Deus Ex Machina

SalTheBard · 10-06-2003, 05:36 AM

What does this phrase mean? Seriously I'm 22 and I love movies like Donnie Darko but I'm really not familer w/ this phrase at all. When they say something has a "Deus Ex Machina Plot Device" what is that? I'm confused and I'm sure understanding what this phrase means would make movies like Donnie Darko a lot more enjoyable.

ArkturusMaximus · 10-06-2003, 05:43 AM

http://dictionary.reference.com/sear...20ex%20machina

Stroker Ace · 10-06-2003, 05:46 AM

http://dictionary.reference.com/sear...20Ex%20Machina

EDIT: I was beaten

Oakman · 10-06-2003, 05:48 AM

its when gorilla comes the fuck out of nowhere and saves the day

Schatze · 10-06-2003, 08:51 AM

This is why I hate Harry Potter. Deus ex machina isn't bad if it fits the story... Which it doesn't.

"Oh no, we're all going to die... No, wait, I have an anti-shark spray repellant on my bat belt which I never mentioned and had forgotten until now, we're saved!"

SalTheBard · 10-06-2003, 12:54 PM

Hey I appreciate your help everyone

I'm still a little shakey but I have a better idea now. So basically any mystery movie where they go through and say shit like "I noticed a tiny piece of hair attached to her bra." and then go to use that as the vehicle for catching the villion would be Deus Ex Machina?

Edit: So what is Deus Ex Machina about Donnie Darko? Is Frank the Rabbit considered Deus Ex Machina?

Vorph · 10-06-2003, 01:02 PM

No, Deus Ex Machina is something completely out of nowhere which solves the mystery, saves the world, whatever. Your example might be far-fetched, but you'd still be able to follow some sort of deductive reasoning by the characters.

Deus Ex Machina would be more like.. the case is at a total stand-still and they've run out of clues, and then suddenly they get a call from the FBI who found a hair, traced the DNA, and identified the killer.

Or think back to MacGyver (or the A-Team for that matter)... that show basically revolved around the concept of Deus Ex Machina, since every episode he was able to find the exact parts needed to build himself the perfect thing to "save the day".

SalTheBard · 10-06-2003, 01:06 PM

O ok I got ya. So when MacGyver finds the Soda Can, Push Pin and String in the middle of desert and is able to build a helicopter and escape to freedom thats Deus Ex Machina?

Vorph · 10-06-2003, 01:16 PM

Yup.

And there's more than one element of Deus ex Machina in Donnie Darko. Frank is one of them, since he provides Donnie with information which is crucial to the story but which Donnie could not possibly find out on his own. Whether Frank is "God" or not is a debate which you'll have to decide for yourself.

The other really obvious one is the jet engine itself. It is about as literally "from the machine" as you can possibly get...

and it solves the problem of Donnie needing to die to save the world rather neatly. Some people mistake that for the filmmakers not knowing how they could end the movie, but IMO they knew exactly what they were doing and using a Deus ex Machina ending was what they planned all along.

There's probably others too that are more subtle, but it's been a while since I've seen the movie, and I think most/all of them are related to information which he got from Frank anyway.

SalTheBard · 10-06-2003, 01:40 PM

Thanks for your help Vorph..one last question and then this thread can die. Would something like....lets say....By Donnie not dying in the begining he burns down the dudes house then they find the kiddie sex torture chamber...would that be Deus Ex Machina because there is no way they would've know the kiddie sex porn dungeon would've been there unless Donnie had burned down his house.

Baradak · 10-06-2003, 02:14 PM

No, that wouldn't be an example of Deus Ex Machina.

Aulirophile · 10-06-2003, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SalTheBard
O ok I got ya. So when MacGyver finds the Soda Can, Push Pin and String in the middle of desert and is able to build a helicopter and escape to freedom thats Deus Ex Machina?

Its funny, people make fun of MacGuyver but I've seen every episode of it and nothing he does is impossible, or even that unlikely in terms of materials. There is always a very good reason such things would be where they are. The only improbable thing is that one man could be that on the spot inventive so consistently, but then what TV show doesn't have improbable characters?

Rensho · 10-06-2003, 03:10 PM

You seem to want an explanation to Donnie Darko.

Here is a good one - http://www.tonystuff.co.uk/darko-spoilers.htm

Schatze · 10-06-2003, 03:34 PM

An example would be the first harry potter movie.

My details might be a bit vague as I tried my best to forget them...

Basically harry needs to get the philosopher stone, the evil bad valdemar guy is living inside of the wussy efeete magic instructor.

Harry is trapped, and he is facing certain death from the pansy/valdemar guy, when all of a sudden, out of nowhere, it turns out that harry's touch is lethal to the valdemar dude and he saves the day!

Now, if, for instance hints had been given, stuff had been alluded to in the rest of the movie, it would be fine. But all of a sudden, harry pulls a magic ability out of nowhere but his ass, and he saves the day.

Another example would be Mars attacks. Big, bad aliens come down, fry the evil humans, etc. etc., we're all going to die as a race... But water ends up being able to kill them! Yay we're saved! This could go for Signs, too.

Deus Ex Machina, in the original greek/latin was when a god/avatar/tool would come out of nowhere, and solve a problem or magically resolve a conflict.

Today, anything that totally comes out of nowhere that provides an easy crutch that a lazy author can use to absolve him/herself of writing a tied in book tends to be deus ex machina. be it Harry suddenly developing the hands of death to totally kick ass, or the aliens being vulnerable to the most common substance on earth.

Deus Ex Machina can work... But it takes a very good author/writer to pull it off. 95% of the time you'll see it, it is a sign of a weak writer.

Ham n Cheese · 10-06-2003, 03:40 PM

Wasn't Mars Attacks that awful music that killed Aliens, not water?

10-06-2003, 05:36 AM	#1 (permalink)
SalTheBard Registered User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Olathe, KS Posts: 174 -1 Internets	Deus Ex Machina What does this phrase mean? Seriously I'm 22 and I love movies like Donnie Darko but I'm really not familer w/ this phrase at all. When they say something has a "Deus Ex Machina Plot Device" what is that? I'm confused and I'm sure understanding what this phrase means would make movies like Donnie Darko a lot more enjoyable. __________________ Saladas "Ranch" Dressing Just Some Bard

10-06-2003, 05:46 AM	#3 (permalink)
Stroker Ace Posts to Make Love to Your Old Lady By Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Austin, Texas Posts: 805	http://dictionary.reference.com/sear...20Ex%20Machina EDIT: I was beaten __________________ "They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we." —George W. Bush

10-06-2003, 12:54 PM	#6 (permalink)
SalTheBard Registered User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Olathe, KS Posts: 174 -1 Internets	Hey I appreciate your help everyone I'm still a little shakey but I have a better idea now. So basically any mystery movie where they go through and say shit like "I noticed a tiny piece of hair attached to her bra." and then go to use that as the vehicle for catching the villion would be Deus Ex Machina? Edit: So what is Deus Ex Machina about Donnie Darko? Is Frank the Rabbit considered Deus Ex Machina? __________________ Saladas "Ranch" Dressing Just Some Bard

10-06-2003, 01:02 PM	#7 (permalink)
Vorph Never Go Full Retard Join Date: May 2002 Location: Hell Posts: 5,685	No, Deus Ex Machina is something completely out of nowhere which solves the mystery, saves the world, whatever. Your example might be far-fetched, but you'd still be able to follow some sort of deductive reasoning by the characters. Deus Ex Machina would be more like.. the case is at a total stand-still and they've run out of clues, and then suddenly they get a call from the FBI who found a hair, traced the DNA, and identified the killer. Or think back to MacGyver (or the A-Team for that matter)... that show basically revolved around the concept of Deus Ex Machina, since every episode he was able to find the exact parts needed to build himself the perfect thing to "save the day". __________________

10-06-2003, 01:06 PM	#8 (permalink)
SalTheBard Registered User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Olathe, KS Posts: 174 -1 Internets	O ok I got ya. So when MacGyver finds the Soda Can, Push Pin and String in the middle of desert and is able to build a helicopter and escape to freedom thats Deus Ex Machina? __________________ Saladas "Ranch" Dressing Just Some Bard

10-06-2003, 05:43 AM	#2 (permalink)
ArkturusMaximus aka Tantrik Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 342 -1 Internets	http://dictionary.reference.com/sear...20ex%20machina

10-06-2003, 05:48 AM	#4 (permalink)
Oakman Registered User Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 462 -2 Internets	its when gorilla comes the fuck out of nowhere and saves the day

10-06-2003, 08:51 AM	#5 (permalink)
Schatze Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 1,444 -1 Internets	This is why I hate Harry Potter. Deus ex machina isn't bad if it fits the story... Which it doesn't. "Oh no, we're all going to die... No, wait, I have an anti-shark spray repellant on my bat belt which I never mentioned and had forgotten until now, we're saved!"

10-06-2003, 01:16 PM	#9 (permalink)
Vorph Never Go Full Retard Join Date: May 2002 Location: Hell Posts: 5,685	Yup. And there's more than one element of Deus ex Machina in Donnie Darko. Frank is one of them, since he provides Donnie with information which is crucial to the story but which Donnie could not possibly find out on his own. Whether Frank is "God" or not is a debate which you'll have to decide for yourself. The other really obvious one is the jet engine itself. It is about as literally "from the machine" as you can possibly get... and it solves the problem of Donnie needing to die to save the world rather neatly. Some people mistake that for the filmmakers not knowing how they could end the movie, but IMO they knew exactly what they were doing and using a Deus ex Machina ending was what they planned all along. There's probably others too that are more subtle, but it's been a while since I've seen the movie, and I think most/all of them are related to information which he got from Frank anyway. __________________

10-06-2003, 01:40 PM	#10 (permalink)
SalTheBard Registered User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Olathe, KS Posts: 174 -1 Internets	Thanks for your help Vorph..one last question and then this thread can die. Would something like....lets say....By Donnie not dying in the begining he burns down the dudes house then they find the kiddie sex torture chamber...would that be Deus Ex Machina because there is no way they would've know the kiddie sex porn dungeon would've been there unless Donnie had burned down his house. __________________ Saladas "Ranch" Dressing Just Some Bard

10-06-2003, 02:14 PM	#11 (permalink)
Baradak Registered User Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 206 -2 Internets	No, that wouldn't be an example of Deus Ex Machina. __________________ FFXI: Spheric (Taru ??/??) - Fenrir Baradak (57 GAL BRD/WHM) - Hades (lost for now) WoW: Baradak 61 Warrior - Stormrage Everquest: Baradak 71 Warrior - Prexus (Terris Thule)

10-06-2003, 03:10 PM	#13 (permalink)
Rensho Registered User Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 88 +0 Internets	You seem to want an explanation to Donnie Darko. Here is a good one - http://www.tonystuff.co.uk/darko-spoilers.htm

10-06-2003, 03:34 PM	#14 (permalink)
Schatze Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 1,444 -1 Internets	An example would be the first harry potter movie. My details might be a bit vague as I tried my best to forget them... Basically harry needs to get the philosopher stone, the evil bad valdemar guy is living inside of the wussy efeete magic instructor. Harry is trapped, and he is facing certain death from the pansy/valdemar guy, when all of a sudden, out of nowhere, it turns out that harry's touch is lethal to the valdemar dude and he saves the day! Now, if, for instance hints had been given, stuff had been alluded to in the rest of the movie, it would be fine. But all of a sudden, harry pulls a magic ability out of nowhere but his ass, and he saves the day. Another example would be Mars attacks. Big, bad aliens come down, fry the evil humans, etc. etc., we're all going to die as a race... But water ends up being able to kill them! Yay we're saved! This could go for Signs, too. Deus Ex Machina, in the original greek/latin was when a god/avatar/tool would come out of nowhere, and solve a problem or magically resolve a conflict. Today, anything that totally comes out of nowhere that provides an easy crutch that a lazy author can use to absolve him/herself of writing a tied in book tends to be deus ex machina. be it Harry suddenly developing the hands of death to totally kick ass, or the aliens being vulnerable to the most common substance on earth. Deus Ex Machina can work... But it takes a very good author/writer to pull it off. 95% of the time you'll see it, it is a sign of a weak writer. Last edited by Schatze : 10-06-2003 at 03:39 PM.

10-06-2003, 03:40 PM	#15 (permalink)
Ham n Cheese You can betray me Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Houston Posts: 8,676 +20 Internets	Wasn't Mars Attacks that awful music that killed Aliens, not water?

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