Rogue Talents

[Severak]

Well, my main character is a 34 Dwarf Hunter on Bloodhoof, but I've started a NE Rogue alt who's now level 13.


Now, looking at the various talent trees on my Rogue, I'm a tad confused. Because with a Hunter, each talent tree basically designated what type of Hunter you wanted to be (Mark = Ranged DPS, Beast = Pet DPS, Survival = Melee DPS). It was very plain and simple.


However, looking at the Rogue talent trees, at least to me, it isn't as established. It seems that the 2 options are Dagger + Backstab/ambush or Sword/Mace combo.


For some reason though, I'm gettin a retard wall and I can't really see clear cut advantages/disadvantages like I could with the various Hunter trees.



So, I guess I'm askin to be a little spoonfed, and was wondering if some high-level Rogues can discuss the various builds and the pros/cons of each tree.



(Obligatory "This isn't he fucking safehouse" and other such intarweb badass posts can please move along)

[kudos]

My points are pretty widespread. None going into backstab (i use mace combo) and most going into improved sinister strike, precision and other dps ones. I cant decide if i am going to do 5 into master of deception or 3 and then put 2 into camo. Some advice would be nice.

[Murr]

Just to throw my 2 cents in, I'm going for a dagger based sustained DPS build. That means, as much as I like subtlety for leveling and improved sap, I can't really justify points there (except perhaps in Opportunity but can't spare the points).

Anyway, I'm shooting for 21/30 Combat/Assassination. Imp SS, LR, Imp BS, Precision, Dagger Spec in Combat, and Assassination up to 5 Seal Fate. Subtlety is great for leveling up and for PVP but, again, hard to justify from a raid perspective. If you aren't going daggers there are better builds - I'm just not a fan of sword/mace build, even though I use swords mainhand for soloing almost exclusively as daggers just can't compete until you're grouping.

[Borzak]

Most of my points have fallen into Combat.
Only a few into subtely. All those were improved sneak.


Subtlety has some of the "coolest" talents, but stuff I can't see using a lot.

I'm mace/dagger myself. If you use a mace in the primary hand you loose backstab and ambush. However, since your special attacks aren't based on the delay of the weapon speed - but rather the damage - you'll get much bigger numbers out of the mace in the primary. Non-epic type fights that are over pretty quick I'm sure maces are the way to go mainhand. I put a dagger in the main only when soloing or such and want to ambush a mob.



In assasination I put points into Ruthlessness - chance your finishing move will add a point. Worthwhile in my opinon, malice - to increase crit percentage.

The rest have gone into combat with a focus on anything that improves crits - but I did up the chance of dodge and parry just because I needed those points to get further up in the build.

There's a good chance I'll rebuild at a later time sicne I play on a PVP server and some subtelty skills may come in handy at that point.

My focus thus far has been into +crits, +skills to get the mob killed faster. Not sneaking around etc.. and havne't missed those yet.

[kudos]

Originally posted by Borzak
There's a good chance I'll rebuild at a later time sicne I play on a PVP server and some subtelty skills may come in handy at that point.

My focus thus far has been into +crits, +skills to get the mob killed faster. Not sneaking around etc.. and havne't missed those yet.

Really the only reason I want to put any points into subtelty is because I am on a pvp server. And even that is only 5 points.

[Zhoup WP]

of the opinion: fuck ambush

im pretty much totally eventually split between all 3
trees.. posted my build in previous thread

depending on how raiding goes i may take my points
out of improv sap + opporunity and finish out
dagger spec and do aggression or try to shoot for
some sealed fate.

yeah, fuck ambush.

[Mkopec1]

I rerolled my rogue on a pvp server so im going for more of the subtlety, as in quicker run speed better camo. And the rest I will be investing in the dps as in the crit % and such.

[Kan]

majority of mine are in Assassination i use mace/mace sword/mace sword/sword combo the overall dps is better then dagger atleast for me it is since i solo 95% of the time. is a couple things in Subtetly i would like and also in Combat but the majority of my build is in Assassination. Any build is good for a rogue that is the great thing so pretty much whatever build you choose just base it on what you like to do cause any build is good.

[Keltan]

Search is your friend.

http://www.fohguild.org/forums/showt...threadid=13198

(Make sure you read Noah's post on page 4.)

[Malakie Torsade]

Currently 53, and I have Imp Ambush now. As much as I love to see the big numbers on it, I'm going to ditch it when I get 60 (if not sooner.) Thanks to the way they re-coded stealth to not be activateable if you are on anything's agro list, you will only get to use it on about 1/2 to 1/3 of the mobs in instances. Very poor returns for the talent points invested. Now, if they ever re-work stealth, it might be worth looking at again.

Right now, my plan is for 30/10/8 Ass/Sub/Combat with 3 points undecided; I'm thinking Inititive... hell, maybe 3 in Camo. I might not even put 5 into Seal as currently I only have 2 and it seems to go off far more than 40%.

Don't underestimate Imp Instant Poison. According to the Cosmos DPS meter, the Instant Poison V can do anywhere from 15%-20% of my DPS while soloing.

[Murr]

The decision I'm facing right now is Dagger Spec vs. DW spec. I'm 5 into seal fate so I can't take both unless I totally rethink my Assass tree (which is possible, but for the sake of discussion, let's stick with the seal fate 5 pts). My dps with a 34 dps offhand weapon is just about that - 34ish dps - at level 55, without any dw spec. A 60 rogue with Dal'rend's tribal guardian offhand (40ish dps) and full DW spec approaches 70. That's a lot of dps for 5 talent points. So I'm left wondering if I should take 5% crit from dagger spec or go for the offhand boost. Right now i'm leaning towards DW.

[kudos]

Originally posted by Murr
The decision I'm facing right now is Dagger Spec vs. DW spec.

I did DW spec also.

[Malakie Torsade]

DW would probably be the best way to go. I kinda wish they would have made it a + to hit with offhand instead of added damage. Honestly though, I'm not crazy about the combat tree. Not that it doesn't add significant dps; it just seems so... bleh.

I bought Ghostly Strike just for the hell of it. Not worth it. If the energy cost was lower, it'd be nice.

[Jabberwhacky]

I love the combat tree. Riposte and blade fury fucking rule. Once you hit 42 you get to stack BF and SnD for a 50% haste AND it hits 2 people at once. Before 42 it's a mere 40% haste. I can absolutely demolish 2 guys using this, oil of immolation and bombs from engineering. Hell most of the time I don't even bother with the oil or bomb.

BTW Riposte would be hella hella hella better if you didn't lose your combat points when you selected another target. Anyone know why this happens? I can understand the points staying on one target, but why do we lose them entirely? It'd give a lot more versatility to be able to gouge this guy over here, or blind that guy, or riposte the warrior, or kick the priest. This is part of the reason I'm such a big fan of Slice n Dice, everytime I see a priest start to heal I just SnD to use the few CPs somehow and then go kick his nuts.

[Borzak]

Originally posted by Jabberwhacky
I love the combat tree. Riposte and blade fury fucking rule. Once you hit 42 you get to stack BF and SnD for a 50% haste AND it hits 2 people at once. Before 42 it's a mere 40% haste. I can absolutely demolish 2 guys using this, oil of immolation and bombs from engineering. Hell most of the time I don't even bother with the oil or bomb.

BTW Riposte would be hella hella hella better if you didn't lose your combat points when you selected another target. Anyone know why this happens? I can understand the points staying on one target, but why do we lose them entirely? It'd give a lot more versatility to be able to gouge this guy over here, or blind that guy, or riposte the warrior, or kick the priest. This is part of the reason I'm such a big fan of Slice n Dice, everytime I see a priest start to heal I just SnD to use the few CPs somehow and then go kick his nuts.

I'm glad you mentioned that. Nothing sucks worse than building up 4-5 combo points on a mob then 2 casters in the group go ape shit and kill it leaving you hanging with 5 points on a dead mob.

They should make an upper tree talen that you can carry your points from one target to the next.

It doesn't happen a lot but when it happens it sucks.