Clinton and Obama

[renaissance]

Originally Posted by Astrocreep

close,it means howard dean is going to get bitch smacked by his party for being a collossal failure. he will be removed by end of the year for creating this mess with the superdelegates, Hilarity and michigan and florida

MI and FL had to be made examples of. Having a 'national primary day' would be totally ridiculous, and would cause a far less rigorous test of the candidates. The contests are spread out in a way which allows the voters to get a long hard look at each potential nominee, and allows each candidate time to make their case in each state. If MI and FL went unpunished for their actions, other states would soon follow suit, and Feb 5th would become a national primary day in the future, which would be detrimental to the candidate selection process. Dean did the right thing by holding them responsible.

Superdelegates are an undemocratic part of the primary process, granted. However, I think the American people are being a bit spoiled even thinking they are entitled to a 'democratic' process in selection of each party's nominee. In many democratic countries, the party leader (candidate) is selected exclusively by 'super delegates'. My point is, the primary elections are not put on by the government. They are creations of political parties, which may as well be corporations. It is understandable though that because the same players have been around so long, that the populace regards them as cultural and social institutions, and a part of the national system of governance. Bottom line is, no American has any 'right' even voting in a 'primary' election, aside from that which is granted to them by the DNC/RNC.

Also, on the subject of Hilary, there are many that would argue that this race lingering on is energizing the Democratic party in places that it wouldn't normally care. The assumption is of course, is that this will carry over to November. Personally I believe that the longer McCain is marginalized in the media by Hillary and Obama, the better. They are building massive household recognized brands, and he is languishing in political obscurity.

[Etoille]

well i was asking because you know she said she was going to fight for people no matter who told her it was stupid. so where is it?

edit: ren is right. and ill spare you my tirade on the falsity behind the use of the word disenfranchisement this time

[TOOL]

Originally Posted by Etoille

wheres that legislation on gas tax relief hillary was talking about?

I think it's hilarious that Clinton is getting all the flak about the gas tax pandering. McCain was the person that came up with the idea a few weeks ago.

[renaissance]

Originally Posted by Astrocreep

democrats are awesome

Yah, they are fucking awesome for aborting that pure failure of a piece of legislation. Clinton and McCain should be fucking ashamed of themselves.

I love how Clinton surrogates are trumpeting, "OMG Obama supported it in the Illinois Senate!!1!". Guess what? He's now against it because it fucking failed. He LEARNED from MISTAKES. The Clinton and McCain campaigns have no excuse for supporting this bullshit concept in the face of a failed model of implementation right in front of them.

Also, I want to ram my yogurt kolbassa up Kiki McLean's oversized, war-torn beaver while wearing an Obama mask.

[Burf]

Originally Posted by renaissance

Also, I want to ram my yogurt kolbassa up Kiki McLean's oversized, war-torn beaver while wearing an Obama mask.

Dude....yuck.

[renaissance]

Originally Posted by Burf

Dude....yuck.

....don't judge me

[spronk]

is kiki the wife or the daughter? both are hot tho

btw gas tax is super fail because oil companies pay the tax at point of origin (refining), its not added at the pump. you can bet your sweet ass that if there was a "tax holiday" prices would drop for a max of a week or two before mysteriously creeping up again due to "insert bullshit reason here", and then of course when the tax comes back prices will jump up 18.4c, because obviously the tax is "back"! This is all ignoring what happens when a commodity in high demand is cut in price of course.

In many ways I'm actually suprised McCain proposing it, if gas creeps close to $5/gallon (pretty much a lock now) by Nov he is really, really fucked. Lets face it, when he starts talking economics he reminds you of your kinda senile uncle who thinks everything still costs a nickle.

[Phelps McManus]

Originally Posted by spronk

btw gas tax is super fail because oil companies pay the tax at point of origin (refining), its not added at the pump. you can bet your sweet ass that if there was a "tax holiday" prices would drop for a max of a week or two before mysteriously creeping up again due to "insert bullshit reason here", and then of course when the tax comes back prices will jump up 18.4c, because obviously the tax is "back"! This is all ignoring what happens when a commodity in high demand is cut in price of course.

What is Obama's plan, a windfall tax? That is even worse.

[renaissance]

How about utilizing American money and ingenuity for developing an energy source worthy of our current technological prowess as a civilization? Running our society on the ancient remains of algae feels very Fred Flintstone in this day and age.

Technologies, both equal and superior, are available right now. It will simply take someone visionary to force us to take the first steps.

I think many people are hoping Obama is this individual. Whether or not they are correct has yet to be seen.

[Arbitrary]

Expand drilling, build additional refineries, standardize fuel production, offer tax incentives to people who drive the most efficient cars, and set stern standards for mileage over the next ten years.

There.

We've increased supply, lowered costs, and made an effort to tackle demand.

[Draegan]

Originally Posted by renaissance

Also, I want to ram my yogurt kolbassa up Kiki McLean's oversized, war-torn beaver while wearing an Obama mask.

I want sloppy fourths. I like em tender.

[Astrocreep]

Originally Posted by Arbitrary

Expand drilling, build additional refineries, standardize fuel production, offer tax incentives to people who drive the most efficient cars, and set stern standards for mileage over the next ten years.

There.

We've increased supply, lowered costs, and made an effort to tackle demand.

cept none of that shit will help matters now, even if the tree fags allowed us to expand drilling and build additional refineries it wouldnt go online for maybe 10 years and how much of an impact would that have on our current usage let alone what it will be like in 10 years? the car companies will only make fuel efficient cars as long as people want them. people still love those monster trucks so they keep chugging them out of the assembly line.it would also take years for an awesome fuel sipping vehicle to hit the streets.

right now we are fucked and there is no silver lining or quick fix to get us out of it.

[Arbitrary]

Yeah, why bother doing anything. It would be a much more efficient use of my time to hunt down defeatists on the internet and murder them.

I could be starting a severed penis collection right now. Fuck.

[Ashes Emberblade]

Jesus.

[Phelps McManus]

Originally Posted by Arbitrary

Expand drilling, build additional refineries, standardize fuel production, offer tax incentives to people who drive the most efficient cars, and set stern standards for mileage over the next ten years.

There.

We've increased supply, lowered costs, and made an effort to tackle demand.

McCain supports extra drilling and Obama does not. I am not sure about refineries and fuel production...

I am pretty sure all candidates share views on hybrids and fuel efficiency, but most of these topics (except drilling, which Obama opposes) are long term goals.

What is Obama doing for prices in the short term? A windfall tax means another leech (the government, yay) on the oil getting from the drill to the pump.