr i do good DPS need to install a DPS meter. The only way a shadowpriest makes any sense is when you have enough healing anyway, in which case you could switch to a *gasp* real DPS class.

Sorry that you believe clearing MC grants you the "master of the priest class" license... it doesn't take a fucking dummy to see gaping flaws in things like "pvp" "pve" and "raid" roles of priests.

Post... makes... no... sense. Priests are extremely restricted by their talents. They could rename the specs to pvp and pve instead of shadow and holy.

What i'm saying is that in an onyxia raid or a MC raid without a ridiuclous number of priests, i have plenty to do on BOSSES (no shit clearing trash is boring) and don't need to worry about crap like "how evil my casting has been lately" to heal effectively.

MC doesn't make anyone a master of their class, but people who've never done a 40 person raid in anything but AV shouldn't try to redesign a class they haven't seen a big part of.

Solmancer · 06-29-2005, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cor

The warlock one isn't too great either. Many of the big issues have been avoided for months and months (debuff limit, shard creation etc etc), with the time frame given as "some time in the future". He also posts blatant lies, such as saying that enslave was left untouched shortly after the patch which halved its duration.

Figured I'd pull up this quote that was buried in things:

Enslave has been behaving very... strange of me over the past three patches. The Dire Maul (1.4?) version was obviously borked, especially on Doomguards which broke early a lot. But now, in 1.5, I get a mix of both. Sometimes I get early breaks frequently, and sometimes I get "good" Enslave behavior (meaning, Curse of Shadow does what it's supposed to do for Enslave). It's pretty obvious they are touching it, but I wonder if perhaps Blizzard QA is using an entirely different measurement system than they should be. In other words, using some sort of debug tool that reports "break chance per X time" or what have you, instead of testing out the practical approach (aka - actually use it for a while in groups/raids/solo for worthwhileness?).

Anyway, enough Warlock-related derailment. There's really one thing as far as the healing paradigm goes for an MMO in a raid situation:

What do the healer classes do during the battle? If the raid mob puts out noticeable chunks of damage, do you design around the raid group spending 1-2 hours in total recovery time, because your "healer" classes are really just causing damage mitigation and prevention (ie - primeval WoW Priest's Fumble/Confusion spells) and therefore "res all and rebuff" become the norm; or do you go with the traditional approach and have the much more frequent heals coming in, although spammed/healbot-ish ones that allow you to have more chance to continue on right after (not counting drinking etc.) without that monotony? Because if you go towards the first approach, it feels inevitable you are gonna get more casualties than normal, and thus spend more time on recovery.

Raylen · 06-30-2005, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solmancer

What do the healer classes do during the battle? If the raid mob puts out noticeable chunks of damage, do you design around the raid group spending 1-2 hours in total recovery time, because your "healer" classes are really just causing damage mitigation and prevention (ie - primeval WoW Priest's Fumble/Confusion spells) and therefore "res all and rebuff" become the norm; or do you go with the traditional approach and have the much more frequent heals coming in, although spammed/healbot-ish ones that allow you to have more chance to continue on right after (not counting drinking etc.) without that monotony? Because if you go towards the first approach, it feels inevitable you are gonna get more casualties than normal, and thus spend more time on recovery.

That's the thing. If BWL makes it more of a one priest per tank type dungeon, I don't think I'll have a problem with healing. Being able to utilize all your healing tools such as shield, renew, flash heal and greater heal on one person seems a lot more fun. Everyone having to spam one tank makes healing a lot less fun.

Jimb0v · 06-30-2005, 01:41 PM

An MMORPG should introduce aiming your heals.

You shoot a ray of light that heals whoever is in its path.
You shoot a ball of aoe healing that must be shot with a wand to let off an amoutn of healing to a distance from the focal point of the explosion.
A aoe heal you use a blizzard type map to lay down.

Aiming forces people to pay attention. The ability to press a key to target someone or to select someone from a raid window removes graphics from the game essentially, A priest could almost literally play with no graphics, just some health bars and hot keys to target players. I think that is the crux of the problem.

Zehn - Vhex · 06-30-2005, 01:53 PM

As opposed to your mana bar dictating what spell you cast?

I use renew as often as possible, the problem is, it's one cast per customer. Shield is only useful if someone get's mortal striked. Otherwise it's simply too mana inefficient to cast. The only way greater heal is going to be useful is either

A) mob DPS becomes slow/predictable enough

or

B) Tanks get enough HP to make GHeal spamming feasable.

THe first one is boring, as is evidenced by 8 million UBRS clearings, and the second one is just going to lead to GHeal rotations.

Yay.

06-30-2005, 01:53 PM	#185 (permalink)
Zehn - Vhex Lord of the Dance Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 9,585 +207 Internets	As opposed to your mana bar dictating what spell you cast? I use renew as often as possible, the problem is, it's one cast per customer. Shield is only useful if someone get's mortal striked. Otherwise it's simply too mana inefficient to cast. The only way greater heal is going to be useful is either A) mob DPS becomes slow/predictable enough or B) Tanks get enough HP to make GHeal spamming feasable. THe first one is boring, as is evidenced by 8 million UBRS clearings, and the second one is just going to lead to GHeal rotations. Yay. __________________

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06-30-2005, 01:41 PM	#184 (permalink)
Jimb0v Registered User Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 45 +0 Internets	An MMORPG should introduce aiming your heals. You shoot a ray of light that heals whoever is in its path. You shoot a ball of aoe healing that must be shot with a wand to let off an amoutn of healing to a distance from the focal point of the explosion. A aoe heal you use a blizzard type map to lay down. Aiming forces people to pay attention. The ability to press a key to target someone or to select someone from a raid window removes graphics from the game essentially, A priest could almost literally play with no graphics, just some health bars and hot keys to target players. I think that is the crux of the problem.