Are Republicans still a National Party? - Page 73

Camerous · 04-12-2009, 09:24 PM

lol I love watching videos about left wing nut jobs trying to defend Obama and all this spending! Keep posting the good stuff people!

Zhaun's_Shade · 04-13-2009, 12:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camerous

lol I love watching videos about left wing nut jobs trying to defend Obama and all this spending! Keep posting the good stuff people!

heelth kare, infantstructures and edjewkayshun r 4 dum cuntries!11 Usa 4 leif!

Neferata · 04-13-2009, 01:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camerous

lol I love watching videos about left wing nut jobs trying to defend Obama and all this spending! Keep posting the good stuff people!

It's not polite to masturbate in public.

Tuco · 04-13-2009, 01:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camerous

lol I love watching videos about left wing nut jobs trying to defend Obama and all this spending! Keep posting the good stuff people!

Which video did someone post about this? I seriously looked and couldn't find it.

I'm Rich Bitch · 04-13-2009, 07:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camerous

lol I love watching videos about left wing nut jobs trying to defend Obama and all this spending! Keep posting the good stuff people!

That is the problem. Since we do not have intelligent opposition to Obama, the Left is free to do whatever they want. We need to beg Republicans to get their shit together however instead of getter better, they are becoming smaller by catering to xenophobes, homophobes, and racists.

The upcoming so called tea parties will take them even lower.

JOHN TANTILLO: This Tea Party Will Be the Fad That Flopped

Quote:

I’m also concerned that the tea party will do further damage to Republicans and conservatives. I’ve written about how the Republican brand is in the marketing wilderness (see that post here).

One problem is that everyone seems to be getting too excited about not very much. From the sound of the tea party news coverage, you’d think we’re talking about millions of pieces of tea party memorabilia being snapped up by a nation on the march — I saw one commentator get enthusiastic about 50,000 views of a YouTube video on the tea party — that’s a mighty low number of views for a mass movement especially when surfing dogs can garner millions.

The Republican party is officially at it's lowest point. I do not think they can sink any lower. These Klan rallies they are holding this week may actually make them irrelevant for the foreseeable future.

TheCutlery · 04-13-2009, 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camerous

lol I love watching videos about left wing nut jobs trying to defend Obama and all this spending! Keep posting the good stuff people!

I heard a statistic last week that said that Americans that describe themselves as "Conservative" outnumber those who describe themselves as "Liberal" by a 2 to 1 margin.

If that's the case, how come every single fucking one of those "Conservatives" is unable to come up with a single substantial argument to anything? Here's pretty much every one of them, like a form letter --

"Rah rah left wing rah rah liberal rah rah Obama rah rah spending!"

Are you really all that completely inept at coming up with an original thought to explain why you oppose the current policies? And how come you never seem to have any ideas to solve problems other than saying "Well, you can't spend yer way outta a recession!"

I guess I'm confused as to why you think you have the superior viewpoint when you come up with such an inferior argument.

chaos · 04-13-2009, 07:38 AM

I describe myself as Conservative, but I mean something different by that label than what they try and make it mean on Fox news or whatever. I'd imagine it's all in the details.

I'm Rich Bitch · 04-13-2009, 07:43 AM

Conservatism means you hate minority groups, do not want to pay taxes, listen to country music, want women to get abortions in back alleys with clothes hangers, like to shoot guns, use religion to justify your claim of superiority in all situations, and are obsessed with Barak Obama and trying to damage him in any way possible.

Oh yea, you think Rush Limbaugh, Glen Beck, Sean Hannity, and Ann Coulter are legitimate political analysts and watch 4-5 hours of FOX News daily and actually believe it is "fair and balanced".

Did I mention that you do not want to pay taxes but want a powerful military that you did not pay for? That is the core foundation of conservatism. That and you do not want to pay taxes.

Sharmai · 04-13-2009, 07:51 AM

So far I've heard three main counter-solutions..........

1. Tax cut(s) - For the rich, poor, middle class or otherwise. Just tax cuts and lots of them.
This didn't work under Bush. I don't see the need to keep repeating the same behavior and expect new results.

2. Trickle down economics - Pretty much goes alone with the above except more tax cuts for businesses and the like.
This definitely did not work before and the concept that giving more money to the rich and/or businesses would increase demand, never made sense to me.

3. Full spending freeze - Just what it sounds like though partial spending freeze versions have been discussed it seems they tend to turn from spending freezes to just spending more then your freezing after short discussion.
Full spending freeze was always a bad idea and never feasible. It was purely a media gimmick to garner support for a cause. Anyone supporting a full spending freeze cannot be taken seriously.

Partial spending freezes are one of the best counter-ideas that could exist if rep/conservatives decided to get serious. The problem is they would have to get into the books and dig deeply to identify what they are going to cut/freeze and what they are going to spend on. They would have to argue for what's important and what's not on a case by case basis.

Problems like social security running out would have to be addressed and how additional spending is required or isn't. What other solutions are possible here. Problems like health care coverage. Problems with our energy concerns. Drill now may be a good sound bite but even going at full steam drilling our own shore we wouldn't even be fully supplying the American needs. Serious investment (spending) into our long term energy future has to be considered. Immediate employment problems. People need jobs and they need them sooner rather then later. Creative solutions for getting people employed within 6 months to curb this spiraling job loss problem are welcome.

And more....

If republicans/conservatives as a whole decided to get serious they could really come up with some fantastic counter ideas with that much material on the table. So what are they waiting for?

chaos · 04-13-2009, 07:57 AM

What they're waiting for is victory. It's like because they lost they've just given up on being relevant. Oh sure, they make sure to attempt a filibuster on EVERY SINGLE piece of legislation. But there is no one in the party talking about how to restructure in order to win, or draft effective legislation or compromise on policy points in order to have a wider appeal. Gingrich is one of the only leaders worth a shit, and even he is not being pragmatic. It's frustrating to watch for those who want to see a real choice in government.

I'm Rich Bitch · 04-13-2009, 07:58 AM

Conservatism is a collection of platitudes that were created in the 1960s with Barry Goldwater and brought to light during the Reagan era. Negatively against government while out of office and then use the "Borrow and Spend" technique if you ever get into office while providing tax breaks to the very wealthy.

Conservatism is a myth or theory and has no practical use in society. I enjoy watching it die.

Heylel Teomim · 04-13-2009, 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheCutlery

I heard a statistic last week that said that Americans that describe themselves as "Conservative" outnumber those who describe themselves as "Liberal" by a 2 to 1 margin.

Because it's cool. It's been cool for 8 years. Since 911 "conservative" has become a synonym for "tough guy". You're tough on terror, you're a patriot, and you believe it is everyone's individual responsibility to prosper. Those are easy ideas to get behind because in reality, they have no teeth. It's easy for a white bread college student who dislikes his professors to spout anti-intellectual drivel. It's just as easy for a 40-something business owner who has done well for himself to put a "Support Our Troops" bumper sticker on his car. Those sorts of sacrifices have no consequences, and it's easy to follow the herd.

Most of these people who consider themselves part of the "conservative" movement don't even realize their own hypocrisy. They're not really conservative, because just like the liberals that oppose them they want to change our society. Pushing for bans on abortion, crystallizing our views on gay marriage, etc. are regressive ideas, they're not conservative at all. If they were really conservative instead of trying to ban people's freedoms, they would be screaming for us to slow down. They're working just as hard to shape American society into what they want as any liberal movement, and there's very little they actually seek to conserve.

The whole conflict of ideals makes much more sense when viewed from a perspective of progressive vs. regressive policy. No one is actually looking to keep the status quo the same, and they've all got an agenda.

Mario Speedwagon · 04-13-2009, 08:16 AM

Better yet we stop labeling people with broad, bullshit terms that don't really mean much of anything and don't fully apply to anyone and just discuss issues and evaluate arguments on their merits rather than what side of the bullshit spectrum they come from.

I know, I'm crazy.

chaos · 04-13-2009, 08:17 AM

I think you're talking about the actual "Conservative" movement, and I think that people do not define it in that way. If you ask people if they want MORE government spending, almost all will say no. Is that conservatism? Or is it required to support certain issues? Everyone wants to pay less taxes, doesn't make everyone part of the "Conservative" movement but it doesn't necessarily mean they aren't conservative, according to their own definition.

I would imagine that the poll wasn't defining the term for them. CNN had a poll this year that only something like 25% of voters consider themselves Republicans, and I think it would be hard to be a member of the conservative movement without being a Republican.

Heylel Teomim · 04-13-2009, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mario Speedwagon

Better yet we stop labeling people with broad, bullshit terms that don't really mean much of anything and don't fully apply to anyone and just discuss issues and evaluate arguments on their merits rather than what side of the bullshit spectrum they come from.

I'm not labeling people, I'm labeling ideas. People are welcome to call themselves what they want, but ultimately pushing an agenda that restricts people's rights and freedoms at the expense of reinforcing the social order is regressive. There's nothing conservative about it.

And yes chaos, I was referring mostly to the conservative movement. I think a lot more people consider themselves part of that movement than you estimate. Sure, we all would love to pay fewer taxes, but more and more people these days see taxes as poor people stealing their hard earned income. They don't pay attention to the roads they drive on, the schools their kids attend, the police who (ostensibly) protect them, etc. Everyone pays for those things, and we understand why. They just don't want to pay to help their fellow man.

It's a vicious way to live. I just don't see what they're conserving.

04-12-2009, 09:24 PM	#1081 (permalink)
Camerous -internets from anon retards mean jack Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Overthere next to that place Posts: 2,720 -79 Internets	lol I love watching videos about left wing nut jobs trying to defend Obama and all this spending! Keep posting the good stuff people! __________________ Give me more -internets you little bishes!

04-13-2009, 07:43 AM	#1088 (permalink)
I'm Rich Bitch Registered User Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 5,066 -111 Internets	Conservatism means you hate minority groups, do not want to pay taxes, listen to country music, want women to get abortions in back alleys with clothes hangers, like to shoot guns, use religion to justify your claim of superiority in all situations, and are obsessed with Barak Obama and trying to damage him in any way possible. Oh yea, you think Rush Limbaugh, Glen Beck, Sean Hannity, and Ann Coulter are legitimate political analysts and watch 4-5 hours of FOX News daily and actually believe it is "fair and balanced". Did I mention that you do not want to pay taxes but want a powerful military that you did not pay for? That is the core foundation of conservatism. That and you do not want to pay taxes. Last edited by I'm Rich Bitch; 04-13-2009 at 07:49 AM..

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04-13-2009, 07:38 AM	#1087 (permalink)
chaos Registered User Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: NoVa Posts: 7,162 +29 Internets	I describe myself as Conservative, but I mean something different by that label than what they try and make it mean on Fox news or whatever. I'd imagine it's all in the details.

04-13-2009, 07:57 AM	#1090 (permalink)
chaos Registered User Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: NoVa Posts: 7,162 +29 Internets	What they're waiting for is victory. It's like because they lost they've just given up on being relevant. Oh sure, they make sure to attempt a filibuster on EVERY SINGLE piece of legislation. But there is no one in the party talking about how to restructure in order to win, or draft effective legislation or compromise on policy points in order to have a wider appeal. Gingrich is one of the only leaders worth a shit, and even he is not being pragmatic. It's frustrating to watch for those who want to see a real choice in government.

04-13-2009, 07:58 AM	#1091 (permalink)
I'm Rich Bitch Registered User Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 5,066 -111 Internets	Conservatism is a collection of platitudes that were created in the 1960s with Barry Goldwater and brought to light during the Reagan era. Negatively against government while out of office and then use the "Borrow and Spend" technique if you ever get into office while providing tax breaks to the very wealthy. Conservatism is a myth or theory and has no practical use in society. I enjoy watching it die.

04-13-2009, 08:16 AM	#1093 (permalink)
Mario Speedwagon Registered User Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: 3rd Place Posts: 2,124 -47 Internets	Better yet we stop labeling people with broad, bullshit terms that don't really mean much of anything and don't fully apply to anyone and just discuss issues and evaluate arguments on their merits rather than what side of the bullshit spectrum they come from. I know, I'm crazy.

04-13-2009, 08:17 AM	#1094 (permalink)
chaos Registered User Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: NoVa Posts: 7,162 +29 Internets	I think you're talking about the actual "Conservative" movement, and I think that people do not define it in that way. If you ask people if they want MORE government spending, almost all will say no. Is that conservatism? Or is it required to support certain issues? Everyone wants to pay less taxes, doesn't make everyone part of the "Conservative" movement but it doesn't necessarily mean they aren't conservative, according to their own definition. I would imagine that the poll wasn't defining the term for them. CNN had a poll this year that only something like 25% of voters consider themselves Republicans, and I think it would be hard to be a member of the conservative movement without being a Republican.