Obama vs. McCain II

[Requiem]

Originally Posted by Sharmai

Well the voting booth reminds me of the internet.

That's a very good point.

[Bristlebane]

Originally Posted by Sharmai

No. Your right. People do laugh at some pretty raunchy things but don't practice it in general. The thing is though the internet kind of represents a place where you can be "you". In real life you don't see someone use the term nigger regularly because there are immediate and real consequences if your not sure who your around. In real life you don't pull out a pedo bear photo with a half naked kid running around and grab some random stranger and say "Hey isn't this funny??". You don't make faggot jokes mid conversation with a stranger because its funny in the real world because there are consequences. In real life your "checked" so you have to watch what you say and who you say it to. Better yet just don't say it at all.

Well the voting booth reminds me of the internet. In there no one can check you. No one knows who you vote for. No one knows how you really feel or think. In that voting booth if you think blacks are pieces of crap and whites should enslave them all whose going to stop you from putting KKK for president?

It's like one of those psychology things. You laugh about it sure its funny but what does it really mean about you? Take a person like Khorum. In the books forum he can be perfectly civil and discuss books like anyone I would consider normal. Put him in here and there will be enough racism to to fuel a klan fest. Hes an extreme example yet how many people are out there are racist leaners? How many make jokes and laugh yet actually take into account his being black or him having a muslim name?

Further how many people have been brainwashed by all those who are just joking around them? How many people are going to vote like the joke?

I understand what Requiem said too, but you made a good point. Picture the most liberal person you know, and given an anonymous venue and a bad mood, and maybe a run in with an unwholesome character, and they'll call a black guy a nigger, or a hispanic guy a spic, or what have you.

This isn't just white people of course, it can go either way.

Racism will NEVER go anywhere as long as there are different races. Humans will ALWAYS find something to hate as long as SOMETHING is different. If it isn't race, it's religion, social status, or what have you.

People who might not show a moment of racism to anyone publicly in their entire life can get on the internet and say seemingly racist things. At the same time, in real life, they'd be just as willing to help a black guy dying on the ground as they would a white guy.

Actions, ultimately, are what really count.

It's been proven time and time again that when given a completely anonymous venue, like, say, Youtube comments, people will say outrageous things. Look at virtually ANY video of a black guy doing ANYTHING on Youtube, and you see hundreds of thousands of people saying nigger this or nigger that. And they're not saying it in some kind of cutesy, fad way. There's a difference between two white kids saying "Nigga please" to each other, and someone saying "Look at the stupid nigger in that video." Are the people saying those kind of things all KKK members and extremist whackjobs? No, they're not. They're students, blue collar workers, white collar workers, and everyone else.

A messageboard like this is a semi-anonymous venue, because we build personas here. We don't want to sully our "good name" by saying outrageous things. It's anonymous, but we're accountable here on a certain level.

People always break down to a sub-atomic level on purely anonymous venues.

[Sharmai]

Originally Posted by Bristlebane

More Smart Stuff

And your right to. Actions do speak louder then words. At first glance I thought that to and even though people might say one thing they would still act in a better manner. Then it occurred to me that this race is still close. That all the polls constantly show this race is still close. Now given the nature of this election I expect more then a few polls to be wildly off base but with so many polls out there and the democrats really having the perfect storm of a winning situation I would have still thought Obama should be running away with it.

But its still close. We just went through 8 years of hell, the economy's bad, 1000 home foreclosures a day, soldiers dying in a war we shouldn't be in, and yet Obama is just slightly ahead?

Roughly 80% of the country is leaning towards democrats and their views at the moment yet nearly all the polls out there have this thing at a 55/45 tie. Something is causing 20-30% of people out there who are pissed off with republicans to still not vote democrat. It could be that McCain is a great candidate but compared to how Obama has run his campaign? McCain's numerous gaffs? Obama's press coverage?

I think there's a solid 10-20% voting for McCain because they believe hes the better guy but that theres another 25% or so voting for him because Obama is black or has a Muslim name.

[Frax]

Originally Posted by Sharmai

And your right to. Actions do speak louder then words. At first glance I thought that to and even though people might say one thing they would still act in a better manner. Then it occurred to me that this race is still close. That all the polls constantly show this race is still close. Now given the nature of this election I expect more then a few polls to be wildly off base but with so many polls out there and the democrats really having the perfect storm of a winning situation I would have still thought Obama should be running away with it.

But its still close. We just went through 8 years of hell, the economy's bad, 1000 home foreclosures a day, soldiers dying in a war we shouldn't be in, and yet Obama is just slightly ahead?

Roughly 80% of the country is leaning towards democrats and their views at the moment yet nearly all the polls out there have this thing at a 55/45 tie. Something is causing 20-30% of people out there who are pissed off with republicans to still not vote democrat. It could be that McCain is a great candidate but compared to how Obama has run his campaign? McCain's numerous gaffs? Obama's press coverage?

I think there's a solid 10-20% voting for McCain because they believe hes the better guy but that theres another 25% or so voting for him because Obama is black or has a Muslim name.

Just because he has a slick campaign and says "hope" and "change" every other sentence doesn't make Obama a good candidate for president. His ideas on foreign policy and national defense are, to say the least, pretty scary in this day and age. Add to that he has absolutely zero track record on anything, no leadership experience, and he's a minority candidate? He's the one with the uphill battle, no matter what polls the liberal media spins.

[Sharmai]

Originally Posted by Frax

Just because he has a slick campaign and says "hope" and "change" every other sentence doesn't make Obama a good candidate for president. His ideas on foreign policy and national defense are, to say the least, pretty scary in this day and age. Add to that he has absolutely zero track record on anything, no leadership experience, and he's a minority candidate? He's the one with the uphill battle, no matter what polls the liberal media spins.

Like I said there's a solid 10-20% who believe McCain's a better candidate like you, no offense. There are a lot of people and experts who will agree and disagree with you. The thing is though, the largest chunk of people will swing with the momentum of the crowd. Right now that's overwhelming on the democratic side (80% of the country doesn't like Bush and blames it on republicans according to some CNN poll). 10-20% are solid Bush supporters(Likely McCain supporters also) another 10% are solid McCain supporters. I.E. people who support McCain because they believe he is better and do not go with the general flow of the crowd.

That still leaves a nice margin of 70% for Obama and his solid supporters plus people who go with the momentum (the majority of people). The thing is when you might expect Obama to be polling at 60-70% hes polling at 55/45.

Further look at the recent awesome press coverage of his overseas trip.. Not much change in the polls. Look at polls over time and they all seem to hover around 55/45. The only time the polls seem to change is when Obama makes a mistake or a big gaff like Wright pops up. The polls never seem to change based on anything McCain does or says yet Obama's slightest error causes the polls to hop up and down 5-10 points.

So I think what could kept a good 20% of people from going with the crowd like they always do? Race.

[Frax]

Where do you get that 80% are for obama figure?

[Requiem]

Originally Posted by Frax

Just because he has a slick campaign and says "hope" and "change" every other sentence doesn't make Obama a good candidate for president. His ideas on foreign policy and national defense are, to say the least, pretty scary in this day and age. Add to that he has absolutely zero track record on anything, no leadership experience, and he's a minority candidate? He's the one with the uphill battle, no matter what polls the liberal media spins.

I agree on the point of national defense. My Obamamania was shaken almost to the point of break after I saw this youtube clip back when it was still between Hillary and Obama:



Why? I could try to justify it with rhetoric about impending doom and national defense but honestly I think it just boils down to the fact that I like the idea of the USA being able to protect itself from nukes and having the future weapons systems on the ground and in the air to keep things relatively surgical. Nobody wins in an evenly matched conflict. Take Desert Storm for example, how many Iraqi lives were saved because they surrendered in the face of such an imposing enemy or because their war machines were destroyed before they could even man them? Even the losers win, in relative terms. I don't necessarily advocate war, but I don't have any control over whether we go to war or not and it seems to be the new cool thing to do so I have no reason to believe that it won't continue to happen.

Also that I like having the biggest dick. Even though I as an individual have absolutely nothing to do with it.

[GrobbeeTrull2.0]

Reqiuem just justified the usage of the words "faggot" and "nigger" as exceptable? That's awesome--in the sad and depressing way.

Originally Posted by Requiem

It's more about the taboo aspect of it, and let's face it, it's a pretty great word, connotations aside.

Connotations aside? I wasn't aware that "nigger" had any other definition than: racial slur for African-American. Connotation?? There's no connotation, it's built in to the fucking definition.

Disgusting.

[Sharmai]

Originally Posted by Frax

Where do you get that 80% are for obama figure?

What 80%? Where?

[Ancalagon]

Originally Posted by GrobbeeTrull2.0

Reqiuem just justified the usage of the words "faggot" and "nigger" as exceptable? That's awesome--in the sad and depressing way.



Connotations aside? I wasn't aware that "nigger" had any other definition than: racial slur for African-American. Connotation?? There's no connotation, it's built in to the fucking definition.

Disgusting.

Stop being an overly-sensitive moron. As has been mentioned, every reference to someone as a 'faggot' is not by way of commenting on their sexual proclivities; usually it just means they're doing something lame. Every reference to someone as a jew is not by way of commenting on their religion; usually it just means they're being stingy. Likewise, every reference to someone as a nigger is not by way of commenting on their race; usually it's just an even 'trendier' way of calling them the abovementioned 'faggot.'

This is not to say the use of such words is praiseworthy. They are not. However, it's depressing, as you say, that you can't bring yourself to realize that few people who use such words do so with malice toward other races/religions/etc. in mind.

[Requiem]

Originally Posted by GrobbeeTrull2.0

Reqiuem just justified the usage of the words "faggot" and "nigger" as exceptable? That's awesome--in the sad and depressing way.



Connotations aside? I wasn't aware that "nigger" had any other definition than: racial slur for African-American. Connotation?? There's no connotation, it's built in to the fucking definition.

Disgusting.

I'd elaborate on what I said since you obviously took it wrong, but I don't believe that you're stupid enough to not get what I was saying. The very next sentence qualifies the statement.

I see now. You're one of those people that looks for reasons to be offended. It must be frustrating to go through life like that.

[Tuco]

Originally Posted by Sharmai

We just went through 8 years of hell

If you call the last eight years of US life 'hell', you'll never be happy. The last eight years has been exceptionally pleasant in relation to humanity.

We can do better, of course, but it wasn't hell.

[Requiem]

Originally Posted by Tuco

If you call the last eight years of US life 'hell', you'll never be happy. The last eight years has been exceptionally pleasant in relation to humanity.

We can do better, of course, but it wasn't hell.

I was just watching TV and a weight loss commercial came on. It occurred to me how fucked up it is that these commercials run all day long on pretty much every channel in the USA while people starve all over the place. They have a starvation epidemic while we have an obesity epidemic. Now, don't mistake this for some kind of bleeding heart bullshit or even a call to action. I actually found it kind of comical. Does that make me a horrible person?

[Soriak]

Obesity isn't a sign of too much food, it's a sign of eating unhealthy food.

[GrobbeeTrull2.0]

The offense comes when people who are obviously intelligent continue to use and justify words that are meant to offend people anonymously just because they can. Where is the impetus? You wouldn't call a black person a nigger to their face, so why would you do it on here?

I'm especially offended that someone who represents themselves such as you, and is openly affiliated with a business or game project would defend the use of racial and sexual orientation slurs in public. That's probably legally risky.

Trust me, I got what you were saying. But you didn't get what I'm saying--there's no reason to use those words, at all. And the fact that you defend their use, and even call them "good words to use" is what's disgusting. People should hold themselves to higher standards, especially when claiming superiority of any kind.