Help with Business School, Careers in Finance, etc.

[Talineth]

I graduated a few years ago with a degree in Computer Information Systems with a minor in Business Administration. I'm thinking about going back for my MBA. Do I have to go back for an undergraduate degree with all of the regular freshman or does my degree make me any more qualified in any way?

Anything else I should consider?

[Tyreny]

MBA = Graduate School for business. Most people who get MBA's, at least at top tier schools, did not major in business undergrad. The short answer to your first question is no you don't go back in with the freshman.

There is a lot to consider about getting an MBA,or going back to school in general. Without knowing more about your situation it's hard for me to say what exactly would be the most important factors for you specifically.

[Jack Burton]

I'm interested in anyone's perspective on the following program: Online MS in Global Supply Chain Management

It's offered by Indiana University through the Kelley School of Business. It's concise, reasonably priced at around $30k, and tied to Kelley b-school, which is decently ranked. I don't currently work in supply chain but developed an interest while studying industrial engineering @ the undergrad level. Perks are that my company will cover a good chunk of cost, and I can probably leverage a master's degree into a decent raise. And having a graduate degree can't hurt me moving forward in my career.

I'm open to any disucssion on non-mba (but related) grad degrees such as supply chain, finance, etc. Kelley is one of the few decent b-schools out there offering an online MBA, which is also an option. I think I could fight my way into a top tier b-school 3-5 years down the road if I wanted to (only 3 months post-undergrad work experience right now) but the true cost of those $45k/year tuition, tier 1 b-schools is scary to me. Potentially $100k of debt plus the opportunity cost is rough. Anyway, thanks for any insight.

[Lyrical]

Originally Posted by Jack Burton

I'm interested in anyone's perspective on the following program: Online MS in Global Supply Chain Management

It's offered by Indiana University through the Kelley School of Business. It's concise, reasonably priced at around $30k, and tied to Kelley b-school, which is decently ranked. I don't currently work in supply chain but developed an interest while studying industrial engineering @ the undergrad level. Perks are that my company will cover a good chunk of cost, and I can probably leverage a master's degree into a decent raise. And having a graduate degree can't hurt me moving forward in my career.

I'm open to any disucssion on non-mba (but related) grad degrees such as supply chain, finance, etc. Kelley is one of the few decent b-schools out there offering an online MBA, which is also an option. I think I could fight my way into a top tier b-school 3-5 years down the road if I wanted to (only 3 months post-undergrad work experience right now) but the true cost of those $45k/year tuition, tier 1 b-schools is scary to me. Potentially $100k of debt plus the opportunity cost is rough. Anyway, thanks for any insight.

I guess it all depends on how decent a raise it is, and what kind of ROI you will get from the program. Another consideration for me was the atmosphere of the company - in the company I worked for, you weren't going to make it into upper management without an MBA. It was a requirement. You could spend 30 years looking at the glass ceiling and never break it without an MBA. So it wasn't just the ROI I looked at, it was the potential to be stuck in the same job for a looooooong time.

Is your employer telling you that getting a grad degree in supply chain is going to open up other interesting assignments? Also, you may not want to hear this, but some of my classmates had multiple graduate degrees (BS in engineering, master's in engineering, and then the MBA). A guy in my study group had three master's before he hit his MBA. He really pissed me off - he worked less than everyone else, and yet broke the curve repeatedly.

[Jack Burton]

Lyrical - thanks for your response. Regarding a glass ceiling @ the MBA level for my current company, I don't believe that exists. But as I said, I have only been here about 3 months. I know that an MBA would be a definite bonus. Upon further research, I'm more and more attracted to the MS in Global Supply Chain Management that I mentioned. The online MBA @ IU is another option @ 51 credit hours. The dual degree program (Supply Chain + MBA) exists and is achieved @ 63 credit hours. The boon is that the supply chain degree can be completed in about a year and all of those credits can be applied to the MBA. So another year or year and a half and the MBA can be completed. There's greater flexibility available if the dual degree program is pursued. Complete the supply chain master's, take a year break if desired, change companies if wanted, complete the MBA when convenient.

If the dual degree is pursued, one would have to complete the MBA within five years of staring the MS Global Supply Chain Management. I think it offers great career flexibility and good learning opportunity. As an industrial engineering student @ the undergrad level, I would like to expand my accounting/finance level knowledge and those classes are required early on during the supply chain degree. And the only time constraint is the 5 year dual degree completion requirement. I could have 2 solid years of work experience and a master's degree in supply chain management @ the age of 25, which I think is a solid foundation. Couple few, years after that and I could have the MBA completed. It's a somewhat non-traditional strategy (I think?) but it sounds pretty good if I can execute. Just wanted to hear some potentially argumentative viewpoints if I'm being overly optimistic.

[Lyrical]

I'd steer clear of an online degree, especially an online MBA. It isn't nearly as marketable as a full time degree, part time degree (night classes), or even Exec Ed.

[prescient63]

Well I'll be trying out the Knewton test prep and let you guys all know how it goes. It's 45 hours of online class time + a specialized syllabus to focus on weak areas + 300 videos + 3400 practice questions. They hired the guys who designed the gmat to make their CATs. If i don't go up 50 points after following the syllabus I get my money back which is pretty sick. Should put me mid 700ish or I get my cash back. Win / Win!

I like the idea that the test prep is supposed to be adaptive so that I don't spend time covering shit I kick ass at (all things verbal).

Classes start next week so I'll keep you all updated!

I forgot $690 which isn't too bad if they get me to 740/750.

[Snagglepuss]

Originally Posted by prescient63

Well I'll be trying out the Knewton test prep and let you guys all know how it goes. It's 45 hours of online class time + a specialized syllabus to focus on weak areas + 300 hours of video + 3400 practice questions. They hired the guys who designed the gmat to make their CATs. If i don't go up 50 points after following the syllabus I get my money back which is pretty sick. Should put me mid 700ish or I get my cash back. Win / Win!

I like the idea that the test prep is supposed to be adaptive so that I don't spend time covering shit I kick ass at (all things verbal).

Classes start next week so I'll keep you all updated!

I forgot $690 which isn't too bad if they get me to 740/750.

what were you before?

[prescient63]

Originally Posted by Snagglepuss

what were you before?

690 but I feel my lowish quant is really going to kill me (which I don't understand because I've had an A in every math class I've ever taken) so I need to get it up there for the program I really want (Carnegie Mellon). Plus Carnegie's average score is 696 or something. If I had to guess I'm getting killed on number theory and word problems. Seriously fuck number theory.

While I'm at it I like watching this guys instruction on how to do problems YouTube - gmat's Channel

[r3probate]

If you're only at 690, but the quant is raping you, you're probably not missing on the number theory, combo/permutation questions, because you won't even see them until you're pushing a higher Q level - like, Q48/Q49. I scored a Q49 (one more point and I would've had a 99th percentile score overall ) and only had one permutation question on the exam, and it was a straightforward one similar to this: how many possible combinations on a suitcase lock with N tumblers.

[prescient63]

Originally Posted by r3probate

If you're only at 690, but the quant is raping you, you're probably not missing on the number theory, combo/permutation questions, because you won't even see them until you're pushing a higher Q level - like, Q48/Q49. I scored a Q49 (one more point and I would've had a 99th percentile score overall ) and only had one permutation question on the exam, and it was a straightforward one similar to this: how many possible combinations on a suitcase lock with N tumblers.

I would have to find a sample question but its more retarded stuff that falls into the number theory category according to the manhattan gmat books. I would honestly kill to have questions like that all day long.

[r3probate]

Yeah, I was totally expecting a harder permutation question like one of the typical: you have 12 jackasses to put on a committee, 3 are republicans, 3 are democrats, 6 are independents... how likely is it that you'll end up with 2 of each party, or something like that off the top of my head. When I got it on the test I thought it was a trick question it was so easy.

[prescient63]

Just finished the first practice test. The test seemed easier than the GMAT as I scored a 740(V45, Q47). I had previously scored 710 on the practice test that MBA.com provides which should be equivalent to the real test. The run down at the end of the test seems very cool. Every question is categorized along with how much time you spent answering the question. Click on a wrong or right answer and an explanation pops up along with the original question. Click on the category that the question relates to and a new web page pops up with a concept video relating to that category along with a write up relating to that concept.

So why is this cool? I can see exactly where I lose time and what categories of questions trip me up. Additionally, you are provided with a Concept Queue. The queue builds up as you get problems wrong. Go to your concept queue and you can review the concepts contained therein. As you get better at concepts and get more questions correct they come out of your concept queue. To take it a little farther you can go to a progress page and it lists all of the concepts they have decided are important and your relative mastery over those concepts. Very cool way to attack the test IMHO.

I also watched an archive of the first lesson and it seemed pretty decent but I really can't wait to get into something a little bit meatier. It was mostly about what to expect in grad school, but they did have some interesting statistics regarding GMAT scores and pay, and the curvilinear relationship between school ranking and pay.

Overall I'm very impressed with this product so far.

For anyone who struggles with the verbal sections of reading comprehension and critical reasoning I would suggest getting the Powerscore LSAT books (not logic games obviously) as the comparative GMAT sections seem like cake compared to the LSAT.

Edit: I sound like a shill but so far I really like it. I'll let you know how it progresses and if i find anything i hate.

[prescient63]

First class down and the instruction is excellent. The instructors move very quickly and the material is pretty dense, but that is fine because there are archives of all of the classes. One thing I do like is that when they give you question is that they time it at either 1:30 or 2min to sort of simulate the actual time that you will have to answer on the test. It is definitely going to be worth my $700. So many things I learned in the first class that was at a remedial level to save tons of time on the GMAT. They are things that I should have known (relating to math as I have very little work to do on verbal). For my own personal use this is turning out to be better than a class in person and I've take quite a few college classes online so I do have a baseline to compare it to.

I know I'm turning this thread into my own personal blog regarding this class but I kind of figure it may be useful to some and everyone else can ignore me!

I should point out that the class slides are there for download as well so that you can go back and work through it or make mental notes of what was taught and what you should be learning / memorizing.

[Gauss]

Is it even important to score higher on the GMAT than what you're roughly scoring now? I know when I was applying to grad school that the GRE was a very small component of the whole package: if you got above say a 750 on the math part (engineering school; like 50% of grad school applicants will score this), they would look at your application further. Just looking at this website (no clue how credible it is) Average GMAT Scores of Top Universities (2008) | MBA, GMAT, College, Rankings you're above average for even the #1 school. Why bother to try to raise it more?

I don't know how business school admissions work, but it just seems like they might give a shit more about your employment history and performance there than some test.