Honor points, top secret! - Page 5

GiR · 04-22-2005, 07:27 AM

All Horde attack Southshore by the road/windrider. You've got a small buffer of guards and NPCs that don't force the additional guards. Tarren Mill on the other hand, has the road leading directly into the "heart" of the town with spawnable guards.

Try hitting Southshore from the east or (even better) the beach and you'll see a shitton of guards spawn. Omaha!

Iannis · 04-22-2005, 07:38 AM

Considering how much of a gankfest shithole Hillsbrad was on the beta pvp, i'm not surprised it's a gankfest shithole now that there's actually a point to doing it.

Fuckity. Warcraft 4 should have an impossible map where you have to fight a constantly replenishing zerg rush of guards to complete the scenario, and dub it Hills.

Good for the priests tho. I seem to remember DAoC had to get pushed into making healing and ressing dead people actually give Realm Points. You'd never get a goddamn revive without knowing the priest otherwise...assholes always tromping over my corpse after a ministrel+shitload of Infiltrators cheapofang me down and speed off...

Fris_Leafshadow · 04-22-2005, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kaxmax
First night I was around 140 kills, over 3k points. Almost all of it in a two man group with me and a shaman (I'm a warrior) at the TM/SS zerg. I had a few guildmates who joined the mass raid and got far fewer contribution points, yet had more kills than me.

very interesting, that's the 1st time Ive seen such numbers from solo/small groups. I've seen lots of posts on the server forums of people w/ less then 10 points per kill. I hope WoW updates our points again soon, mine haven't changed after the 1st day.

would be interesting if there was an effective tool for measuring honorpoints over time

Surlok TP · 04-22-2005, 08:10 AM

Why is it such a Suprise that SS/TM is the most popular place to PVP?

Lets see I can go raid Orgimmar,If I die I have a 8 min run all the way back to town if I don't spirit res,If I do spirit res I am hosed for 10 min.Either way Dying sucks ass.While your dead your not earning kills whether through your own merit or a raids.

If I go to Stormwind and die I run from somewhere in Elwynn.

Undercity? same deal.

And the list goes on,all the Populated Cities feature Graveyards or are in places far out of reach that involve running.

The time running is time not spent killing,its also time that killing is going on and may have ended by the time you arrive.

If you die in Hillsbrad whether you be Horde or alliance you have a no more than 2 min Jaunt back to your corpse and the action.

This is all from a Raid pov obviously which is basically what everyone is talking about here.

Lets face it,no one gives a shit who ultimately wins or lsoes the Zerg rushes just as long as they get a bunch of kills in the process,the less time they can spend dead and away from the raid the more Kilsl they get in.More kills = More points= phat uber loots.

Hillsbrad is Battlegrounds 1.0 and no manner of altering the system is going to change that,Two opposing towns a Block of land away from each other with a graveyard and Griffon in each is as simple as it gets.

You can't die in a Capitol city,or any city realyl for that matter and have a hope of getting back to your body unless your faction still holds the area you died in.With the Rate and amount of guards that spawn in a city in addition to whatever opposing player force exists,the likelyhood of your side holding a position for a long period of time is slim.

In order for Largescale to be engaging it has to play like a FPS.The only place in the game you can die and respawn and keep the action going is in HS.Everywhere else requires fucking around in between Zerg rushes and players get bored and fuck off ending the "raids"

I hate calling them Raids,They arem ore or less just Clusterfucks.Everyone form up real close into one Giant Hurt ball and roll into TM,kill as many of the dirty horde as you can before you die.Then head back to SS and roll in again! ...Sigh

Mkopec1 · 04-22-2005, 08:56 AM

I think after one or two weeks of this mindless zerg rushing people maybe will start to realize that zerg does not = good ranks.

And that Kill # dont mean shit while your in a fucking zerg.

It just goes to show you the fucking mentality of a average PvPer. They would rather be in a raid of 30, their balls safely cuddled, rather than do some challenging 1 group PvP or solo.

Tuco · 04-22-2005, 09:10 AM

On Arthas, the amount of people on day #2 in Hillsbrad was significantly less than day #1. I expect this to diminish further, people to go PVE more in general, and the people that truly enjoy PVP will continue to PVP.

Once people realize that they won't ever reach the higher echelons of PVP rewards, they'll run out of breath and go back to PVE. And if Blizzard doesn't find some way to ingeniously balance the populations somehow(As an Alliance, it definately is imbalanced to a frusturatingly large amount, killing horde now is like mining thorium), a lot of the PVP people will go to Guild Wars.

Remove guards.

Remove Flagging for levels 55+.

Make a few FFA servers and allow transfer to them.

Please.

Surlok TP · 04-22-2005, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mkopec1
I think after one or two weeks of this mindless zerg rushing people maybe will start to realize that zerg does not = good ranks.

And that Kill # dont mean shit while your in a fucking zerg.

It just goes to show you the fucking mentality of a average PvPer. They would rather be in a raid of 30, their balls safely cuddled, rather than do some challenging 1 group PvP or solo.

But they won't,and I don't understand why people think they will.

This is mainly pointed toward PvE servers.

On a PvE server,your not going to have people just go about their buisness with thier flag on,doing so might interupt their day to day routine by getting attacked at an inoopportune time.There is a reason after all that people play on PvE servers.

Blizzard Introduces these rewards and makes them available on PvE,since the only way PvE people will PvP is in the safety of a Zerg force this is the only way its going to function until Battlegrounds are released.

The honour system should have been a PvP server Exclusive system,with Dishonour enabled.

It should have been added to PvE once Battlegrounds were released,instead they took a page out of SoE's book and decided to Beta Test on Live Servers.

Doesn't matter that raid points are not worth anyhting, on a server where you can't solo PvP,People want a reliable source of Honour.They want to see that number go up and they want to see it go up as high as possible in the least amount of time and effort as possible and so the Zerg Rushes are born.

If you try and solo PvP on a pve server you might be lucky to find one person if any willing to engage you while your flagged in some buttfuck nowhere zone,where as you can rack up something like 1000+ kills like many people that are taking part in the zerg HS raids have.I don't know how much of a difference solo kills VS raid kills are but I am willing to bet 1000+ kills in 3 days done in raids is a shit load more than a PvE player would get doing it solo or small grouped.

Its a fucked up stupid ass backwards system that doesn't belong on a PvE server that is devoid of Battlegrounds.

GiR · 04-22-2005, 09:30 AM

Nearly 6k points yesterday after a day in Hillsbrad just from one group sniping at the edges of the fracas.

Best kill(s) of the day was a Recklessness Cleave + Whirlwind on a priest group with a Arc Reaper. I needed a cigarette after that it felt so good.

Mkopec1 · 04-22-2005, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Surlok TP
But they won't,and I don't understand why people think they will.

This is mainly pointed toward PvE servers.

I understand, I meant my comment to refer to PvP servers, where the zergs are running rampant.

0hz · 04-22-2005, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by frott
Solid numbers are needed to know if a 20 man raid racking up 100 kills with, lets say, 30 unique kills, 20 double kills, and 5 triple kills in 30 mins is better than soloing for an hour or two and racking up 20 unique kills and 5 double kills.

So sad, a whiny bitch doesn't have the data necessary to build an optimal kill group/target matrix and further reduce the game to 3D beancounting.

Murr · 04-22-2005, 11:40 AM

Just misc numbers:
Wednesday - ~280 kills, 5000 contrib
Thursday - 232 kills, 6050 contrib

Wednesday was a mix of solo, group, and raid.
Thursday was all small group.

Duppin · 04-22-2005, 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Surlok TP
The honour system should have been a PvP server Exclusive system,with Dishonour enabled.

Quoted for fucking truth.

I won't be even ATTEMPTING to play (on a PvE/carebear/normal/whateveryouwannacallit server) until this shit dies down some.

Fuck Blizzard for basically screwing over people who don't want to have to PvP.

Phoenix · 04-22-2005, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Duppin
Quoted for fucking truth.

I won't be even ATTEMPTING to play (on a PvE/carebear/normal/whateveryouwannacallit server) until this shit dies down some.

Fuck Blizzard for basically screwing over people who don't want to have to PvP.

Umm, how do you get ganked on a PvE server?

And why in the fuck should dishonor be enabled on a PvP server?? Thats the fucking point, to KILL people.

Duppin · 04-22-2005, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Phoenix
Umm, how do you get ganked on a PvE server?

And why in the fuck should dishonor be enabled on a PvP server?? Thats the fucking point, to KILL people.

Getting ganked isn't the issue.

The issue is lag from massive zergs making several zones unplayable; trying to quest when all of the quest NPCs are dead; trying to get from town to town when the griffins/bats are dead or Grom'Gol tower is filled with Alliance.

Not all of us are level 60 yet (dicked around with alts too much).

edit: as far as dishonor goes, there should be penalties for level 60s corpsecamping level 30s. Not just lack of rewards, there should be FUCKING PENALTIES for being that much of a lameass.

Kaxmax · 04-22-2005, 12:07 PM

How exactly does it screw over people on PVE servers? Instances are on a different server from the main world, and they are unaffected by the increased PVP activity, from what I've seen. I play on one of the highest pop PVE servers (Blackhand), and latency has been green in instances every night.

The Rend/Strath bug problems are annoying, but they certainly don't have anything to do with the honor system.

Edit: Didn't realize you weren't 60. Still, I don't see it as being crippling, just avoid the zerg zones.

04-22-2005, 07:38 AM	#62 (permalink)
Iannis Registered User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Butt Hugging Moose Jockey Posts: 4,968 +0 Internets	Considering how much of a gankfest shithole Hillsbrad was on the beta pvp, i'm not surprised it's a gankfest shithole now that there's actually a point to doing it. Fuckity. Warcraft 4 should have an impossible map where you have to fight a constantly replenishing zerg rush of guards to complete the scenario, and dub it Hills. Good for the priests tho. I seem to remember DAoC had to get pushed into making healing and ressing dead people actually give Realm Points. You'd never get a goddamn revive without knowing the priest otherwise...assholes always tromping over my corpse after a ministrel+shitload of Infiltrators cheapofang me down and speed off... Last edited by Iannis : 04-22-2005 at 07:44 AM.

04-22-2005, 08:56 AM	#65 (permalink)
Mkopec1 Registered User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Detroit Posts: 5,091	I think after one or two weeks of this mindless zerg rushing people maybe will start to realize that zerg does not = good ranks. And that Kill # dont mean shit while your in a fucking zerg. It just goes to show you the fucking mentality of a average PvPer. They would rather be in a raid of 30, their balls safely cuddled, rather than do some challenging 1 group PvP or solo. __________________ When I am working on a problem I never think about beauty. I only think about how to solve the problem. But when I have finished, if the solution is not beautiful, I know it is wrong.

04-22-2005, 12:07 PM	#75 (permalink)
Kaxmax Registered User Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 1,981 +0 Internets	How exactly does it screw over people on PVE servers? Instances are on a different server from the main world, and they are unaffected by the increased PVP activity, from what I've seen. I play on one of the highest pop PVE servers (Blackhand), and latency has been green in instances every night. The Rend/Strath bug problems are annoying, but they certainly don't have anything to do with the honor system. Edit: Didn't realize you weren't 60. Still, I don't see it as being crippling, just avoid the zerg zones. Last edited by Kaxmax : 04-22-2005 at 12:17 PM.

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04-22-2005, 07:27 AM	#61 (permalink)
GiR Registered User Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 257 +0 Internets	All Horde attack Southshore by the road/windrider. You've got a small buffer of guards and NPCs that don't force the additional guards. Tarren Mill on the other hand, has the road leading directly into the "heart" of the town with spawnable guards. Try hitting Southshore from the east or (even better) the beach and you'll see a shitton of guards spawn. Omaha!

04-22-2005, 08:10 AM	#64 (permalink)
Surlok TP Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vancouver BC Posts: 1,584 +9 Internets	Why is it such a Suprise that SS/TM is the most popular place to PVP? Lets see I can go raid Orgimmar,If I die I have a 8 min run all the way back to town if I don't spirit res,If I do spirit res I am hosed for 10 min.Either way Dying sucks ass.While your dead your not earning kills whether through your own merit or a raids. If I go to Stormwind and die I run from somewhere in Elwynn. Undercity? same deal. And the list goes on,all the Populated Cities feature Graveyards or are in places far out of reach that involve running. The time running is time not spent killing,its also time that killing is going on and may have ended by the time you arrive. If you die in Hillsbrad whether you be Horde or alliance you have a no more than 2 min Jaunt back to your corpse and the action. This is all from a Raid pov obviously which is basically what everyone is talking about here. Lets face it,no one gives a shit who ultimately wins or lsoes the Zerg rushes just as long as they get a bunch of kills in the process,the less time they can spend dead and away from the raid the more Kilsl they get in.More kills = More points= phat uber loots. Hillsbrad is Battlegrounds 1.0 and no manner of altering the system is going to change that,Two opposing towns a Block of land away from each other with a graveyard and Griffon in each is as simple as it gets. You can't die in a Capitol city,or any city realyl for that matter and have a hope of getting back to your body unless your faction still holds the area you died in.With the Rate and amount of guards that spawn in a city in addition to whatever opposing player force exists,the likelyhood of your side holding a position for a long period of time is slim. In order for Largescale to be engaging it has to play like a FPS.The only place in the game you can die and respawn and keep the action going is in HS.Everywhere else requires fucking around in between Zerg rushes and players get bored and fuck off ending the "raids" I hate calling them Raids,They arem ore or less just Clusterfucks.Everyone form up real close into one Giant Hurt ball and roll into TM,kill as many of the dirty horde as you can before you die.Then head back to SS and roll in again! ...Sigh

04-22-2005, 09:10 AM	#66 (permalink)
Tuco Forum Janitor Join Date: May 2002 Location: Detroit Posts: 8,217 +12 Internets	On Arthas, the amount of people on day #2 in Hillsbrad was significantly less than day #1. I expect this to diminish further, people to go PVE more in general, and the people that truly enjoy PVP will continue to PVP. Once people realize that they won't ever reach the higher echelons of PVP rewards, they'll run out of breath and go back to PVE. And if Blizzard doesn't find some way to ingeniously balance the populations somehow(As an Alliance, it definately is imbalanced to a frusturatingly large amount, killing horde now is like mining thorium), a lot of the PVP people will go to Guild Wars. Remove guards. Remove Flagging for levels 55+. Make a few FFA servers and allow transfer to them. Please.

04-22-2005, 09:30 AM	#68 (permalink)
GiR Registered User Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 257 +0 Internets	Nearly 6k points yesterday after a day in Hillsbrad just from one group sniping at the edges of the fracas. Best kill(s) of the day was a Recklessness Cleave + Whirlwind on a priest group with a Arc Reaper. I needed a cigarette after that it felt so good.

04-22-2005, 11:40 AM	#71 (permalink)
Murr Token Gnome Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Chapel Hill, NC Posts: 1,780 +8 Internets	Just misc numbers: Wednesday - ~280 kills, 5000 contrib Thursday - 232 kills, 6050 contrib Wednesday was a mix of solo, group, and raid. Thursday was all small group.