Water Powered Car - thank you Japan!

[Zarcath]

Bottled water is expensive enough already.

[voodoochile78]

Originally Posted by Lyrical

That sounds great. Wait a minute, I live in Atlanta and we are almost out of water (drought). Maybe we better stick with gas

The article said you could use salt water. Too bad Georgia doesn't border a massive pool of salt water...

[Hachima]

The problem I see is whether or not these can be used as an alternative on a large scale. If everyone is trying to power their car by electricity, what type of infrastructure needs to be created to supply that much electricity.

Heck in the summer on a hot day, power companies can't even support people turning on their air conditioners without brownouts in some areas.

[Phelps]

Useless. First of all, you have to put energy in; electricity is likely the method of seperation for the hydrogen and oxygen.

Second Law of Thermodynaimics states that this system will require an energy input.

Secondly, bottled water is more expensive than gasoline. Do you really want to try and run your vehicle that expends water on tap water? Fresh water does not mean no salt, it means below 5% salt by weight. If you want to go out and buy a new system for every few gallons you use, which will cost you hundreds of dollars, this is the car for you.

[Bristlebane]

A tubgirl powered car would be more feasible than this, literally.

[Aetos]

Originally Posted by Hachima

The problem I see is whether or not these can be used as an alternative on a large scale. If everyone is trying to power their car by electricity, what type of infrastructure needs to be created to supply that much electricity.

Heck in the summer on a hot day, power companies can't even support people turning on their air conditioners without brownouts in some areas.

But a market for an alternative fuel has been created, HHO. What if people decide to obtain HHO through some other way, like say a solar powered stirling engine that just chugs away all day long separating water for you. Areas that get lots of sunlight would have no problem creating enough of it for them

[Gauss]

Originally Posted by Lucane Darkseraphim

Physics doesn't work like that. It takes more energy to split the water than you can get from the products. Using the products to both move your car and recharge the battery will not work.

Don't even bother. There's zero reason to make a car that runs off water, end of story. Whatever energy source you use to split water will be better used to actually power the damned thing.

[Khorum]

Well, there's net EROI metrics that show how electric/electrolytic plants like those cars show an overall harm to power efficiency. But the argument tends to be skewed for existing economies (where COAL of all things proves to be the most cost-efficient).

But net EROI can be misleading because there just isnt a lot of nuclear sources in most power grids, which would tilt the balance to a more centralised model.

Keep in mind that this is all moot once Nanosolar's "sprayable" solar cell enters mass production. The technology (heavily venture financed so you'll probably see a IP-licensing model instead of a single-source) will enable manufacturers, home builders, car makers, basically ANYONE to "spray" on nanosolar panels which are a little less efficient than current photovoltaics but are so cheap that the costs to convert a single family home to solar is estimated at less than one month's utility costs.

That National Geographic article was from 2005, Nanosolar has been in production of a very low-cost solar "tape" since 2007 and will soon be prototyping their spray cells. As of today Nanosolar panels have finally beaten the cost/watt value of Coal, the ONLY mass-produced source to have ever done so.

[Kuriin]

Did no one read the second article? It says any kind of water can be usable, not just bottled. It even says SEA water works.

[Arbitrary]

Originally Posted by Gauss

Don't even bother. There's zero reason to make a car that runs off water, end of story. Whatever energy source you use to split water will be better used to actually power the damned thing.

End of story nothing.

It isn't energy that is the issue, it is energy storage. If building more power plants allowed people to use electricity as car power that would be great but the batteries able to serve that function are extremely expensive and potentially hazardous.

Even if the conversation rate blows what we need is a means to power vehicles through domestic production. A means to transfer electricity into car fuel is instantly interesting because we can generate surplus power. We cannot generate surplus oil.

[dak]

Don't even bother. There's zero reason to make a car that runs off water, end of story. Whatever energy source you use to split water will be better used to actually power the damned thing.

The limiting factor behind electrical cars using a battery as a transport medium weighs down the car and cutting down on efficiency. By using hydrogen electrolysis you get a non-toxic energy transfer medium that is very light in weight.

Conversion rates with on industrial electrolyzers averages out to around 75% efficency.

[Arbitrary]

That's what I said but cooler.

[Astrocreep]

It can be tough to start a car in the dead of winter sub zero temps with a gas engine. how the hell can i start up my water car if the fuel is a block of ice? call in work and say i will be in at the start of the spring thaw?

[GrobbeeTrull2.0]

I think I'd be willing to accept sea water and a loss of efficiency for non-dependence on oil.

[Kaio]

God damnit, the electrolysing doesn't happen while driving. It happens when you're "charging" the vehicle so you won't really been doing it unless you're home. Your car isn't really running on the goddamn water as people have pointed out.

It's probably going to run a hydrogen combustion engine or a hydrogen fuel cell.

With that said, electric prices are far cheaper then gasoline. Most pure electric cars seem to cost 1/5th or less per mile. So even if this process uses more energy then gasoline combustion engines (which have a pretty low energy efficiency) it may still cost less.

The ONLY reason this could be practical is for storage reasons. This is not a method of energy generation but storage. It's benefit is that a tank is far cheaper then even a nimh battery (2-3k for a prius) and li-ion battery with this much energy potential is probably going to be 10x that amount. The chevy volt's 40 mile range battery (don't remember the kw/h's it holds) costs more then 20k for reference.

Edit: I just read the second article, it's written poorly and probably inaccurately. They seem to always fuck up tech article because they don't know what questions they need to ask.