Parking Lots - The new low income housing?

[Arbitrary]

It's a Radical Edward quote from Cowboy Bebop.

I like absurdisms~

[Chips]

Ive never seen homeless in a parking lot in Georgia.

[Abysmal]

Originally Posted by Fammaden

Stuff like that already exists in various incarnations. Haven't you ever heard "You can lead a horse to water...."?

it does already exist in many places, but i think by the time you're in prison it's too late for many. that, and i think the prison environment alone prevents rehabilitation. one needs to "escape" from other fuck ups in order to become rehabilitated. criminals need to be integrated into a healthy environment with non-criminals. if you pack them all together, how is this any different from the outside? for the people there, i'm sure it feels largely the same: really fucking shitty.

i equate this to quitting smoking. when you're surrounded by friends that smoke it becomes nearly impossible to quit because they're all going outside every 5 minutes. naturally you go out with them having the intention to socialize and not be excluded, but you can almost count on one of them offering you a cigarette or eventually breaking down yourself and asking for one.

edit:

just for clarity, no, i'm not suggesting fucked up murderers/rapists/child molesters be thrown in with normal people, but there are just fucking oodles of people in prison for non-scary or bullshit crimes that i think can be thrown in with normal people.

[Aegdaien]

Originally Posted by xilsharn

Every time I see your sig, all I can think about is... don't you have a young daughter?

You're thinking of guanna probably, who is equally retarded.

[Tolanin]

not counting discouraged workers is a tough one, i dont think its a huge number of people though and it does get offset somewhat by encouraged workers who join back up into the work forces when the economy is good and everyone is hiring. I dont think the calculations we use for unemployment are that bad or very far off... its such a hard thing to calculate.

[Fammaden]

Originally Posted by Abysmal

just for clarity, no, i'm not suggesting fucked up murderers/rapists/child molesters be thrown in with normal people, but there are just fucking oodles of people in prison for non-scary or bullshit crimes that i think can be thrown in with normal people.

This kind of thing comes up all the time in these threads. If someone has some nationwide stats to refute, then great. But I have to contend that to end up in serious prison environments, the whole "minor crime" stuff gets greatly exaggerated. To get a real prison sentence it usually has to be a pretty serious felony, violent crime, sex offense, etc. OR, you have a significant record already so you are getting fucked by being a constant thorn in the side of the law. College kids possessing drugs with a nice family, light to no record and ability to retain a decent lawyer, for example, are going to tend to get short local sentences at worst. Usually more like probation, which tons more people get than actual time. They just aren't getting sent to assrape warehouses on the whole. Tons of lesser offenses stem from plea agreements and the person gets a chance to show they can turn it around and not do it again, so even for serious charges you can get leniency if you aren't clearly a die hard criminal. And we don't really have institutions for serious crime and separate ones for lesser crimes. Different security levels in prison and local vs. state/federal incarceration sure. But there really isn't a normal person prison and a hardcore prison. Lots of the people in lighter prison security levels end up there after having served time at a higher level as well.

[Gryeyes]

Originally Posted by Fammaden

This kind of thing comes up all the time in these threads. If someone has some nationwide stats to refute, then great. But I have to contend that to end up in serious prison environments, the whole "minor crime" stuff gets greatly exaggerated. To get a real prison sentence it usually has to be a pretty serious felony, violent crime, sex offense, etc. OR, you have a significant record already so you are getting fucked by being a constant thorn in the side of the law. College kids possessing drugs with a nice family, light to no record and ability to retain a decent lawyer, for example, are going to tend to get short local sentences at worst. Usually more like probation, which tons more people get than actual time. They just aren't getting sent to assrape warehouses on the whole. Tons of lesser offenses stem from plea agreements and the person gets a chance to show they can turn it around and not do it again, so even for serious charges you can get leniency if you aren't clearly a die hard criminal. And we don't really have institutions for serious crime and separate ones for lesser crimes. Different security levels in prison and local vs. state/federal incarceration sure. But there really isn't a normal person prison and a hardcore prison. Lots of the people in lighter prison security levels end up there after having served time at a higher level as well.

Never been in a fight? Purchased or sold and illicit substance? Drove while intoxicated? Any of the above can get you sent to an assraping warehouse. All it takes is a judge having a pissy day. Or a prosecutor knowing they can get a conviction.Id be willing to assume most people at some point in their life times do something that in fucked circumstances can get them locked up for years. But yes upper class white students with money to spend in a lawyer are going to receive lesser sentences. Many none trash people don't qualify for that layer of legal "protection".

The distance between a misdemeanor with some community service and ass rape central is not nearly as wide as you assume. And there are prisons specifically for super criminals. Well at least on most states. For serious gang affiliations etc.

[Aamina]

Originally Posted by Gryeyes

Never been in a fight? Purchased or sold and illicit substance? Drove while intoxicated? Any of the above can get you sent to an assraping warehouse. All it takes is you doing any of those stupid things I just listed, so just don't do them so no one can bitch about "rich white people" when I and everyone else knows that anyone who is rich would hire a good lawyer in an adversarial system regardless of race.

Anyway, I fixed it for you.

[Darus Grey]

As someone who has purposely employed dozens of ex-cons over the past 10yrs I've only had two bad experiences of the lot.

The general thing I've learned is crime is motivated.

People who can maintain a descent quality of life without it, tend to not commit crimes(least until you swing to the other end of the scale into white collar crimes).

This may seem "DUH" but it's such a simple truth we as a society seem to ignore.

Our justice system is based on the concept of rehabilitation but in reality it's meant to segregate you from society for the rest of your life.

Short version of my normal justice system rant ;0.

[Gryeyes]

Originally Posted by Aamina

Anyway, I fixed it for you.

I dont think fixed means what you think it does. Or did you intentionally try to just spew random bullshit with no coherent meaning or relation to the topic?

[Khorum]

Originally Posted by Quineloe

Just put them in prison, plenty of room there still and then they wouldn't even be homeless again! Problem solved too!

We only put black people in prison Quin. And there's only room in there for more black people.

[Abysmal]

Originally Posted by Fammaden

This kind of thing comes up all the time in these threads. If someone has some nationwide stats to refute, then great. But I have to contend that to end up in serious prison environments, the whole "minor crime" stuff gets greatly exaggerated. To get a real prison sentence it usually has to be a pretty serious felony, violent crime, sex offense, etc. OR, you have a significant record already so you are getting fucked by being a constant thorn in the side of the law. College kids possessing drugs with a nice family, light to no record and ability to retain a decent lawyer, for example, are going to tend to get short local sentences at worst. Usually more like probation, which tons more people get than actual time. They just aren't getting sent to assrape warehouses on the whole. Tons of lesser offenses stem from plea agreements and the person gets a chance to show they can turn it around and not do it again, so even for serious charges you can get leniency if you aren't clearly a die hard criminal. And we don't really have institutions for serious crime and separate ones for lesser crimes. Different security levels in prison and local vs. state/federal incarceration sure. But there really isn't a normal person prison and a hardcore prison. Lots of the people in lighter prison security levels end up there after having served time at a higher level as well.

here are some stats:

in 2004 there were 249,400 state prison inmates serving time for drug offenses.

Among persons convicted of drug felonies in state courts, whites were less likely than African-Americans to be sent to prison. Thirty-three percent (33%) of convicted white defendants received a prison sentence, while 51% of African-American defendants received prison sentences. It should also be noted that Hispanic felons are included in both demographic groups rather than being tracked separately so no separate statistic is available.

Due to harsh new sentencing guidelines, such as 'three-strikes, you're out,' "a disproportionate number of young Black and Hispanic men are likely to be imprisoned for life under scenarios in which they are guilty of little more than a history of untreated addiction and several prior drug-related offenses... States will absorb the staggering cost of not only constructing additional prisons to accommodate increasing numbers of prisoners who will never be released but also warehousing them into old age."

at 40 g's a year each, all of these people in prison for drug related crimes only, which most of us would agree are minor offenses, will cost about 10 billion a year. that's just the drug-related offenses and doesn't include the suggested cost of building new prisons as numbers grow.

[Vvoid]

Originally Posted by Millie

There's a good reason for not counting the voluntarily unemployed in national unemployment statistics. It's because unemployment numbers are supposed to reflect involuntary hardships within the economy. In other words, "This is the percentage of the work-capable and work-willing population unable to find work." That's a much more meaningful indicator of national economic health than "This is the total number of people not working for miscellaneous reasons." There is a crucial and important distinction to be drawn between unemployment (involuntary) and nonemployment (voluntary, retirement, etc.).

Unemployment statistics are less about tracking the unemployed and more about tracking employment opportunities per capita.

I think the thing that people are missing in your text is the "voluntary" part of it. A mother that stays home and takes care of her children isn't unemployed, nor is the trust fund kiddie that doesn't want to give up polo at the club. That's why those people aren't counted, because they aren't even trying to get a job. It isn't just the people that sit on a corner asking for change that have "given up" looking for jobs. Now, are those people on the corner counted? Not sure, and I'm certain that is where a lot of the confusion is coming from, but as far as counting unemployed vs. nonemployed, that's where it makes a big difference. Personally I would (attempt) to count the beggars on the corner in my number, but how do you do so accurately?

[Abysmal]

record their name and ask them if they are employed.

[Tolanin]

these are telephone surveys, not many beggars have phones so its pretty hard to ask them...

Not counting voluntarily unemployed people is necessary. They arent part of the labor force so in terms of unemployment percent they dont even exist. I cant think of to many people who entirely give up getting a job unless they have some other means of supporting themselves or mooching off someone, most of these people dont end up homeless and not looking for a job.