Bill Gates: The Market Drives the Wrong Science

[Taranatar]

More manhours are spent on 'awareness' bullshit for MOST problems than actually going out and spending time trying to fix them.

It's also the reason just a few liberals or conservatives can give the rest a bad name: IE: NAMBLA or the 'god hates gays' people.

They do jack shit except spout crazy damn bullshit when they could, I dunno, go build a house for homeless people or feed the hungry or something actually useful.

Bill Gates has enough money in his foundation to probably solve malaria and AIDS all by his lonesome, why is he begging for handouts?

I didn't miss the boat, I just went a step ahead of you slow thinkers as usual.

That's the problem with people, is they think any amount of money can solve any problem. In fact, money causes problems in and of itself. Keep in mind the American government has essentially limitless amounts of money but compare it on a business standpoint and it's one of the most ineffective and inefficient corporations in the world. (Other countries' governments not included)

Also remember, tons of money didn't invent the affordable car, it was the need for something that DIDN'T cost that much that drove the innovation that did.

[GrobbeeTrull2.0]

Originally Posted by MrSpitz

I research in cancer. In terms of Breast cancer now, you can study pre- or post-menopausal, either hormone dependent or hormone independent, HER2/Neu asociated, BRCA1 mutation inherited, etc. And I'm pretty sure there is another sub-type I'm forgetting, since I dont work in breast, stromal maybe which is just a hodge-podge of diseases that don't have those markers.

Some are familial, some are spontaneous, some have excellent anti-body treatment, some require hormone therapy, others don't care about hormones at all. The first sites of metastatsis differ, the gene expression patterns differ, the outcomes differ.....

So there are no similarities at all that could be applied between breast cancer and other types? I stand corrected.

[GrobbeeTrull2.0]

Originally Posted by Taranatar

More manhours are spent on 'awareness' bullshit for MOST problems than actually going out and spending time trying to fix them.

It's also the reason just a few liberals or conservatives can give the rest a bad name: IE: NAMBLA or the 'god hates gays' people.

They do jack shit except spout crazy damn bullshit when they could, I dunno, go build a house for homeless people or feed the hungry or something actually useful.

So you're claiming Bill Gates, one of the most generous philanthropists to ever grace this planet (after your Dear and Fluffy Lord and Savior Jesus Christ), has done jack shit except to spout crazy bullshit?

You're amazing.

[Braen]

Originally Posted by MrSpitz

I research in cancer. In terms of Breast cancer now, you can study pre- or post-menopausal, either hormone dependent or hormone independent, HER2/Neu asociated, BRCA1 mutation inherited, etc. And I'm pretty sure there is another sub-type I'm forgetting, since I dont work in breast, stromal maybe which is just a hodge-podge of diseases that don't have those markers.

Some are familial, some are spontaneous, some have excellent anti-body treatment, some require hormone therapy, others don't care about hormones at all. The first sites of metastatsis differ, the gene expression patterns differ, the outcomes differ.....

And that is why people in the scientific community bitch so much about the research money devoted to breast cancer. The leading cancer death cause among women is lung, I think it is almost double breast cancer, but since it doesn't receive the publicity it doesn't get the money and there is almost no cross-talk between the research paths at all. Next time you want proof, google something.

True. Why do you think there are different treatments for different cancers. Because they are caused and behave in different ways.

it's not like you have cancer and the automatic treatment is radiation/chemo. hell there are pills that work on chronic myelogenous leukemia (CML), gastrointestinal stromal tumors (GISTs). I remember reading about it having a 96% success rate a couple of years ago. now you can't give those pills to someone with breast cancer since BC has totally different characteristics and causes.

Edit: It is called Gleevec/Imatinib

[GrobbeeTrull2.0]

I admitted my lack of knowledge and corrected myself. WOAH! The point still stands; even a Capitalist should be able to see that there's something inherently misanthropic about letting the market dictate things like medicine research.

We've all seen Idiocracy, right? Satire can show us the flaws in society that we refuse to see for ourselves.

[The Ancient]

Originally Posted by Frax

Bill Gates has enough money in his foundation to probably solve malaria and AIDS all by his lonesome, why is he begging for handouts?

I didn't miss the boat, I just went a step ahead of you slow thinkers as usual.

You are either a bad troll or a complete idiot, but I'll play along this one time.

From the article:

It is one of the pet projects of the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation that announced last year it was donating £115 million to help develop a vaccine for the deadly disease.

Regarding AIDS:

HIV Research
[Gates's] foundation has donated a grand total of US$287 million to various HIV/AIDS researchers. The money was split between sixteen different research teams across the world, on the condition that they share their findings with one another.

Source: Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Gates does give a shit ton of money to combat Malaria and AIDS among other things. He also donates a lot of his time to "asking for handouts" because so far just his money isn't enough. Are you really this fucking dense? What's your core opposition here anyway, that the money is better spent on Hair Loss research?

I get now why nobody likes you.

[MrSpitz]

It would be nice if instead of spouting about malaria Bill Gates would supplement pancreatic cancer funding in THIS COUNTRY, WHERE HE MADE HIS MONEY, which is a disease that is currently pretty much a death sentence to this day and is the 4th leading cause of cancer death among both men and women.


I don't want to slight people in third world countries, but I am so sick of philantropists turning their back on the people here. What about the man who is going to die in 3 months of pancreatic cancer who is the grandson of a solider in world war II, or a steel worker, or an office worker whose family was in this country making it as great as it is for us? Doesn't that count? Don't they deserve his ear as well? Such bullshit.

[Camerous]

At least he is trying to actually do something unlike the majority of people.

[The Ancient]

Originally Posted by MrSpitz

It would be nice if instead of spouting about malaria Bill Gates would supplement pancreatic cancer funding in THIS COUNTRY, WHERE HE MADE HIS MONEY, which is a disease that is currently pretty much a death sentence to this day and is the 4th leading cause of cancer death among both men and women.


I don't want to slight people in third world countries, but I am so sick of philantropists turning their back on the people here. What about the man who is going to die in 3 months of pancreatic cancer who is the grandson of a solider in world war II, or a steel worker, or an office worker whose family was in this country making it as great as it is for us? Doesn't that count? Don't they deserve his ear as well? Such bullshit.

This is, unlike the others on this board, a legitimate gripe. However, while I don't know this for sure, I suspect that diseases that affect impoverished nations have less funding to start with so Mega Funds like Gates's focus there to plug gaps.

[aychamo_aycono]

Very good info.

Originally Posted by MrSpitz

I research in cancer. In terms of Breast cancer now, you can study pre- or post-menopausal, either hormone dependent or hormone independent, HER2/Neu asociated, BRCA1 mutation inherited, etc. And I'm pretty sure there is another sub-type I'm forgetting, since I dont work in breast, stromal maybe which is just a hodge-podge of diseases that don't have those markers.

Some are familial, some are spontaneous, some have excellent anti-body treatment, some require hormone therapy, others don't care about hormones at all. The first sites of metastatsis differ, the gene expression patterns differ, the outcomes differ.....

And that is why people in the scientific community bitch so much about the research money devoted to breast cancer. The leading cancer death cause among women is lung, I think it is almost double breast cancer, but since it doesn't receive the publicity it doesn't get the money and there is almost no cross-talk between the research paths at all. Next time you want proof, google something.

[cosmic_cs]

Science is still a male dominated field. Breast cancer affects boobs; we like boobs; therefore, we must focus on it and get the females to play along

[GrobbeeTrull2.0]

Originally Posted by MrSpitz

It would be nice if instead of spouting about malaria Bill Gates would supplement pancreatic cancer funding in THIS COUNTRY, WHERE HE MADE HIS MONEY, which is a disease that is currently pretty much a death sentence to this day and is the 4th leading cause of cancer death among both men and women.


I don't want to slight people in third world countries, but I am so sick of philantropists turning their back on the people here. What about the man who is going to die in 3 months of pancreatic cancer who is the grandson of a solider in world war II, or a steel worker, or an office worker whose family was in this country making it as great as it is for us? Doesn't that count? Don't they deserve his ear as well? Such bullshit.

Well, it's either wait for them to come around or tax them and fund the research via government NIH programs.

[MrSpitz]

NIH funding has not kept pace with inflation, and I don't think it is going to shoot up anytime soon.

But my point is not to derail the thread entirely. His comments about baldness are just assinine, it's like he is implying there are no domestic problems whatsoever that can be addressed by philanthropy, no pressing issues at all. And I think that is disgusting, I think his mindset is that since we are a rich country the money he earned in that environment is too good to be invested in causes back here, causes that don't have funding and haven't been well funded for decades, or don't have the egotistical allure of fighting the infamy of a disease like malaria.

It infuriates me, he has made billions and got thirty billion more from Buffet, who depend on people in this country for their success as much as themselves, and then make a statement like that... there's nothing I can say that wouldn't be a profanity-laced version of what I already said, but I don't understand why there is not more of a push back on his attitude.

[Clericnon2boxed]

I thought climate change would drive malaria and other african diseases into other areas. Might be a good idea (profits!!!) to have a cure when it hits western nations.

[The Ancient]

Ok so let's assume his position is that all human life is equal.
From wikipedia:

Each year, there are approximately 515 million cases of malaria, killing between one and three million people, the majority of whom are young children in Sub-Saharan Africa.

Each year in the United States, about 37,680 individuals are diagnosed with this condition and 34,290 die from the disease each year[citation needed]. In Europe more than 60,000 are diagnosed each year.

It's a numbers thing. For humanity Malaria is just a nastier diseases. They face shit over there that we just don't have to deal with. And yes, it's because of us wealthier(by comparison) people that Gates made his fortune but we have both benefited more from the products he's offered and need his donation less.