Guild Point Systems

[FuckYou]

I've been keeping track of our DKP on a spreadsheet, but it's cumbersome. Might any of you have a recommendation for a program I could use to track it any easier?

I wrote one myself - web based deal so everyone can check it at any time yadda yadda.

If you dont want to do that, EQDKP is the way to go.

With regards to bidding, it's not a good system and breeds collusion. We had players mischan shit like "I wont bid if you want it dude" and all sorts of other stuff. Give people room to dick around and I assure you they will dick around. Fixed costs with only-aye discounts is the way to go IMO.

[Quineloe]

that will only happen
1. with lower quality items
2. if girls are involved.

[Lucifar]

the aye-only discount sounds dodgy

if you are worried abotu peopel colluding to get stuff cheap in auctions, whats to stop them doing the exact same thing to get yoru discount?

on top of that your possibly forcing people to pass or look like an asshole - say someone with more points than you calls for a drop - all you can possibly do by calling yourself is make him pay 100% rather than 65%

even if the 'aye's are silent, people are going to make it known before drops that they 'really like' the item and wil call for it, giving anyone with less points than them the message that for them to put themselves foward for it will only force their price up etc

almsot every dodgy situation you can come up with for auction fixing can be modified for yoru discount.

[FuckYou]

we took "ayes" in silent as tells. yeah, we knew there was some inter-class discussion a la "go ahead you have more points anyway I wont aye", but people started to play ball after a while.

Getting people to aye on reasonable upgrades instead of holding out for the impossibly rare item is the key, since while holding out they are not improving their char and thus not improving their raid value.

[Froofy-D]

- Bidding with silent auctions is the way to go IMHO. Open bidding takes forever. In my EQ guild you had 30 secs to put in your bid. Very efficient.

- People getting something for 1DKP isnt really a big deal IMHO. It's stuff that would have rotted. If there's a really good item drop you know people are gonna bid on it.

- If "class consorting" is a problem just assign a minimum DKP value based on item quality.

- If you really wanna go with fixed points per loot, just use some general formula. We used hps+mana+ a certain amount per effect. Then you dont have to make some big retarded database for every item in the game. Much easier.

Anyway, I havent seen a better system than silent bidding. Its fast, adjusts for inflation, and has very little administrative overhead.

[FuckYou]

btw to be successful you have to be willing to let something rot. as an officer or whatever you need to show people that the system is there for a reason, and if they are going to fuck around then shit is going to rot.

[Fammaden]

Originally posted by FuckYou
btw to be successful you have to be willing to let something rot. as an officer or whatever you need to show people that the system is there for a reason, and if they are going to fuck around then shit is going to rot.

Or in the case of WoW replace "rot" with "disenchant for mad IGEable blingz0r!"

[Quineloe]

you're contradicting yourself imo, you promote disenchanting of good equipment while you talk about "Making the guild stronger"

[FuckYou]

me? i never said anything about disenchanting. i said you have to show people that shit will rot if they dont aye, meaning you arent going to waffle and just let someone loot it.

the only way to make a point system work is to adhere to it. to me that meant solid pricing of items - no wavering. if you want a Sword of Burning you know its going to cost you X DKP to get it, and you plan accordingly. if all of a sudden another member of your class got it for 1 DKP, it makes the whole thing chaotic and non-relational.

[Fammaden]

Originally posted by Quineloe
you're contradicting yourself imo, you promote disenchanting of good equipment while you talk about "Making the guild stronger"

I was pretty much kidding, but you could argue that disenchanting can make a guild stronger assuming that anything disenchanted from raid drops is kept buy a guild enchanter for the sole purpose of supplying members with enchants.

[Quineloe]

is the LBS from a level 60 purple better than the one from a 51 blue?

[Yermum Onceme]

I'd rather have officer bias than shit rotting ><

[ilian]

A long time ago, I joined a guild that was relatively old and established. It was a DKP guild. I had pretty bad equipment, but that didnt bother me that much, and I've never considered myself a loot whore.

The guild also had some policies that sounded fair, like you dont earn DKP for the first month things like that.

I never missed a single raid with this guild for 2 months.

They often hit several raid targets a night, including stuff that was now easily farmable and hit a lot of stuff which very very few people in the guild wanted or needed. Since my equipment was a good deal worse than anyone elses, much of the stuff was still an upgrade for me.

I think there were a total of 28 upgrades to my equipment that dropped that the guild let rot in the first 2 months I raided with them, some of them VERY siginificant upgrades. I simply never had the DKP to buy them.

This made me, a person who normally doesnt give a shit about loot, quite resentfull towards the guild. They would rather have stuff rot than upgrade their guldie so that they will be more useful to the guild. It just made me *feel* bad.

I totally 'get' the statement about having to let stuff rot in order to make sure the DKP system retains true value and meaningfullness, but at the same time, I know how that situation made me feel.

[Duppin]

That's another problem I have with DKP systems; stuff that could be an upgrade for ANYONE in the raid, regardless of their DKP, should never rot.

Any system that requires people to not get loot that would be an upgrade for them, simply to maintain the integrity of its own structure, is problematic at best.

[Malvesti]

Originally posted by Duppin
That's another problem I have with DKP systems; stuff that could be an upgrade for ANYONE in the raid, regardless of their DKP, should never rot.

Any system that requires people to not get loot that would be an upgrade for them, simply to maintain the integrity of its own structure, is problematic at best.

Totally agree. People are justified not to trust a system that would waste man-hours of effort.

The reason people let gear rot is because their perception of its value does not match the price set by the administrator. Take basic economics--price floors and price ceilings do not work. They do more harm than good.