A Song of Ice and Fire (Released Spoilers)

[Faltigoth]

Originally Posted by Aulirophile

It's the giant horn in Mance's tent when Jon gets sent out to assasinate him. We actually see it from a PoV character, presumably Jon has it squirrelled away somewhere now. Or Stannis does.

Bah, shit, that's right, I forgot all about that scene. That's where I got the description from, hehe, wasn't a story, it was sitting in his damn tent.

[Khorum]

Originally Posted by Aulirophile

Where does it say that magic started coming back into the world at the beginning of the series? Others already existed, they were just buried and, possibly, fading when they got dug up. The Wildings might not have even had much trouble with them till the dragons were reborn which made them stronger because of the magic coming back. The book constantly hints that dragons are the source of magic in the world and there isn't any substantive evidence otherwise.

The Others, which hadn't been sighted in centuries, reappeared in the prologue at the beginning of the series. The Others are obviously magical, mythical creatures that even men of the Nightwatch had some difficulty believing until they confronted them. The return of the Others, and the long winter that's coming (along with the return of magic and several associated prophecies) seems to be the central sweeping arc of ASoIAF.

Yes, even the red priests of Braavos mention that their magic is returning. Yes, the return of the dragons is repeatedly hinted at as the source of resurgent magic, but the dragons came from inert fossilized eggs that were brought to life BY magic, and NOT by a trained magic user either (Dany pretty much just winged it). Before the dragons had been hatched, The Others had turned a clan of wildlings and a couple Night Watch into zombies, Drogo had been murdered by sorcery, various Starks were manifesting as changelings, and magic had turned some decorative dragon fossils into living eggs, literally an chicken-or-egg paradox in itself.

Martin has made the dragons the OBVIOUS source of magic, which is a red flag in this series, where anything obvious usually ends up on a pike and dipped in tar. The early chapter previews of ADwD even hint that the three dragons themselves aren't safe. http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php?showforum=14 These are transcripts by GRRM's readings from the next book.. the Daenerys chapter hints at one of the dragons' fate.

[Nebuchadnezzar]

Originally Posted by Faltigoth

Bah, shit, that's right, I forgot all about that scene. That's where I got the description from, hehe, wasn't a story, it was sitting in his damn tent.

Just because they THINK that is the horn, does mean it is the horn. Its not like they've used it.

[Teger]

It's pretty confirmed that it is the horn though, the reason it wasn't blown is becuase sounding it collapses the wall, and Mance didn't want to leave the North unprotected, since his 'plan' was to use his army to garrision the wall and stop the Others, IIRC.

[ChewieTobbacca]

Reading AFfC, I realized that everything has happened because of Aerys' madness. Had Rhaegar become King, nothing would have happened. I never noticed how beloved Rhaegar was until reading that chapter where Cersei sounded as though Rhaegar was a person she loved more than even Jaime, which is not easy to say.

And I must say, as each book goes by, the characters are get more and more interesting reading it from their perspective. A lot of characters I hated at the beginning (Jaime for example) have become one of the most interesting and likeable characters.

[Asmadai]

Jon and Dany are a strange case indeed if Jon is the son of Lyanna and Rhaegar. Dany is 13 in AGoT, and Jon is 14, yet she's his Auntie.

[Khorum]

Originally Posted by ChewieTobbacca

And I must say, as each book goes by, the characters are get more and more interesting reading it from their perspective. A lot of characters I hated at the beginning (Jaime for example) have become one of the most interesting and likeable characters.

Yeah, I agree about Jaime. I reserved my judgment about him, since there wasn't a LOT of detail about his personality throughout the first 2 books, but then he DID throw a child out of a 3rd-floor window LOL.

As much as Jaime has turned out to be a great character, Martin loves to turn around and make beloved characters really really despicable. I thought Theon was pretty cool at the beginning, he certainly had the marks of a Legoalas proxy with his bow, but he's become the most despised figure in the books. Same with Littlefinger, Varys and to me personally Catelyn. Face it, how much of this would've happened if Catelyn hadn't charged off and captured Tyrion?

I have a feeling a few more major characters, and even some POVs are up for a turnaround. If I had to bet, I'd bet on Cersei.

Curious thing about Bran's fall was that even CERSEI hated Jaime for throwing him out the window---she went into how they could've dealt with the kid and clued Jaime that it wasn't HER that sent the assassin later. It's so easy to hate Cersei for being the duplicitous whore that she is, but there are moments when she bones up and takes responsibility for her actions, like when Ned confronted her about her kids and she admitted it and asked Ned if he loved his children, and when she slapped Jaime around for throwing Bran out the window. I don't think she'd repent, I really doubt she's capable of regretting her decisions, but she's liable to do practically ANYTHING to protect Tommen and Myrcella now that House Lannister has noone except Kevan and Jaime to protect the children (and neither of them are too fond of Cersei).

[Faltigoth]

Its too bad that the Darkstar cut off half of Myrcella's face!

Remember the words of the witch about Cersei's kids - 'gold will be their hair, gold their shrouds' - something tells me that Tommen and Myrcella are in for some bad times coming up. Well, I guess Myrcella already has bad times, heh. And that whole bit about the Valonqar, the little brother, killing her -- Cersei is convinced its Tyrion, but I think that that little bit of prophecy refers to Jaime (who is younger than Cersei, she came out first) finally putting an end to her somewhere down the road.

And don't forget about that young Lannister that went missing during the riot in King's Landing, when the Hound saved Sansa...wouldn't surprise me at all if Varys and/or Littlefinger staged that whole bit just to capture that kid.

[Bralkan]

I want ayra to kick some ass =(

[Kuro]

Arya is set up to have a cool future, and as a likable character.

Thus, I predict she will die in an explosion of blood and gore on the first page of the next book.

[Khorum]

Originally Posted by Kuro

Arya is set up to have a cool future, and as a likable character.

Thus, I predict she will die in an explosion of blood and gore on the first page of the next book.

That's pretty much what I'm afraid of.

And while Sansa is turning out to become Littlefinger's cum-glazed bukkake princess, she'll likely learn machiavellian scheming from the master and end up being the next Cersei, only better.

[ChewieTobbacca]

Personally I feel that Arya might end up killing Alayne... only she won't realize it's her sister or something... then what happens? Who knows.

Is Rhaegar seriously the only character that everyone in the book loves (aside from those of the ironborn who seem to hate everyone on Westeros) and Aerys the one everyone hates? I mean it was strange seeing Cersei say that she would have loved to have Rhaegar's children, which hinted to me that had she actually married him, a lot of that incest would never have happened (and certainly no joffrey/myrcella/tommen).

Personally one of the more agonizing parts of AFfC was how utterly close so many characters got to change things but didn't. Sam meeting Arya but being a wuss and unable to talk about anything that might have gave a connection/memory to Arya about Jon, to Aemon not being able to travel to see the dragons (would have been interesting to see the old and new Targaryen's meet) and what not. Alas, that is the nature of these books and the next one cannot get here any sooner.

[Khorum]

Originally Posted by ChewieTobbacca

Alas, that is the nature of these books and the next one cannot get here any sooner.

I would HATE if A Dance with Dragons ends with Jon or Arya or Dany or Bran at a cliffhanger and GRRM promptly saunters off and goes touring for another 3 fucking years before the next one.

I started this series sometime last year, so the waiting quite as bad. I can't imagine what it must've been like for the people who started at release, GRRM needs dictation software so he can write on the road or something.

[Nebuchadnezzar]

Originally Posted by Khorum

I would HATE if A Dance with Dragons ends with Jon or Arya or Dany or Bran at a cliffhanger and GRRM promptly saunters off and goes touring for another 3 fucking years before the next one.

I started this series sometime last year, so the waiting quite as bad. I can't imagine what it must've been like for the people who started at release, GRRM needs dictation software so he can write on the road or something.

Well I started just when A Storm of Swords came out in hardcover back when people were just starting to whisper about Martin and it feels like a lifetime. Sometimes its hard, and A Feast for Crows getting cut in half competely sucked, but after I saw what happened with the fans and everyone complaining about Jordan and then book 10 getting released there, I refuse to complain any more about time as long as the book is worth it when it comes out.

Also, I started working on my own writing, and just thinking of the effort and time it would take to write 400k words a year...

[Faltigoth]

I started shortly after A Game of Thrones came out.

Life is pain for me. After seeing what happened to RJ, all I care about is Martin losing weight and getting in shape so he lives long enough to finish this shit, heh.